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Thread: Whats going on in Austin?

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by stevefoxsc View Post
    we all knew it was GD as part of the problem, but when you have collegiate legendary talent lik Vince young then ricky williams and cedric benson, colt mc coy. You got golden gooses who save you. Don't get me wrong mac is an okay coach, but hes no saban hes no pete caroll, and give it some time florida will be where urban left off.
    What exactly was it that Greg Davis did wrong? He was the OC from 1998-2010 and the ONLY time there was a serious problem was when Mack made him change from a wide open attack using screens and slants with a gunslinger to a power run offense. The only problem Greg Davis had was Mack trying to make a square peg into a round hole.Greg Davis is arguably the best thing to happen to UT athletics over the last 15 years.

    During his tenure UT went 133-25 (unless me counting in my head at 4am is a little off) while having a devastating offensive attack. What was the biggest issue UT had in 2010? When a spread gunslinger got forced under center? Wow obviously the kid sucked. Oh wait, during the NC game when it was still a wide open offense the kid did PHENOMENAL against Bama. Everything was in place to make 2010 a great year until Mack tried to play OC and took the keys away from the best OC UT has had in a generation.

    Why would you think Muschamp is going to get Florida where Urban Meyer had it? Saying it was players that carried the team for Davis is flat stupid if you're going to say the exact opposite about Muschamp.

    Legendary college players are players that happened to do phenomenal in a system. The QB's flourished under GD's offense because it allowed them to have short high percentage passes and use UT's athletic advantage to turn it into big plays. Spread QB 101

    They go to a pro style offense and all the sudden every QB recruit sucks all at once? Even the #1 player in the country, Case McCoy (sucks), and David Ash (Doesn't). They still have this weird habit of dropping into a shotgun and *gasp* doing well
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  2. #22
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    TL;DR?


    I hate UT but Greg Davis got shafted because Mack forced him to do something he didn't have experience with. Is it logical that every UT QB started sucking all at once, even after performing well on the highest of stages or that the system change forced them to realize that they hadn't recruited for this kind of offense and they found a scape goat to preserve Macks ego?

    GD killed the rest of the country from a spread. Mack took his spread guys and made them into a prostyle and they sucked so obviously GD sucks forever because he had 1 bad season. Lo and behold they bring in prostyle players and they do fantastic. It must have been because GD sucks. Not because these freshman starters are contributing with their skill set.

    /logicrant
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  3. #23
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by Austin109 View Post
    What exactly was it that Greg Davis did wrong? He was the OC from 1998-2010 and the ONLY time there was a serious problem was when Mack made him change from a wide open attack using screens and slants with a gunslinger to a power run offense. The only problem Greg Davis had was Mack trying to make a square peg into a round hole.Greg Davis is arguably the best thing to happen to UT athletics over the last 15 years.

    During his tenure UT went 133-25 (unless me counting in my head at 4am is a little off) while having a devastating offensive attack. What was the biggest issue UT had in 2010? When a spread gunslinger got forced under center? Wow obviously the kid sucked. Oh wait, during the NC game when it was still a wide open offense the kid did PHENOMENAL against Bama. Everything was in place to make 2010 a great year until Mack tried to play OC and took the keys away from the best OC UT has had in a generation.

    Why would you think Muschamp is going to get Florida where Urban Meyer had it? Saying it was players that carried the team for Davis is flat stupid if you're going to say the exact opposite about Muschamp.

    Legendary college players are players that happened to do phenomenal in a system. The QB's flourished under GD's offense because it allowed them to have short high percentage passes and use UT's athletic advantage to turn it into big plays. Spread QB 101

    They go to a pro style offense and all the sudden every QB recruit sucks all at once? Even the #1 player in the country, Case McCoy (sucks), and David Ash (Doesn't). They still have this weird habit of dropping into a shotgun and *gasp* doing well
    look at greg davis record anywhere, it was far from successful, if anything hes always had mac to save him.

    Look at the recruiting when mac came in and tell me the talent pool didn't just jump up it improved, coaching did a bit too.

    And at best the title game against bama only showed that seasoned talent around was able to help him, following that it was considered a rebuilding time, we had young talent all over the place most with entitlement issues.


    As i stated before greg has always had great talent to save him. Hell at tulane he went 14-31 and who helped him at tulane? Brown...
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    I believe ol Mackie recruits OK, but he ain't much coach IMHO. It is easy to recruit at Texas and he has some great assistants.
    This year should be interesting.

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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustangman21 View Post
    if you just said firing Greg Davis was stupid I really have to question your knowledge about football........


    I thought it gas Greg Davis to but when you look at the big picture Greg Davis did win a national championship and play for another with some pretty explosive offenses. What I realize is garret Gilbert was pure trash and he killed Greg Davis. I wish Texas would go back to the spread option pass but we recruited so poorly at qb its not funny. Sherrod Harris was so much better then Gilbert it was not funny. Although I do like harsin he to is working with over hypd over recruited players like mike Davis who is trash like Malcolm brown who is about to get buried behind gray and bergeron I expect brown to e ventually end up UTSA or fb. Although Texas has recruited well on defense and we probably have the best secondary in America next season so we are still there just gotta figure this offense out and pray that brewer is the answer or ash get alot better.


    At the end of the day Texas is still king of all the other colleges in Texas and that will never change. We will beat tech next season and Baylor and also best drug u of ft worth.Also I can sit back and watch the aggies get reamed in the sec. Last time I checked Texas was the last Texas college to either play or win national championship. When is the last time any of the other texas schools even sniffed a championship game its OK ill wait.
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  6. #26
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by GameTyme View Post
    I thought it gas Greg Davis to but when you look at the big picture Greg Davis did win a national championship and play for another with some pretty explosive offenses. What I realize is garret Gilbert was pure trash and he killed Greg Davis. I wish Texas would go back to the spread option pass but we recruited so poorly at qb its not funny. Sherrod Harris was so much better then Gilbert it was not funny. Although I do like harsin he to is working with over hypd over recruited players like mike Davis who is trash like Malcolm brown who is about to get buried behind gray and bergeron I expect brown to e ventually end up UTSA or fb. Although Texas has recruited well on defense and we probably have the best secondary in America next season so we are still there just gotta figure this offense out and pray that brewer is the answer or ash get alot better.


    At the end of the day Texas is still king of all the other colleges in Texas and that will never change. We will beat tech next season and Baylor and also best drug u of ft worth.Also I can sit back and watch the aggies get reamed in the sec. Last time I checked Texas was the last Texas college to either play or win national championship. When is the last time any of the other texas schools even sniffed a championship game its OK ill wait.

    I saw way too many WR screens on 3rd and shorts and goal line situations. I think it was just time to move on from GD. The jury is still out on Harsin for me, I see a lot of "gimmicky" play calls I.E. trick plays. Sure they worked but it's not something you can build on in the future.

    A lot of the problem I see is Mack loves recruiting Texas players (I think are the best on the planet) but.... If you haven't noticed I'd say about 85% of the offenses in Texas are spread. As a former running back I've grown tired of watching this style of play but it is what it is spread em out and throw the rock. It'd be nice to see some High schools go back to the under center approach.

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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by GameTyme View Post
    I thought it gas Greg Davis to but when you look at the big picture Greg Davis did win a national championship and play for another with some pretty explosive offenses. What I realize is garret Gilbert was pure trash and he killed Greg Davis. I wish Texas would go back to the spread option pass but we recruited so poorly at qb its not funny. Sherrod Harris was so much better then Gilbert it was not funny. Although I do like harsin he to is working with over hypd over recruited players like mike Davis who is trash like Malcolm brown who is about to get buried behind gray and bergeron I expect brown to e ventually end up UTSA or fb. Although Texas has recruited well on defense and we probably have the best secondary in America next season so we are still there just gotta figure this offense out and pray that brewer is the answer or ash get alot better.


    At the end of the day Texas is still king of all the other colleges in Texas and that will never change. We will beat tech next season and Baylor and also best drug u of ft worth.Also I can sit back and watch the aggies get reamed in the sec. Last time I checked Texas was the last Texas college to either play or win national championship. When is the last time any of the other texas schools even sniffed a championship game its OK ill wait.
    typical t-shirt trash talk. You will have to wait to see tu in another championship game, that's for sure

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dawg Fan View Post
    typical t-shirt trash talk. You will have to wait to see tu in another championship game, that's for sure
    obligatory 'when was aggy in the NC game?' post.
    This is where you post something no one else cares about.

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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Well, I had a giant post tracking the offensive production based off of personnel and system and the biggest turning point was the spread option transition and the player recruitment that happened subsequently and then I realized - I really don't care.

    Gilbert did just fine in the offense he was recruited for and poorly in the one he wasn't. Same as Ash. Same as Case. Forcing a square peg into a circle hole.

    People can whine about the screens all day long but one thing remain's - when you ran the spread with Davis you were a NC threat. Until you completely transition the offensive personnel you aren't. His offense worked and worked beautifully. That is until Mack said, "I know your average point line in a pro set was only 23-31 ppg and we don't have the players in place, but I don't care. Make it happen. Now. Screw this 39+ ppg bullsh**".
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by BDB View Post
    obligatory 'when was aggy in the NC game?' post.
    better get those t-shirts cleaned, the season is almost among us

  11. #31
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dawg Fan View Post
    better get those t-shirts cleaned, the season is almost among us
    You going to get a new a$m or Tech one this year? One of each, or are you siding with the SEC?

    I always wait until tax-free weekend for the new coach's polo.

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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by pied View Post
    You going to get a new a$m or Tech one this year? One of each, or are you siding with the SEC?

    I always wait until tax-free weekend for the new coach's polo.
    nope keeping the old ones and don't have many of them left. No need for me to spend any more money on any of them, my kids are graduated and the $200,000 dollars spent educating them is plenty IMO. By all means you guys buy em up, walmart needs the revenue

  13. #33
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Vince Young made Greg Davis. Other than that, he's a mediocre OC. I got the feeling most whorn fans were elated to see him go. Me? Disappointed. I was a big fan of their WR bubble screens that rarely worked. Brings back the lulz.
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  14. #34
    All-Universe Austin109's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by yankee View Post
    Vince Young made Greg Davis. Other than that, he's a mediocre OC. I got the feeling most whorn fans were elated to see him go. Me? Disappointed. I was a big fan of their WR bubble screens that rarely worked. Brings back the lulz.
    Lol what? The spread made Davis. Not Young. First year in a shotgun spread emphasis offense they averaged 39ppg with Simms/Applewhite.


    2000 - 35.7ppg Undercenter but spread concept system.
    2001 - 39.7ppg (Bensons first year, 13 total TD's)First season shotgun spread base
    2002 - 34 ppg (Benson 2nd year, 12 total TD's)
    2003 - 38 ppg (Benson 3rd year, 22 TD's)(VY first year)
    2004 - 35 ppg (Benson sr year 20 td's)(VY 2nd year)
    2005 - 50 ppg (VY 3rd year)
    2006 - 36 ppg
    2007 - 38 ppg
    2008 - 39.8 ppg
    2009 - 39.2 ppg
    2010 - 23.75 Year of the scheme change MACK BROWN demanded.

    Yea. Greg Davis was just awful with his spread bullsh**. Averaging 37 ppg including when he was told to do something he was not good at. What a dick. Lets fire him.
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Hum,
    I thought TU or is it ut? Their defense was supposed to be stout. With the points they scored, what happened the last 2 yrs?

  16. #36
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    Fun fact: 2011 28 ppg avg. After 2 years of preparation and firing that crappy GD the Longhorns averaged 5 points more per game. Players had another year under their belts, new players built for the system and they managed 5 whole points. Rad.

    Well in 2010 they decided to make the brilliant move to a power run program without recruiting for it at all. Then throw their OC under the bus to save Mack Browns delicate ego. Because Brown is a good coach and he doesn't make mistakes.

    Fast forward to 2011 and freshmen who are built for the system come in and do well. GASP! Imagine that.

    It's almost like anyone with a lick of sense and forethought would've said "Know whats not a good idea? Burning everything we have right now to prepare for the future."

    I mean seriously.

    QB:
    Gilbert - Spread option nightmare in the air
    Ash - Spread option nightmare on the read
    McCoy - Colts brother?

    RB:
    Fozzy - Wildcat
    Newton - Pure spread RB.
    Only the FB was a consistent threat and built to be an every down back. Weird, power players could play in a power scheme? I'll be damned.

    OL:
    Entirely spread recruited. Fantastic drop back pass pro. Mediocre run blocking. Remember half way through the season everyone was baffled as to why the OL suddenly looked tired and weak? Because they didn't push people out of the way, only diverted them before. Whole new animal.



    THEN ENTER 2011

    QB: Ash, not the best but what you've got because apparently its not worth the scholly to hold onto Gilbert and run the power run out of a heavy shotgun set. Keep Case though, he's a goofy looking guy and I enjoy his pouty face when he throws an INT.

    RB: Brown and Berg. OMG A POWERBACK CAN RUN IN A POWER SYSTEM?!?!?! I thought those words sounded alike but couldn't put my finger on it.

    OL: Imagine that. Train OL to zone block like their spread and it's like magic, they learn to run block. Voodoo/Black magic is involved. F*** this logic bullsh**.


    TL;DR? its Greg Davis fault that Mack decided to have a premature offensive switch without a preparation period. Also its Greg Davis fault that they players weren't in place or even recruited as evidence of the 2009 offensive class of quite literally, all spread scheme players. Its proof how bad Davis was that once they got players into the system, the freshmen were the biggest contributors and that the offense improved a whole 5 ppg.

    Greg Davis single handedly drove UT into oblivion.
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  17. #37
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by Austin109 View Post
    Lol what? The spread made Davis. Not Young. First year in a shotgun spread emphasis offense they averaged 39ppg with Simms/Applewhite.


    2000 - 35.7ppg Undercenter but spread concept system.
    2001 - 39.7ppg (Bensons first year, 13 total TD's)First season shotgun spread base
    2002 - 34 ppg (Benson 2nd year, 12 total TD's)
    2003 - 38 ppg (Benson 3rd year, 22 TD's)(VY first year)
    2004 - 35 ppg (Benson sr year 20 td's)(VY 2nd year)
    2005 - 50 ppg (VY 3rd year)
    2006 - 36 ppg
    2007 - 38 ppg
    2008 - 39.8 ppg
    2009 - 39.2 ppg
    2010 - 23.75 Year of the scheme change MACK BROWN demanded.

    Yea. Greg Davis was just awful with his spread bullsh**. Averaging 37 ppg including when he was told to do something he was not good at. What a dick. Lets fire him.

    I do not see how people can argue with these stats. I know how people with low football IQ. Hey bring up well Texas only won because Vince young well they might be slightly true but if we are going to use that formulanlets do it for everyone. How many rings does petebcarrol get without Reggie bush and matt leinart. How many rings does saban get
    without Ingram and Richardson. Does Michigan win without Charles woodson. We are suppose to blame Greg Davis for Vince young. What about the aggies with Reggie mcneal they had a supieor dual threat qbnothing to show for it. What about Missouri with brad smith another legit dual threat qb. So may e it was more then just Vince young maybe it was that 4th and 1 stop that even gave vince a chance to win it. All I know is that Texas scored alot more points when Greg Davis ran a spread offense. Now I am not saying harsin will not put up points but I do not believe Greg Davis was the problem. Neither that it is our fault Vince Young chose Texas over poor a&m or to go live in the pan handle were michael crabtree was the most overrated wr in football history. Also sorry Vince young decided not togo be a drug dealer at a christian school in ft worth.
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  18. #38
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by GameTyme View Post
    I do not see how people can argue with these stats. I know how people with low football IQ. Hey bring up well Texas only won because Vince young well they might be slightly true but if we are going to use that formulanlets do it for everyone. How many rings does petebcarrol get without Reggie bush and matt leinart. How many rings does saban get
    without Ingram and Richardson. Does Michigan win without Charles woodson. We are suppose to blame Greg Davis for Vince young. What about the aggies with Reggie mcneal they had a supieor dual threat qbnothing to show for it. What about Missouri with brad smith another legit dual threat qb. So may e it was more then just Vince young maybe it was that 4th and 1 stop that even gave vince a chance to win it. All I know is that Texas scored alot more points when Greg Davis ran a spread offense. Now I am not saying harsin will not put up points but I do not believe Greg Davis was the problem. Neither that it is our fault Vince Young chose Texas over poor a&m or to go live in the pan handle were michael crabtree was the most overrated wr in football history. Also sorry Vince young decided not togo be a drug dealer at a christian school in ft worth.
    I think I get what you're saying but I might be wrong. Are you agreeing with me that Greg Davis got the shaft and the way they switched, not necessarily the switch itself, lead to the last 2 seasons poor output?

    I absolutely believe that Fran wasted Reggie McNeal. Look at what happened when a spread guy got a hold of him for half a season (Sumlin) he blew up!

    The aggies have been hamstrung with highly touted coaches trying to run a program built around exact player spec. Similar to UT but not executed right. How many true option QB's are there these days? How about Sherman getting canned before he even had his first class of players he recruited hit their SR year.

    I think Sumlin has the most realistic shot out of the Aggie coaches because 1) his offensive scheme is a very very simple one but looks confusing as hell to defenses. I'm 100% serious when I say its about 15 plays and they will formation/variation/read you to death. 1 of those plays can look like 30 other plays with 1 shift of the LB's, coverage shifts, or audibles.

    Ex: 67 h rocket. 67 = 60 series WR option series, 7 indicates play within playbook, h rocket means RB runs a rocket (angle) instead of defending. 67 h lazer means motion and a swing pass route to the opposite side. Same damn play. 1 player difference. Totally different feel. Not including WR's making down field reads off of DB's.

    Sherman was an adaptable playbook of plays set in stone.
    Fran was an adaptable playbook without any players left that ran that style.
    Sumlin is an adaptable playbook of players that exist and uses the defense scheme against them.
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  19. #39
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by Austin109 View Post
    I think I get what you're saying but I might be wrong. Are you agreeing with me that Greg Davis got the shaft and the way they switched, not necessarily the switch itself, lead to the last 2 seasons poor output?

    I absolutely believe that Fran wasted Reggie McNeal. Look at what happened when a spread guy got a hold of him for half a season (Sumlin) he blew up!

    The aggies have been hamstrung with highly touted coaches trying to run a program built around exact player spec. Similar to UT but not executed right. How many true option QB's are there these days? How about Sherman getting canned before he even had his first class of players he recruited hit their SR year.

    I think Sumlin has the most realistic shot out of the Aggie coaches because 1) his offensive scheme is a very very simple one but looks confusing as hell to defenses. I'm 100% serious when I say its about 15 plays and they will formation/variation/read you to death. 1 of those plays can look like 30 other plays with 1 shift of the LB's, coverage shifts, or audibles.

    Ex: 67 h rocket. 67 = 60 series WR option series, 7 indicates play within playbook, h rocket means RB runs a rocket (angle) instead of defending. 67 h lazer means motion and a swing pass route to the opposite side. Same damn play. 1 player difference. Totally different feel. Not including WR's making down field reads off of DB's.

    Sherman was an adaptable playbook of plays set in stone.
    Fran was an adaptable playbook without any players left that ran that style.
    Sumlin is an adaptable playbook of players that exist and uses the defense scheme against them.

    I am agreeing with on Greg Davis. All he did was average over 30 ppg and have the highest scoring offense in college football history. I liked the idea of trying to change but with the way hs football is played in Texas the kids coming up are just more adapt to a spread offense.
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  20. #40
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    Default Re: Whats going on in Austin?

    Quote Originally Posted by GameTyme View Post
    I am agreeing with on Greg Davis. All he did was average over 30 ppg and have the highest scoring offense in college football history. I liked the idea of trying to change but with the way hs football is played in Texas the kids coming up are just more adapt to a spread offense.
    Haha thank god, I thought I was fighting the world there on that
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