Down Programs?

[dogsntigers]

I saw another post earlier about Temple and it made me think. What happened to the Lewisville and Flower Mound Marcus programs? I can't remember their names...but Flower Mound had some very good QB's back then. I think Spencer Stack maybe was one?

[CoppellCowboy57]

I dont know Lewisville used to have a very strong program, and I know when Coppell Plays them they come to play....

The other schools i dont know much about except that I used to be in the disrict two years ago...and we always ended up beating them...

[DrEdward]

I think one of the principal factors occuring in both Lewisville and Flower Mound is the opening of new schools. In the case of Marcus, Flower Mound High School opened up; in the case of Lewisville, Hebron opened. In both situations, talent which might otherwise have gone to the established schools, ended up at on eof the newer ones.

[rancher52]

I saw another post earlier about Temple and it made me think. What happened to the Lewisville and Flower Mound Marcus programs? I can't remember their names...but Flower Mound had some very good QB's back then. I think Spencer Stack maybe was one?
They definitely were strong programs during the 90's. Lewisville won 5A championships in 93 & 96. Marcus lost in the state title game in 95 and won in 97. Both programs were very successful. Another great QB statistically was Chris Sanders at Marcus and they had a hell of a linebacker in David Ellen. Like Dr Ed said the expansion with FM High and Hebron not only diluted the football gene pool, so to speak, but it also changed how the feeder schools routed kids to the respective high schools.

[LP-79]

I think it all goes in cycles. Teams like Temple etc. were powerhouses for several years. Now teams like SLC, lufkin, SV always seem to be the ones to beat. Coaches change, less talented or not as motivated players come thru system then you go down. It is like anything else, it is a long hard fight to get to be the best, but it is even harder to stay there. Who knows in ten years we might be posting about how hard it is to beat Laredo united.

[HebronHawk]

I think one of the principal factors occuring in both Lewisville and Flower Mound is the opening of new schools. In the case of Marcus, Flower Mound High School opened up; in the case of Lewisville, Hebron opened. In both situations, talent which might otherwise have gone to the established schools, ended up at on eof the newer ones.

Hebron didn't pull any players from Lewisville but we did pull a lot of their coaching talent.

Hebron's players all came from The Colony's attendance zone.

Lewisville is having trouble getting their participation numbers up as their attendance zone gets more Hispanic.

[DrEdward]

Hebron didn't pull any players from Lewisville but we did pull a lot of their coaching talent.

Hebron's players all came from The Colony's attendance zone.

Lewisville is having trouble getting their participation numbers up as their attendance zone gets more Hispanic.

My mistake, but aren't you guys in the Lewisville ISD as well? By the way, did I see you were from Richmond?

[farmerfan]

As easy as it would be to blame the demographics of our community, it also has a lot to do with talent. Sure LHS is becoming more and more hispanic but we still have a fair share of white and black athletes to be competitive. The main issue with us is how we seem to get smaller and smaller in as far as physical size is concerned. We lost some great coaches too. After 01 we lost OC Bill Petrosky to retirement as well as Brazil when Hebron opened up, we tended to lose a few coaches a year during the 90's. With that said the attitude of the kids also has a lot to do with it. It used to mean something to represent Big John and wear maroon and white, now it does not mean near as much. Also, during the 90's the "Flowerplex" experienced a lot of growth. The population of Lewisville went from roughly 30,000 in 1990 to 85,000 by 2000, Flower Mound went up from 15,000 to nearly 60,000. In Lewisville a lot of that growth has graduated and in Flower Mound it is split up between FMHS and Marcus.
Like Lewisville, Marcus lost a lot of good coaches too. Cody Vanderford took over the HC job at FMHS, Chris Cunningham left for Heritage, Kevin Atkinson left for Denton Ryan and then went to Keller. Que Brittin never played into the politics of the booster club at Marcus and I know of a family that played a major roll in getting rid of Coach Brttain.
Marcus and FMHS have been competive the last few years and will see a break through eventually and Lewisville has been young the last few years. Last year Lewisville took somewhat of hte Plano route and played many sophmores on varsity. They improved every week of the year but then again with the season we had the only way to go is up.
Right now what Hebron is benefitting from is the same thing that led to the success of both Lewisville and Marcus during the 90's, they have the perfect community in which to draw kids from. A lot of middle class and a lot of great athletes are in that area.
Lewisville is switching to more of a spread attack this year from what I have heard and I know of a freshman named Jordon Dotson (I played baseball with his brother about 15 years ago) who is thought very highly of.
Marcus and Lewisville will probably never experience a run like they enjoyed in the 90's but if we can get the attitudes right on some of these kids we definitely could see a return to the playoffs in the near future.

[farmerfan]

My mistake, but aren't you guys in the Lewisville ISD as well? By the way, did I see you were from Richmond?

Hebron is in the LISD in North Carrollton.

[dogsntigers]

I can see where the opening up of new schools could have some effect. But it can't be reason everywhere. Look at Katy for example. This place has exploded with growth. Cinco Ranch,Morton Ranch and now ( although they will compete at 4a to start off ) Seven Lakes High and Katy continues to win year in and out without the best talent. Just some thoughts to throw out there.

[farmerfan]

I can see where the opening up of new schools could have some effect. But it can't be reason everywhere. Look at Katy for example. This place has exploded with growth. Cinco Ranch,Morton Ranch and now ( although they will compete at 4a to start off ) Seven Lakes High and Katy continues to win year in and out without the best talent. Just some thoughts to throw out there.

As much as I stated and others did that new schools had some effect. We all made it clear that losing some top notch coaches really hurt both programs. Marcus has a whole new staff in place from the days of Coach Brittan and his aerial attack. Lewisville also has a whole new staff. I dont know how the Katy ISD does it but in the LISD when a new school opens they promote from within the district. In 1985 when both Marcus and The Colony started playing football both head coaches came from the Staff of Neil Wilson and Lewisville. When FMHS opened half their coaches and the HC came from Marcus. When Hebron opened half their coaches came from Lewisville with some more coming in from The Colony and their HC was former DC at Lewisville. I dont know if Katy ever had a problem under Coach Johnston with losing some great assistants and if not that is a credit to the program and the man himself. But that is what happend here.
Also I know of some things that went on in the Marcus program that I would rather keep in a PM. If you are interested then let me know and I will fill you in.

[pack0808]

I can see where the opening up of new schools could have some effect. But it can't be reason everywhere. Look at Katy for example. This place has exploded with growth. Cinco Ranch,Morton Ranch and now ( although they will compete at 4a to start off ) Seven Lakes High and Katy continues to win year in and out without the best talent. Just some thoughts to throw out there.


The towns that boom have no choice but to split or they would have 10,000 plus highschools. Most of these schools like Katy still have a bigger enrollment to choose from then a 1 town school like Lufkin or SLC. Katy still has over 3,000 I believe while Lufkin and SLC have 2,400. I am not sure on the Farmers enrollment I would have to look?

[johntylerfan]

This thread peaked my interest. I guess I will tell ya'll what happen here in Tyler with JT's decline during the early 2000's. When wilson was here in his twiligt years at JT, kids in Tyler were starting to get tired of the wing-T/cutback and some skill players went off to REL. But that was not what led to our decline directly. There is a ruling left over from th integration period called M/M transfer rules and papers. Kids used this rule to go to REL. Couple this trend with Wilson leaving JT at a late date and hiring a MORON spelled disaster. Alot led to JT going down hard in the early 2000s. I also believe that JT's cycle was ending on the Wilson era. JT still had talent but not like it used to be and the teams in our district were in full upswing. LP, REL, and LV were having some of the best years of their programs history. We could still compete but bad coaching made a bad situation alot worse. Kids stop coming out for JT. Our numbers went into the toilet. The kids at JT HATED Ratliff and wanted him gone, and they would never put out for him. Ratliff alienated alot people and players. His style was just not clicking at all at JT. The losts started to mount and it just collapsed. JT went 3 straight years without winning a district game! That is a travesty!!! This is home to the great CUJO tradition. Our fan support went from 8,000 to 10,000 a game to less than 1,000 a game. It was a very bad time for JT. JT finally got out of the nightmare last year and did a great job. JT is now back and will become a great probgram again under Brooks. This man is doing an ABSOLUTELY UNREAL job at JT. Some people said JT didn't have talent during that time period. That is partly BS!! JT had talent but no direction and alot of turmoil in the lockerroom and coaching. REL is not to blame for JT's decline but bad coaching and leadership did us in. People have to always remember to enjoy the good times because they will not always be. Programs run in cycles and you will have bad seasons. It is only natural. You will not be king forever. The only thing you really can do is just keep supporting your kids and things will turn around.

[dogsntigers]

I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers up there in the metroplex...the Temple post just made me think of Marcus and Lewisville as i have always liked to see them play and do well. Whatever happend to those QB's at Marcus?

JT Fan how do you see the growth of Tyler affecting the surrounding towns such as Chapel Hill and Whitehouse etc? Moving to Tyler/Whitehouse area at the end of the summer.

[HebronHawk89]

I think one of the principal factors occuring in both Lewisville and Flower Mound is the opening of new schools. In the case of Marcus, Flower Mound High School opened up; in the case of Lewisville, Hebron opened. In both situations, talent which might otherwise have gone to the established schools, ended up at on eof the newer ones.

Actually we stole the talent from the colony. most of us would have ended up there and not lewisville.

[johntylerfan]

All the growth in Tyler is on the southside. TISD is going to have a big problem with that growth because Tyler is now infringing on Bullard, whitehouse, and Chapel Hill. Tyler will propably need another high school in the next 5 years but where to put it will be extremely difficult. REL is overcrowded right now and they will have serious problems in the next few dealing with that many kids IMO. The private schools in the Tyler area are growing at a fast rate. JT's numbers are stable and they will propably be around 2,200 in the fall. REL will between 2,500 to 2,600. I have no clue how Tyler is going to handle this future problem because REL is almost land-locked and the property rate around the school is sky high. They sent all New Orleans kids to JT because REL didn't have space to hold them.

[farmerfan]

I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers up there in the metroplex...the Temple post just made me think of Marcus and Lewisville as i have always liked to see them play and do well. Whatever happend to those QB's at Marcus?
JT Fan how do you see the growth of Tyler affecting the surrounding towns such as Chapel Hill and Whitehouse etc? Moving to Tyler/Whitehouse area at the end of the summer.


Dos
Chris Sanders went to SMU then transfered to Tennessee Chattanooga. He set some school records at Chattanooga and had a short stint with the Tennessee Titans during the preseason a few years ago.
Spencer Stack went to UNT and I believe never got the chance to play. I dont know what either of those kids are doing now but I assume they are doing great as they were both great kids and came from great families.
You are not ruffling any feathers, what it all comes down to is accepting the fact that right now we are not very good and it seems as if the players at both Lewisville and Marcus have lacked that fire they once had and that has a lot to do with coaches in the program and coaches you lose in the programs.

[farmerfan]

The towns that boom have no choice but to split or they would have 10,000 plus highschools. Most of these schools like Katy still have a bigger enrollment to choose from then a 1 town school like Lufkin or SLC. Katy still has over 3,000 I believe while Lufkin and SLC have 2,400. I am not sure on the Farmers enrollment I would have to look?

Pack
We are around 3000 I believe. Right now we are probably at 60% Hispanic as opposed to being around 20% hispanic just 10 years ago. I know my old neighborhood in Lewisville has changed a ton since I moved out 6 years ago. We lost a lot of the athletes we drew from which were in the Forrest Wood Middle School zone when they switched zones and moved those kids to FMHS back in 2000. We are still big enough where we should be better than 1-9 and I dont want to use the demographics as a excuse, but its just the athletes are not there like the yused to be and anyone who has witnessed us play the last 3 years will tell you that.

[HebronHawk]

My mistake, but aren't you guys in the Lewisville ISD as well? By the way, did I see you were from Richmond?

Yes, Hebron is in the Lewisville ISD as is The Colony. I was born in Richmond, VA.