My analysis of these 3 games

[southlake thug]

honestly if anybody but Mcelroy gets 5a player of the year it is a joke and only because a southlake player has gotten it the past 2 years and people are starting to believe it is the system. That kid performed up to all expectations and might have even exceeded them - he has great receivers and a great system but he has to execute. If he doesn't get it -- it will be much like when Jordan got dogged and they gave it to Malone because Jordan had won it so many times.

Wow. Implac - are you alright? I have never heard this kind of banter from you.

[farmerfan]

Are you venturing down to Round Rock Farmer?

I am seriously thinking about it. With Lufkin and SLC being as far away as they are. This game sounds very tempting. Last time I was at a Judson state title game, a state record for most points scored by a winning team was accomplished (only to have our cross town rivals top that record by 1 pt the following year).

[TexasRed6x]

Man it is so tempting to provide u with some inside dish on what publications have already selected Dimitri Nance as player of the year. But they have to wait to the conclusion of the playoffs. Out of respect I cannot divulge any more info untill Saturday night . I'll put it on a bible though.

Horse - Judson fans will never under estimate Trinity period, we know what a talented team you have. Westfield too was loaded, with agreat runningback as well. I have a friend that went to the Tyler/ Trinity game and he even called me when they were playing to tell me how good your team is. Trinity will be favored as you well know, and Judson understands that they are the underdog, again nothing to lose and everything to gain. I for one respect what Trininty has done this year, and thought all along that it would be Trinity and Westfield in the finals, someone just forgot to tell Judson that they were not suppose to win the game, and that is why we play the games.

[implacable44]

Wow. Implac - are you alright? I have never heard this kind of banter from you.

ssshhhhh don't tell the others man - I can't have the SLC faithful knowing that most of the time I just try to get under their skin. the truth is the truth. You can't knock this kid for what he has done. I really hope he gets his offer he wants from Stanford.

[farmerfan]

honestly if anybody but Mcelroy gets 5a player of the year it is a joke and only because a southlake player has gotten it the past 2 years and people are starting to believe it is the system. That kid performed up to all expectations and might have even exceeded them - he has great receivers and a great system but he has to execute. If he doesn't get it -- it will be much like when Jordan got dogged and they gave it to Malone because Jordan had won it so many times.

If ever a year to award Co players of the year this would be it. What Nance and McElroy have done for their respective teams is incredible. Nance is over the 3000 yard mark, something very rarely seen. He has guided his team to a state title game apperance and has yet to be stopped all year.
McElroy is the same way. He has led the machine to another impressive year. His leadership was awesome agaisnt Plano.
Both players are deserving of this award and if ever a co poy was given, this would be the appropriate year to do so.

[TrojanHorse03]

Horse - Judson fans will never under estimate Trinity period, we know what a talented team you have. Westfield too was loaded, with agreat runningback as well. I have a friend that went to the Tyler/ Trinity game and he even called me when they were playing to tell me how good your team is. Trinity will be favored as you well know, and Judson understands that they are the underdog, again nothing to lose and everything to gain. I for one respect what Trininty has done this year, and thought all along that it would be Trinity and Westfield in the finals, someone just forgot to tell Judson that they were not suppose to win the game, and that is why we play the games.

O no doubt, these are 2 of the most respected programs in the state going at it . And I also find this to be the most intriguing matchup of the week. I think all this discussion on Monday is all in fun, outta great anticipation for a great 4 quarter battle worthy of a championship game. I've simply been sparring a bit .

[KaTyTiGeRChIcK07]

OK Lonny. When Katy takes SV down, we don't want to hear from you for those 7 days. DEAL?

Could not agree with you more

[TrojanHorse03]

honestly if anybody but Mcelroy gets 5a player of the year it is a joke and only because a southlake player has gotten it the past 2 years and people are starting to believe it is the system. That kid performed up to all expectations and might have even exceeded them - he has great receivers and a great system but he has to execute. If he doesn't get it -- it will be much like when Jordan got dogged and they gave it to Malone because Jordan had won it so many times.

McElroy is certainly a GREAT player as I have certainly said if this was the Heisman he'd be a lock for New York. But u must admit that Michael Jordan analagy is over the top. 3,000 yds rushing is truly rarified air.

[implacable44]

McElroy is certainly a GREAT player as I have certainly said if this was the Heisman he'd be a lock for New York. But u must admit that Michael Jordan analagy is over the top. 3,000 yds rushing is truly rarified air.

I dont think it is over the top - it wasn't like Malone didn't have a great year. I mean he is probably the best power forward of all time - (debatable) and here we are talking about a guy running behind the "biggest and best O-line" possibly in history but at least definitely since the " 97 Katy team". So how can I not attribute the majority of his success to that o-line ? maybe they should get 5a poy as a unit. 3,000 yards is definitely impressive but according to the Trojan faithful that line makes all the difference.

[bullrock]

Well, football is a team thing. Do you honestly think McElroy could toss for 4,000 plus yards without a good O-line?

[BigFoot]

I am seriously thinking about it. With Lufkin and SLC being as far away as they are. This game sounds very tempting. Last time I was at a Judson state title game, a state record for most points scored by a winning team was accomplished (only to have our cross town rivals top that record by 1 pt the following year).

Post if you are going ...we will look for you....going Friday night ...it is easier on the grandchildren that way.

[implacable44]

Well, football is a team thing. Do you honestly think McElroy could toss for 4,000 plus yards without a good O-line?

nope but i already stated that -- he had great receivers and he has a good o-line that gives him time.

[Slim-Rob]

i can live with 11 turnovers (im sure judson has close to or more than that)

judsons d might be better than trinity's, i havent seen so i dont know.

trinity doesn't really punt at all, so saying they dont punt well is a non-factor.

trinity's special teams has been solid all year. no huge plays (other than when kickoffs go dimitri's way), but not many negative plays either

trinity's D has scored 2 touchdowns of their own, and forced 26 turnovers, which isn't shabby either.

trinity doesnt really kick, but when the kicker is called upon he makes his kicks (1/1!)

you're insulting the haka? what does that have to do with anything once game starts?

finally, judson beat westfield WITHOUT THEIR BEST PLAYER DURING THE SECOND HALF.

why dont you talk up how good judson is instead of trying to bash trinity. people keep overlooking....THEY LOST 4 TIMES THIS YEAR. trinity BARELY lost ONCE. why does that always seem to be forgotten?

He wasn't insulting the haka.

Judson BARELY LOST 4 times. These are the scores: 19-20(Judson leading at half), 7-21(tied at half), 14-23(Judson leading at half), 0-14(no offensive production). You act like Judson got blown out 4 times. Its just like we said last week, it doesn't matter how many losses we had during the season. What matters is that we got in the playoffs and we are now appearing for the 10th time in the 5A State Championship.

Just because you have scored a lot of points all year doesn't mean you will saturday. Talk to Westfield, they know what its like to average 45 ppg and only put up 14 against our D. Copperas Cove averaged 35 ppg and only scored 20. Laredo Nixon averaged 36 ppg and only scored 13. Harlingen averaged 36 ppg and only scored 15. This defense is used to holding high scoring teams to low points. The most points put on the Judson D all year was 28, which was against O'Connor in the 2nd round of the playoffs.

This game will be a close one, and if anyone hasn't decided what game to goto, go to the Judson-Trinity game because its gonna be good.

[farmerfan]

Post if you are going ...we will look for you....going Friday night ...it is easier on the grandchildren that way.

I understand. I will know by friday afternoon. I will let you know once I have made up my mind.

[TrojanHorse03]

I dont think it is over the top - it wasn't like Malone didn't have a great year. I mean he is probably the best power forward of all time - (debatable) and here we are talking about a guy running behind the "biggest and best O-line" possibly in history but at least definitely since the " 97 Katy team". So how can I not attribute the majority of his success to that o-line ? maybe they should get 5a poy as a unit. 3,000 yards is definitely impressive but according to the Trojan faithful that line makes all the difference.

I want to clear up a funny misconception. When people hear the words Trinity o-line they always just assume we have the biggest line in the state, and in many years that be true. But i accessed one of my favorite articles and here's the measurements.

C 6-2 239
ST 5-9 372
SG 6-3 273
QT 5-8 263
QT 6-2 310

The 372 is what really throws it off. To put that in perspective in 2001 it looked like this

C 6-2 262
ST 6-5 315
SG 6-1 285
QG 6-2 285
QT 6-3 330

Basically Trinity has had bigger lines, and other good backs before but what can't be forgot is none of them have ever even come anywhere near 3,000 yds rushing and 40 total touchdowns ! But here's more.
http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/sports/hi...l/13141312.htm

Said Trinity coach Steve Lineweaver: "Under the radar is not anymore. We have a very good line, but he has really good vision and good balance. We go into scrimmages with ourselves in the spring. When Dimitri's in there, those things go 60 [yards]; when some of the other guys are in there, they go six with the same blocking."

The size of the offensive line is a knock on the Trojans backs. It averages about 290 pounds per man, but a good running back must still find and read the holes.

"Once they get past the line of scrimmage, that line ain't going 10 yards down the field," said South Grand Prairie coach David Fisher, whose team beat Trinity but gave up 228 yards to Nance. "At that point, a back's instincts take over. Nance has the ability to run over people, around people, by people.

"He finishes everything he runs. There may be times around the goal line when you have a guy in position and he just runs through them. You can't coach that, you're either a physical guy with that mentality or you're not."

IN THE KNOW

A measure of his talent

How Dimitri Nance's rushing totals this season compare with statistics for the 11 running backs in the Star-Telegram preseason State 100 recruiting list:


Player, School (where committed) Ht. Wt. Car. Yds. TDs
Dimitri Nance, Trinity 5-10 195 203 2,134 30
Jamaal Evans, Irving 5-9 175 264 1,793 12
Baron Batch, Midland (Texas Tech) 5-10 170 184 1,591 21
Antwan Cobb, Pflugerville 6-0 200 162 1,372 10
Derke Robinson, Hebron (Texas) 6-1 205 163 1,298 12
Vondrell McGee, Longview, (Texas) 5-9 180 144 1,235 16
Emmanuel Moody, Coppell (Texas) 6-1 195 169 1,141 14
Trent Hines, Midland Lee, (Texas A&M) 6-2 205 174 987 10
Michael Goodson, Klein Collins, (Okla. St.) 6-0 195 99 973 8
Donte Bean, North Garland 5-9 180 191 968 12
Cornell Tarrant, Dallas Samuel 5-11 185 129 587 7
Latreal Cooper, Cuero, (Texas A&M) 6-2 200 72 347 8

[theloneranger]

I want to clear up a funny misconception. When people hear the words Trinity o-line they always just assume we have the biggest line in the state, and in many years that be true. But i accessed one of my favorite articles and here's the measurements.

C 6-2 239
ST 5-9 372
SG 6-3 273
QT 5-8 263
QT 6-2 310

The 372 is what really throws it off. To put that in perspective in 2001 it looked like this

C 6-2 262
ST 6-5 315
SG 6-1 285
QG 6-2 285
QT 6-3 330

Basically Trinity has had bigger lines, and other good backs before but what can't be forgot is no one has every even come anywhere near 3,000 yds rushing and 40 total touchdowns ! But here's more.
http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/sports/hi...l/13141312.htm

Said Trinity coach Steve Lineweaver: "Under the radar is not anymore. We have a very good line, but he has really good vision and good balance. We go into scrimmages with ourselves in the spring. When Dimitri's in there, those things go 60 [yards]; when some of the other guys are in there, they go six with the same blocking."

The size of the offensive line is a knock on the Trojans backs. It averages about 290 pounds per man, but a good running back must still find and read the holes.

"Once they get past the line of scrimmage, that line ain't going 10 yards down the field," said South Grand Prairie coach David Fisher, whose team beat Trinity but gave up 228 yards to Nance. "At that point, a back's instincts take over. Nance has the ability to run over people, around people, by people.

"He finishes everything he runs. There may be times around the goal line when you have a guy in position and he just runs through them. You can't coach that, you're either a physical guy with that mentality or you're not."

IN THE KNOW

A measure of his talent

How Dimitri Nance's rushing totals this season compare with statistics for the 11 running backs in the Star-Telegram preseason State 100 recruiting list:


Player, School (where committed) Ht. Wt. Car. Yds. TDs
Dimitri Nance, Trinity 5-10 195 203 2,134 30
Jamaal Evans, Irving 5-9 175 264 1,793 12
Baron Batch, Midland (Texas Tech) 5-10 170 184 1,591 21
Antwan Cobb, Pflugerville 6-0 200 162 1,372 10
Derke Robinson, Hebron (Texas) 6-1 205 163 1,298 12
Vondrell McGee, Longview, (Texas) 5-9 180 144 1,235 16
Emmanuel Moody, Coppell (Texas) 6-1 195 169 1,141 14
Trent Hines, Midland Lee, (Texas A&M) 6-2 205 174 987 10
Michael Goodson, Klein Collins, (Okla. St.) 6-0 195 99 973 8
Donte Bean, North Garland 5-9 180 191 968 12
Cornell Tarrant, Dallas Samuel 5-11 185 129 587 7
Latreal Cooper, Cuero, (Texas A&M) 6-2 200 72 347 8

Damn Trojan..........thats a pretty impressive post . Well just have to see what lonny has to say when gets back to the boards.

[nathan00427]

I dont think it is over the top - it wasn't like Malone didn't have a great year. I mean he is probably the best power forward of all time - (debatable) and here we are talking about a guy running behind the "biggest and best O-line" possibly in history but at least definitely since the " 97 Katy team". So how can I not attribute the majority of his success to that o-line ? maybe they should get 5a poy as a unit. 3,000 yards is definitely impressive but according to the Trojan faithful that line makes all the difference.

i've watched 8 or 9 of trinitys games this year, and it is a combination of the line and dimitri.

like, the line generally gets him to the linebackers/secondary untouched, but not a whole lot after that. dimitri has made a lot of these incredible runs on his own, by juking or running over linebackers and members of the secondary. if he was an average back, he'd get about 5 yards per carry. hes phenomenal though, so hes getting around 10. hes very deserving (along with mcelroy) for at least a share of the 5a player of the year award.

[drgnbkr]

ssshhhhh don't tell the others man - I can't have the SLC faithful knowing that most of the time I just try to get under their skin. the truth is the truth. You can't knock this kid for what he has done. I really hope he gets his offer he wants from Stanford.

Nobody can handle the truth! Did'nt you hear Jack Nicholson?..

[lonny23]

I dont know where you are getting this slow start stuff from. Since the I-Mac game, Trinity has scored a TD on its first possesion of each game except last week. Trinity has a very difficult ground game to contain. They do not rely on the big play, rather they just move their way down field chipping away with runs of 3 yards then 5 yards then 4 yards then 7 yards then a 10 yard run followed by another 5 yard run followed by another 10-15 yard run then they will hit you with the play action followed by a TD. This offense is very difficult to contain for 48 mins. They are going to get their points and they are going to get their yards. SGP has every bit as good a defense as Judson has and Trinity still rushed for over 300 yards on them and scored 28 points. That was probably the worst offensive game Trinity has played all year and they still moved the ball well and scored points. Against I-Mac they had at least 2 chances to score but didnt, one was a dropped pass on a trick play and the other was at the end of the game when Coach Lineweaver took a knee inside I-Mac's 5 yard line.
I love your homersim Lonny, but you sound like a fool to say Trinity will only score 7 pts, you have not seen them play once. All you have to go on is what other people post as well as newspaper clippings. I think a lot of your information is skewed. Im not saying Trinity will blow Judson out, but I can honestly say Judson will not hold Trinity to under 200 yards rushing. If you think you have them beat by stopping the running game, then you are in for a surprise. Vittatoe can beat you with his arm. He has not needed it as much this year as he did last year, but he is still very dangerous. Trinity has a great TE and some very big athletic receivers, Judson will get lulled into the PA and Vittatoe will bust a big one on the Rockets this week.
This running game is the cloeset thing to 96 Lewisville as I have seen. I firmly believe it can't be stopped.
Also Trinity only does have 11 turnoves on the year.

Slow start was not meant to be whether they scored first or not. I was just saying their play in the first half doesn't match some of the 2nd half efforts. You want to play good after halftime, but they've needed it a fair number of times.

Maybe they can't be stopped. I think Judson has a better defense than SGP. It wasn't an accident they held that Westfield bunch to almost 300 yards under their average. Westfield scored a lot this year in many ways and got 7 off of their offense and 7 more on a punt return that should've never counted because of a clip.

[lonny23]

Exactly, get where the blindfolded in a minefield analogy comes from. There's nothing wrong with saying u think ur team is going to win or what score, just dont claim u came to this conclusion based on a accurated analysis of the numbers. Just say u think *JUDSON IS REALLY AWESOME* and you'll actually come off better.

You're right it's much more than numbers. I'm trying to use as many resources as I can. That's hard when you're stuck over here and can't even watch videos. I reported what I felt like the stats told me.