Tenth Garland HS player signs

[grayowl60]

All district LB Cedric Washington signed with Southwestern Oklahoma State. Four Garland players have signed to play DI football.
According to the Garland Owls Football newsletter, thats 52 football scholarships to play football in four years, eighteen DI, and five more are expected to sign before the end of spring.
Ninety Owl players have recieved football scholarships in the last nine years!

[garlandowl08]

Thanks for the info! That is great news. Hopefully all of the signees will stay healthy and get a good education!

[Roughrider]

All district LB Cedric Washington signed with Southwestern Oklahoma State. Four Garland players have signed to play DI football.
According to the Garland Owls Football newsletter, thats 52 football scholarships to play football in four years, eighteen DI, and five more are expected to sign before the end of spring.
Ninety Owl players have recieved football scholarships in the last nine years!

Yeah and some are back home writing poetry!!:D

[GoOwls]

Yeah and some are back home writing poetry!!:D

Well, at least they can write. It's an upgrade from the TDC......right Rough? :D

[Roughrider]

Well, at least they can write. It's an upgrade from the TDC......right Rough? :D

You are right, that is an impressive accomlishment :eek:

[GoOwls]

You are right, that is an impressive accomlishment :eek:

Yep, when we get tired of looking at all those trophies, we actually encourage the kids to pick up a book or two.......of course, we don't want them to hold it too long, might ruin their grip on the ball. First things first...right? :D

How's the band?:D

[Roughrider]

Yep, when we get tired of looking at all those trophies, we actually encourage the kids to pick up a book or two.......of course, we don't want them to hold it too long, might ruin their grip on the ball. First things first...right? :D

How's the band?:D

Only problem is, they are holding old dusty trophies... Living off the past again... You better remind your boy, boasting about 90 signed scholarships in 9 years with one state title, well that's not a positive for the staff.. What's the deepest round made (outside of the state year in 99), last years third?? All that college level talent in the last 9 years and you have one title and a third round finish??

[GoOwls]

Only problem is, they are holding old dusty trophies... Living off the past again... You better remind your boy, boasting about 90 signed scholarships in 9 years with one state title, well that's not a positive for the staff.. What's the deepest round made (outside of the state year in 99), last years third?? All that college level talent in the last 9 years and you have one title and a third round finish??'

OK Rough, if you want to be half-way serious for a minute, we can be. Is the important thing the state trophies or the 90 scholarships? I say the 90 scholarships. That's, by your own definition, for the most part, 90 kids that are given a chance to improve themselves that they otherwise wouldn't be able to afford. Most of the kids at Garland who win scholarships are fairly poor, or not wealthy enough to afford 4 years at a major university, or still live in a community where academic advancement is still somewhat stigmatized or not a high priority of the parents. That's 90 kids I may not have to worry if they are gonna break into my house and steal my stuff, or hurt my family. Sure, the titles are great, but I have always taken pride in the fact that Joe Martin, first, and now Jordan are the kind of coaches that put an emphasis on getting in contact with college coaches and doing all they can to showcase their kids and get them into colleges with at least some kind or level of financial help.....that they really seem to care if these kids advance further.

Our on the field record is fantastic, over the years. 4 titles in 5 tries, pretty good stuff. Do we go out in round 1 more often that we would want to, yes, but then all we have to do is remember the 80's or look at the histories of all the other teams in the district, and we can fell pretty good about a first round exit, we remember the bad times and we see out fellow Garlandites at other schools living it every year.

There isn't much dust on last years District, Bi-District or Area trophies, we can still enjoy them, by your standards, and the fact that 10 kids have a chance to improve themselves that most kids at your school will get whether they are successful at atheltics or not.

Later Rough.:)

[grayowl60]

The Garland coaching staffs job (like in many others schools) includes:Keep em in school, get em to school, get em to class, get the schoolwork done, get em graduated, get em to practice, keep em motivated. THEN get in the playoffs, get to state. And get em in college. In these areas the Garland High School coaching staff is among the best in Texas.

[dominoeplayer]

The Garland coaching staffs job (like in many others schools) includes:Keep em in school, get em to school, get em to class, get the schoolwork done, get em graduated, get em to practice, keep em motivated. THEN get in the playoffs, get to state. And get em in college. In these areas the Garland High School coaching staff is among the best in Texas.

You left one of their major tasks off! Bailing them out of jail! At least that is what Rough might say.

[Owls06]

You left one of their major tasks off! Bailing them out of jail! At least that is what Rough might say.

Dude, that was a lame attempt at being funny. Can't really even make a joke about it since it has never happened and I highly doubt you can substantiate it.

[OWLBAIT]

Only problem is, they are holding old dusty trophies... Living off the past again... You better remind your boy, boasting about 90 signed scholarships in 9 years with one state title, well that's not a positive for the staff.. What's the deepest round made (outside of the state year in 99), last years third?? All that college level talent in the last 9 years and you have one title and a third round finish??
It is in fact a big positive for the staff. Kids know that if they go to Garland High School, not only will they consistently play in bigger games and on better teams than any other Garland school, but they will also have a better chance at receiving a college scholarship. Pretty big positive in a district that has choice. Any parent would want to send their kid somewhere that has a successful program that works hard for kids.

[KLH75287]

What Texas H.S. had the most signees? Where can I find a list of who went where from where?

GO PACK IN '06

[garlandowl08]

Dude, that was a lame attempt at being funny. Can't really even make a joke about it since it has never happened and I highly doubt you can substantiate it.

I'm pretty sure you're missing the long-running joke that roughy has been trying to make. Garland players are a bunch of thugs...haha. No one's serious.

[GTown02]

I'm pretty sure you're missing the long-running joke that roughy has been trying to make. Garland players are a bunch of thugs...haha. No one's serious.
Like Rough has said... we are a stepping stone for the TDC! I was "| |" that close to getting there too! ;)

[Roughrider]

It is in fact a big positive for the staff. Kids know that if they go to Garland High School, not only will they consistently play in bigger games and on better teams than any other Garland school, but they will also have a better chance at receiving a college scholarship. Pretty big positive in a district that has choice. Any parent would want to send their kid somewhere that has a successful program that works hard for kids.

You had better watch out making that kind of statement... Your oldest rivals have a coach that's only been around 4 years and has a very impressive record of getting kids to college. I believe I read where he's gotten 25 or so in his 4 short years and that's after bringing back a program to the top of the district.... He's beat Garland 2 of his 4 years and take away his first year (figuring out what he had and weeding out he still got them to 5-5). I think the students of GISD have got more than the ollies to choose from!! On top of that, the offense they run is more suited to the college game (multiple receiver sets) than a stacked backfield out of a wing formation. When a receiver comes from that type of offense it shows his true skills (route running and playmaking) not relying on a linebacker or saftey to bite on a playaction to get open...

[sgfantoo]

You had better watch out making that kind of statement... Your oldest rivals have a coach that's only been around 4 years and has a very impressive record of getting kids to college. I believe I read where he's gotten 25 or so in his 4 short years and that's after bringing back a program to the top of the district.... He's beat Garland 2 of his 4 years and take away his first year (figuring out what he had and weeding out he still got them to 5-5). I think the students of GISD have got more than the ollies to choose from!! On top of that, the offense they run is more suited to the college game (multiple receiver sets) than a stacked backfield out of a wing formation. When a receiver comes from that type of offense it shows his true skills (route running and playmaking) not relying on a linebacker or saftey to bite on a playaction to get open...

Roughrider has it right. Moss did this at SG with GISD working against him. If SG ever challenges GHS for top spot, Moss better watch out.

[GoOwls]

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

You South Garland conspiracy theorists crack me up.

Does Homer favor GHS, sure, no doubt, he has history there way back before there was ever a second school in Garland. Don't blame him for his humanity and being a fan. However, to think he wishes ill against other Garland school is just silly. He wouldn't have hired Moss if he didn't think he could help the program and do more with the talent at hand. I guarantee Homer was one of the most happy guys in the stadium during Souths two playoff wins. To think otherwise of the man shows you don't know him or anything about him. He is a treasure and when he finally goes, the heart and soul of city of Garland football goes with him. You won't ever be able to find someone who will live and die to make Garland athletics as good as can be. We will not find such a prudent caretaker of our treasure again.

[OWLBAIT]

You had better watch out making that kind of statement... Your oldest rivals have a coach that's only been around 4 years and has a very impressive record of getting kids to college. I believe I read where he's gotten 25 or so in his 4 short years and that's after bringing back a program to the top of the district.... He's beat Garland 2 of his 4 years and take away his first year (figuring out what he had and weeding out he still got them to 5-5). I think the students of GISD have got more than the ollies to choose from!! On top of that, the offense they run is more suited to the college game (multiple receiver sets) than a stacked backfield out of a wing formation. When a receiver comes from that type of offense it shows his true skills (route running and playmaking) not relying on a linebacker or saftey to bite on a playaction to get open...Don't think my statement is a stretch whatsoever. With the perfect scheme showing the true skills of the players and a perfect coach, South has placed 25 kids in 4 years. Not bad. Coach Moss does a really good job over there. In that same time span, Garland has placed 53 kids, with an outdated offense and coaches that don't stand up to the quality of South's. Something just doesn't jive here. Coach Jordan and his staff do a great job as well. Maybe you need to stop looking through those "Rough" colored glasses.

[sgfantoo]

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

You South Garland conspiracy theorists crack me up.

Does Homer favor GHS, sure, no doubt, he has history there way back before there was ever a second school in Garland. Don't blame him for his humanity and being a fan. However, to think he wishes ill against other Garland school is just silly. He wouldn't have hired Moss if he didn't think he could help the program and do more with the talent at hand. I guarantee Homer was one of the most happy guys in the stadium during Souths two playoff wins. To think otherwise of the man shows you don't know him or anything about him. He is a treasure and when he finally goes, the heart and soul of city of Garland football goes with him. You won't ever be able to find someone who will live and die to make Garland athletics as good as can be. We will not find such a prudent caretaker of our treasure again.

As long as SG's success does not hinder GHS' success, Homer has nor problem. If SG had gone a couple of games deeper, or in a rematch beat GHS, and does this for several years, Moss will be in trouble.

No doubt Homer had the biggest grin from ear to ear at Texas Stadium and the next week as both GHS and SG were respectable in their losses. As long as SG and GHS are complimentary goods he will be happy. When they are competing, as you say so yourself, Homer will unbiasedly be a GHSer. The problem with that is he should be able to put his humanity on the shelf and not favor one school over another.

I find the remarks that Johnson made to the media concerning Ronnie Thompsons hiring in PA. Johnson admits that the community bias toward GHS football. It was not alwasy like that through the eighties.

Face it, Homer wants GHS there every year. He wants the other schools to share in the playoffs. Homer's next goal will be to bring back NF but not taking GHS out of the playoffs. SG can go. Rowlett can go. But not GHS

[GoOwls]

As long as SG's success does not hinder GHS' success, Homer has nor problem. If SG had gone a couple of games deeper, or in a rematch beat GHS, and does this for several years, Moss will be in trouble.

No doubt Homer had the biggest grin from ear to ear at Texas Stadium and the next week as both GHS and SG were respectable in their losses. As long as SG and GHS are complimentary goods he will be happy. When they are competing, as you say so yourself, Homer will unbiasedly be a GHSer. The problem with that is he should be able to put his humanity on the shelf and not favor one school over another.

I find the remarks that Johnson made to the media concerning Ronnie Thompsons hiring in PA. Johnson admits that the community bias toward GHS football. It was not alwasy like that through the eighties.

Face it, Homer wants GHS there every year. He wants the other schools to share in the playoffs. Homer's next goal will be to bring back NF but not taking GHS out of the playoffs. SG can go. Rowlett can go. But not GHS

No offense intended, but I think you are looking at the district from SGHS colored glasses. There isn't someone behind the grassy knoll, at least not in this case. Are you telling me Paul Taglibue, the commish. of the NFL, doesnt' have a favorite team? Sure he does. On game night, Homer is a private citizen and can cheer for who he pleases. I'm assuming you have never seen him on the job for any period of time. If you had, you would know he operates for the general success of the district. He couldn't have kept hi job that long if he didn't. There would be a public outcry. As it is, I only hear the complaints of a couple of folks on an internet website who are obviously hardcore fans with an aganda. Not exactly the most fair and balanced judges of the situation.

Just remember, he hired Tommy Watkins and James Rust and a few others who had won state championships at smaller classifications at placed them at other schools, while Garland, with the exception of Chuck Curtis in 1963, never has had a coach hired by Homer who had a state championship on his resume before his tenure at GHS. Jordan doesn't count as he was already there and was an assistant when they won the championship.

To accuse a work-a-day bias shows ignorance of the facts, in my opinion.

[Roughrider]

You are crazy!! No offense intended.... You coached the only team in the district back in the day and have been AD from infancy to where it is today.. He bleeds black and gold and that is a fact... How many other schools have gotten the baseball facility that is being built over by Williams??? Especially for a program that is "poor" to say the least!! Heard they were just making some more room for football practice fields?? Read the article mentioned above about Port Arthur and Ronnie Thompson, Homer says it all with his quotes.. There is no disputing his feelings and where his priorities exist.
There are just a few on the website because the majority of parents and what not don't cruise the boards. They've actually got things to do!!

[GoOwls]

I notice you didn't argue the point I made on the coaches. If he was so interested in Garland, he would have given Garland one of those coaches instead of some of the jokes we've had in the 70's and 80's. He went out of his way to give the other schools championship coaches so people like you wouldn't have a gripe of favoritism. You obviously haven't been around very long or you would know the history of the politics of the thing. You don't, and it shows by your lack of historical knowledge.

As for the baseball thing, ALL of the other schools have had new baseball fields and facilities since Garland has. Garland's facilities are essentially the same as they had in 1964 when South opened. BTW, South has had an upgrade since that time. All the new schools got similar upgrades when they opened and North has gotten one since they opened in 1970 or so. No wonder Garland has such a poor baseball program, they have facilities that are worse than most little leagues in the area. I guess we can claim that Homer hates Garland baseball and softball and is giving his favorites an unfair advantage, based on your........logic?

I was on the golf team at Garland form 1973-76. To be honest, our team sucked, but we tried and we played our hearts out. South had the best golf team, by far. All those kids were raised on Eastern Hills CC and had a club in their hands since they were babies. All the guys on our team basically decided to play something in HS, so we picked golf and started learning from scratch. When it came time for tournaments, the district had to pay per diem for the teams to go for the day plus costs for the coach. Many times we were told that we couldn't go to a tournament because the district had a budget and South had the bast chance to win, so they got the money. We resented those cocky "Ricks with a "P", and we hated Homer too, but now I understand the whole deal. Homer did what was best based on the budget he had, and that meant South went and we didn't. Also, South actually had a real golf coach who played collegiate golf at the D1 level. Our golf coach was an Algebra teacher who wanted the extra $400 he got each year for the job. He never hit a ball that didn't fly like a banana. We didn't have a chance to win or improve, except what we did on our own. However, I understand why it was that way, and I accept it.

People like you who hammer Homer just don't see the trees for the forest and I doubt you ever will.

[sgfantoo]

I notice you didn't argue the point I made on the coaches. If he was so interested in Garland, he would have given Garland one of those coaches instead of some of the jokes we've had in the 70's and 80's. He went out of his way to give the other schools championship coaches so people like you wouldn't have a gripe of favoritism. You obviously haven't been around very long or you would know the history of the politics of the thing. You don't, and it shows by your lack of historical knowledge.

As for the baseball thing, ALL of the other schools have had new baseball fields and facilities since Garland has. Garland's facilities are essentially the same as they had in 1964 when South opened. BTW, South has had an upgrade since that time. All the new schools got similar upgrades when they opened and North has gotten one since they opened in 1970 or so. No wonder Garland has such a poor baseball program, they have facilities that are worse than most little leagues in the area. I guess we can claim that Homer hates Garland baseball and softball and is giving his favorites an unfair advantage, based on your........logic?

I was on the golf team at Garland form 1973-76. To be honest, our team sucked, but we tried and we played our hearts out. South had the best golf team, by far. All those kids were raised on Eastern Hills CC and had a club in their hands since they were babies. All the guys on our team basically decided to play something in HS, so we picked golf and started learning from scratch. When it came time for tournaments, the district had to pay per Diem for the teams to go for the day plus costs for the coach. Many times we were told that we couldn't go to a tournament because the district had a budget and South had the bast chance to win, so they got the money. We resented those cocky "Ricks with a "P", and we hated Homer too, but now I understand the whole deal. Homer did what was best based on the budget he had, and that meant South went and we didn't. Also, South actually had a real golf coach who played collegiate golf at the D1 level. Our golf coach was an Algebra teacher who wanted the extra $400 he got each year for the job. He never hit a ball that didn't fly like a banana. We didn't have a chance to win or improve, except what we did on our own. However, I understand why it was that way, and I accept it.

People like you who hammer Homer just don't see the trees for the forest and I doubt you ever will.


You have made strong statements that Roughrider and I do not know our history. I admit. There are many things I do not know. Like, the golf coach at South who played D1 golf. Granted many SG golfers grew up at Eastern Hills. But a D1 golfer as coach at SG?

Help me out GoOwls4X56636499. Teach me some history. What is the name of this golf coach?

[Roughrider]

The fact that you use a country club sport to make your arguement is laughable... Golf..........Football..........hmmm they are so close in comparison. Homer giving South the advantage in golf while he loads up in football??? Let's be realistic, he also hired a multiple state champion coach for Lakeview but we all know that it takes 10 state championships from Oklahoma to equal one from Texas!! So was he really giving LV a leg up???

[GarlandOwl06]

All that college level talent in the last 9 years and you have one title and a third round finish??



Wow i cant believe that it has taken roughrider to be one of the first to actually understand my biggest complaint about garland football. I have been saying this for so long.... with all of the d-1 talent the last couple of years especially this year and 02 we should be finishing much higher than 1st round exits.

[GoOwls]

You have made strong statements that Roughrider and I do not know our history. I admit. There are many things I do not know. Like, the golf coach at South who played D1 golf. Granted many SG golfers grew up at Eastern Hills. But a D1 golfer as coach at SG?

Help me out GoOwls4X56636499. Teach me some history. What is the name of this golf coach?

His name was Bill Grant. He was hand picked to coach the golf team. He taught other classes, but his main duties were to coach the golf team. Some D1 golfers who went through South while I was there were Mac Stalcup, Cary Collins (now a club pro), Mark Grey (Gray?) (also a club pro I think), and a couple of other guys that I don't remember their names. Grant was hired to wet nurse these D1 golfers through HS by Homer. He was also close to the head pro at EHCC, John Neese, and got them hooked up with instruction pretty much on demand. All we could do was stand there and watch them get better. There was great pressure from the money men and daddys of these South alumni who were members at Eastern Hills CC to provide a legitimate coach. South also dominated football back then. Our coach was some simpletons named Boyd and Boring while South had Dotson. Dotson was always able to beat Garland with inferior talent, mostly, because our coaches had the predictability of the sun rising in their play calling and schemes. Boring wasted possibly the most talented Garland Owls team ever, the 1978 team, by being so predictable and simple. We could only dream of having a coach like Dotson at Garland back then. If Homer is such a Garland homer, he failed miserably from about 1971 through 1991. However, all you guys focus on is Joe Martin and the last 15 years of Homers' running the district. Remember, Martin was a nice 3A coach, but unproven at 5A when he got here. He had to earn his skins. You guys are laughable in your lack of knowledge of this subject. I could go on with this for days......owning you guys....that is.

[GoOwls]

The fact that you use a country club sport to make your arguement is laughable... Golf..........Football..........hmmm they are so close in comparison. Homer giving South the advantage in golf while he loads up in football??? Let's be realistic, he also hired a multiple state champion coach for Lakeview but we all know that it takes 10 state championships from Oklahoma to equal one from Texas!! So was he really giving LV a leg up???

Well Rough, lets look at the hires by Homer since he took over the AD job in 1963 and after there were 2 schools to hire for, which excludes Chuck Curtis from the list as there was no South in 1963 for him to have coached. To be more specific, let's look at the ones in the Garland Sports Hall of Fame.

Joe Allen, in 1986 (we sure could have used him), won state championships at Electra and Wheeler, had a career record at the time of his induction of 152-65-2, coached the Texas squad in the Oil Bowl. North Garland got him, not us.

Tommy Watkins, (we sure could have used him) won state championships at Rotan and 2 at Iowa Park, career record at the time of induction of 271-113-8, had a 47-27-1 record at Lakeview, coached the Oil Bowl team, at the time of induction he had the most wins of any active 5A coach in the state. Lakeview got him, not us.

James Rust, Garland alumni, coached Pittsburg to state title, didn't coach at Garland.

Joe Martin, 72-20-3 at Garland, 1 state title at Garland, was 22-17-1 at Lake Dallas and 16-6 at Mabank with only 2 playoff appearances befor being hired by Homer for the Garland job. Not excatly the credentials of the previous hires that went to other schools in the district.

Now we have Jordan and I have seen you continually criticise his program for the post-season futility. You certainly can't be saying Homer is stacking the deck with Jordan, since you have so much distain for his post-season success. You have said as much that the present South coach is superior to him.

Please relate to me with something......anything.... that remotely resembles facts to support your claim.

You youngsters and newbies to the sports scene here in Garland just jumped the wrong guy, cause I got the facts.....junior. Try not to make it so easy next time.:D

[sgfantoo]

His name was Bill Grant. He was hand picked to coach the golf team. He taught other classes, but his main duties were to coach the golf team. Some D1 golfers who went through South while I was there were Mac Stalcup, Cary Collins (now a club pro), Mark Grey (Gray?) (also a club pro I think), and a couple of other guys that I don't remember their names. Grant was hired to wet nurse these D1 golfers through HS by Homer. He was also close to the head pro at EHCC, John Neese, and got them hooked up with instruction pretty much on demand. All we could do was stand there and watch them get better. There was great pressure from the money men and daddys of these South alumni who were members at Eastern Hills CC to provide a legitimate coach. South also dominated football back then. Our coach was some simpletons named Boyd and Boring while South had Dotson. Dotson was always able to beat Garland with inferior talent, mostly, because our coaches had the predictability of the sun rising in their play calling and schemes. Boring wasted possibly the most talented Garland Owls team ever, the 1978 team, by being so predictable and simple. We could only dream of having a coach like Dotson at Garland back then. If Homer is such a Garland homer, he failed miserably from about 1971 through 1991. However, all you guys focus on is Joe Martin and the last 15 years of Homers' running the district. Remember, Martin was a nice 3A coach, but unproven at 5A when he got here. He had to earn his skins. You guys are laughable in your lack of knowledge of this subject. I could go on with this for days......owning you guys....that is.

Are you saying that Bill Grant, the recently retired golf coach at SG, played D1 golf? Where? Did Grant know Neese before coming to SG? Or did he develop a relationship with Neese after he arrived?

I do accept your statement of history prior to the arrival of Martin. Martin may have only had success at a 3A school but like Dodd he knew what it was like to quarterback a 5A team to the state finals.

You keep talking about Jordan. If my memory serves me correctly (I am older than you so my memory does not work as well as yours) Jordan was not Homer's first or possibly second choice. Help me out. Was Joey Florence not hired first then DR swayed him to stay? As I recall Homer went with Florence despite a nearly unanimous request form the Owl booster club to hire Jordan. Help me out owl fan.

At last a good discussion in the off season.

[GarlandOwl06]

I do believe Florence was sought after and almost gotten but I do not think we had the money to dish out to a prestigous coach like Florence. Someone who applied for the job and was not even considered was none other than David Beaty who should have gotten the job with Jordan at defensive coordinator making for a great staff.

[sgfantoo]

I do believe Florence was sought after and almost gotten but I do not think we had the money to dish out to a prestigous coach like Florence. Someone who applied for the job and was not even considered was none other than David Beaty who should have gotten the job with Jordan at defensive coordinator making for a great staff.


I thought Florence received an offer, accepted, then DR countered and Florence backed out.

[grayowl60]

I thought Florence received an offer, accepted, then DR countered and Florence backed out.
I understand he had been given the keys to the fieldhouse.

[Roughrider]

Well Rough, lets look at the hires by Homer since he took over the AD job in 1963 and after there were 2 schools to hire for, which excludes Chuck Curtis from the list as there was no South in 1963 for him to have coached. To be more specific, let's look at the ones in the Garland Sports Hall of Fame.

Joe Allen, in 1986 (we sure could have used him), won state championships at Electra and Wheeler, had a career record at the time of his induction of 152-65-2, coached the Texas squad in the Oil Bowl. North Garland got him, not us.

Tommy Watkins, (we sure could have used him) won state championships at Rotan and 2 at Iowa Park, career record at the time of induction of 271-113-8, had a 47-27-1 record at Lakeview, coached the Oil Bowl team, at the time of induction he had the most wins of any active 5A coach in the state. Lakeview got him, not us.

James Rust, Garland alumni, coached Pittsburg to state title, didn't coach at Garland.

Joe Martin, 72-20-3 at Garland, 1 state title at Garland, was 22-17-1 at Lake Dallas and 16-6 at Mabank with only 2 playoff appearances befor being hired by Homer for the Garland job. Not excatly the credentials of the previous hires that went to other schools in the district.

Now we have Jordan and I have seen you continually criticise his program for the post-season futility. You certainly can't be saying Homer is stacking the deck with Jordan, since you have so much distain for his post-season success. You have said as much that the present South coach is superior to him.

Please relate to me with something......anything.... that remotely resembles facts to support your claim.

You youngsters and newbies to the sports scene here in Garland just jumped the wrong guy, cause I got the facts.....junior. Try not to make it so easy next time.:D

Somewhere along the way it turned to coaches?? Not my point of focus, it's the open door policy on illegal recruiting that interest me!! If it's done by certain schools ???? you here nothing more than grumbling.. If other schools do it, there is a meeting and hell to pay!! It's a fact, talk to other coaches to get a unbiased opinion, not the word of the ones doing it!!

[sgfantoo]

Somewhere along the way it turned to coaches?? Not my point of focus, it's the open door policy on illegal recruiting that interest me!! If it's done by certain schools ???? you here nothing more than grumbling.. If other schools do it, there is a meeting and hell to pay!! It's a fact, talk to other coaches to get a unbiased opinion, not the word of the ones doing it!!

It is hard for me not to believe that every coach in GISD is probably recruiting kids, football, basketball, baseball, volleyball, girls basketball etc. That is the nature of the beast of the GISD system. IMO there is even an unspoken attitude that this school will excel in football, another in basketball, another in baseball, and yes another in golf. (Not withstanding what I believe to be erroneous remarks about Bill Grant.)

We all live in a glass house. We better not through rocks.

What bothers me is the harassment that Moss and others like him receive. They are made to feel unwelcome. In the long run this will hurt GISD football and GHS football.

If Moss continues to be successful, beating GHS some and advancing further in the playoffs than GHS, the allegations and criticism will grow and Moss will choose to leave. This statement can neither be proven true or false. It is only an opinion.

[GoOwls]

Are you saying that Bill Grant, the recently retired golf coach at SG, played D1 golf? Where? Did Grant know Neese before coming to SG? Or did he develop a relationship with Neese after he arrived?

I do accept your statement of history prior to the arrival of Martin. Martin may have only had success at a 3A school but like Dodd he knew what it was like to quarterback a 5A team to the state finals.

You keep talking about Jordan. If my memory serves me correctly (I am older than you so my memory does not work as well as yours) Jordan was not Homer's first or possibly second choice. Help me out. Was Joey Florence not hired first then DR swayed him to stay? As I recall Homer went with Florence despite a nearly unanimous request form the Owl booster club to hire Jordan. Help me out owl fan.

At last a good discussion in the off season.

I wish I could answer your questions about Grant, but I can't, with any certainty. All I know is what the South golfers told us, what Grant told us, and what we were led to believe in general. I graduated 30 years ago this year, so some of the specifics are hazy, but I do remember we were led to believe that he had skins on the wall from D1. I did, on many occasions, see him instruct the golfers on technique. Once I was playing with him, a South golfer, and one of my teammates. I asked him about a part of my game and he said he would answer my question after we had played our match with South a few weeks later. He didn't want me to get an advantage on his player.....like I had a prayer anyway. I have no idea about his an Neeses' relationship origins, but they seemed to be very good friends, the type of friendship that has some time into it. He was far superior to our "Algebra teacher" or the coach at North, Coach Pickle, who was a football coach who also wanted the $400 for the coaching job and the free golf. Grant was paid quite a bit more than $400, plus he got a number of perks and gifts from the South golf team supporters.

I'm talking about Jordan because Rough is always talking about our lack of success past the first round of the playoffs. He always uses that as a point of reference to jab at us. My point to him is that if our playoff record is so bad, and Homer is hand picking the best coaches for Garland, why didn't he get us a better coach that might have been given to another school. For the record, I like Jordan and I think he is growing as a head coach. He's had to learn how to do the job and I believe he is getting better. I have no knowledge of Florence and his situation here, if there was one.

[sgfantoo]

I wish I could answer your questions about Grant, but I can't, with any certainty. All I know is what the South golfers told us, what Grant told us, and what we were led to believe in general. I graduated 30 years ago this year, so some of the specifics are hazy, but I do remember we were led to believe that he had skins on the wall from D1. I did, on many occasions, see him instruct the golfers on technique. Once I was playing with him, a South golfer, and one of my teammates. I asked him about a part of my game and he said he would answer my question after we had played our match with South a few weeks later. He didn't want me to get an advantage on his player.....like I had a prayer anyway. I have no idea about his an Neeses' relationship origins, but they seemed to be very good friends, the type of friendship that has some time into it. He was far superior to our "Algebra teacher" or the coach at North, Coach Pickle, who was a football coach who also wanted the $400 for the coaching job and the free golf. Grant was paid quite a bit more than $400, plus he got a number of perks and gifts from the South golf team supporters.

I'm talking about Jordan because Rough is always talking about our lack of success past the first round of the playoffs. He always uses that as a point of reference to jab at us. My point to him is that if our playoff record is so bad, and Homer is hand picking the best coaches for Garland, why didn't he get us a better coach that might have been given to another school. For the record, I like Jordan and I think he is growing as a head coach. He's had to learn how to do the job and I believe he is getting better. I have no knowledge of Florence and his situation here, if there was one.

The story I have heard from Grant is quite different than the one you tell. I have a son that played for Grant four years, made a trip to regional four years and was an all district golfer for four years.

My conversations with Grant led me to believe that when he was hired at South he did not know he would coach at all. He was hired as a PE teacher. When he arrived he was told he would be coaching either tennis or golf. He chose golf. I can not speak absolutely, but I do not think Grant was a golfer at all in college and that he learned the game as he coached.

I do not doubt the parent support that Grant received. Those early teams, before you played included Kenny Quesenberry who received a full football ride at Baylor, a kid named Burns (I can not think of his first name but his Mother is Sally Burns who at the time was the manager of Eastern Hills.) In addition to the other names you mention, Gilbert Freeman played in those days who went to Mclennan County Community College then landed at DAC and is now the head pro at Lakewood. His oldest son Ross Freeman played of four district championship teams for Grant and another son, Jack, is now a senior playing in his third year at South. (Jack spent his sophomore year at Bishop Lynch.)

My charge against you is that you are making brash statements about knowing history, and I do not believe you have your facts straight concerning golf at SG and Bill Grant in particular.

I also have a son who was a three year starter for Martin and close friends who had sons playing for Garland when GHS won the state championship and when Martin left. Of all the coaches at GHS, my son preferred Jordan. I do know that the booster club wanted Homer to hire Jordan from the start.

Jordan has grown as a head coach. The first half of his first year was the worst ever. He made adjustments and the rest is history. As far as Rough's comments about GHS' lack of success, I know nothing about, being a rookie on this board. I do know that any GISD school will have trouble going far in the playoffs simply because of the nature of GISD and the surrounding competition. From time to time, a GISD school will make it to the third round or beyond. Unfortunately that will be the exception.

What concerns me is what I perceive to be a bias in the district as a whole toward the benefit of GHS not only in football but also academics.

Unfortunately the leaders of GISD only make plans to improve a school when it has fallen so far deep into the pits. This began with GHS in the 80s. It moved to NG in the 90's. After Rowlett opened, it happened to LC which has yet to recover.

It is now happening to SG and NF. When it gets bad enough, then and only then will GISD do something. In the meantime, GHS football is in a favored position as SG was in the 70s and 80s.

IMO GHS receives favored treatment in football from the athletic department.

All I ask is if you talk about how much you know about history, you need to make sure you know what you are speaking about.

This dialogue is good for GHS, SG and all of GISD.

Thanks for the dialogue.

[Roughrider]

You Ollies sure are persistent, wrong but persistent!:D

[GoOwls]

The story I have heard from Grant is quite different than the one you tell. I have a son that played for Grant four years, made a trip to regional four years and was an all district golfer for four years.

My conversations with Grant led me to believe that when he was hired at South he did not know he would coach at all. He was hired as a PE teacher. When he arrived he was told he would be coaching either tennis or golf. He chose golf. I can not speak absolutely, but I do not think Grant was a golfer at all in college and that he learned the game as he coached.

I do not doubt the parent support that Grant received. Those early teams, before you played included Kenny Quesenberry who received a full football ride at Baylor, a kid named Burns (I can not think of his first name but his Mother is Sally Burns who at the time was the manager of Eastern Hills.) In addition to the other names you mention, Gilbert Freeman played in those days who went to Mclennan County Community College then landed at DAC and is now the head pro at Lakewood. His oldest son Ross Freeman played of four district championship teams for Grant and another son, Jack, is now a senior playing in his third year at South. (Jack spent his sophomore year at Bishop Lynch.)

My charge against you is that you are making brash statements about knowing history, and I do not believe you have your facts straight concerning golf at SG and Bill Grant in particular.

I also have a son who was a three year starter for Martin and close friends who had sons playing for Garland when GHS won the state championship and when Martin left. Of all the coaches at GHS, my son preferred Jordan. I do know that the booster club wanted Homer to hire Jordan from the start.

Jordan has grown as a head coach. The first half of his first year was the worst ever. He made adjustments and the rest is history. As far as Rough's comments about GHS' lack of success, I know nothing about, being a rookie on this board. I do know that any GISD school will have trouble going far in the playoffs simply because of the nature of GISD and the surrounding competition. From time to time, a GISD school will make it to the third round or beyond. Unfortunately that will be the exception.

What concerns me is what I perceive to be a bias in the district as a whole toward the benefit of GHS not only in football but also academics.

Unfortunately the leaders of GISD only make plans to improve a school when it has fallen so far deep into the pits. This began with GHS in the 80s. It moved to NG in the 90's. After Rowlett opened, it happened to LC which has yet to recover.

It is now happening to SG and NF. When it gets bad enough, then and only then will GISD do something. In the meantime, GHS football is in a favored position as SG was in the 70s and 80s.

IMO GHS receives favored treatment in football from the athletic department.

All I ask is if you talk about how much you know about history, you need to make sure you know what you are speaking about.

This dialogue is good for GHS, SG and all of GISD.

Thanks for the dialogue.

Well, you know what they say about history. Every country has their own version of history, dependent o their perception of same. Possibly he thought, as a younger man, he had to do things to impress folks. I don't know. Over 30 years I'm sure the man changed, I know I have. However, there is no doubt that the guys on our team were left with the definite opinion that Grant was a big shot and a heavy hitter in the district. Our "coach" would just hang his head in disgust at what favoritism South got and what we didn't get.

I love Homer Johnson now and I believe him to be a treasure. But back in my HS days, I hated his guts because of the percieved injustices against his old school, of all things. The dang man had sold out to all the South cash and power, or so it seemed to us at the time. Homer was not liked or respected on our team. Over the years, with maturity, I have seen what was in play and why he did what he did, and I consider him to be somewhat of a friend, for no more often than I see him. But he always remembers me and remembers that I played on the Garland golf team and he is just a wonderful man and I'm proud to know him.

I think that believing that there is a bias towards Garland is the easy way out. It excuses past failures on other teams part in this district. I, only partially, but effectively, above, pointed out that Homers coaching hires over the years point to, if anything, that he give the best hires to other schools so as to deflect the same criticism that you guys give him anyway. I remember being livid when Lakeview got Tommy Watkins and not us. Can you imagine how much you guys would be trashing him if he had placed Watkins or Joe Allen or some of the others at Garland? We have always gotten the experiments......period. He placed the guys with skins at the other schools.

If Moss does good at South, it makes the whole district look better. Nobody is going to look for his head if he has success or beats Garland. The better he makes South, the better our district will be, over time, and the better Garland will be, and the better all our chances to have deep runs in the playoffs.

I totally agree with you about our districts competitive disadvantage and that the long playoff run will be the exception and not the norm, due to the way things are set up.

Please guys, stop it with the conspiracy theories. In this case there isn't anybody on the Grassy Knoll....please give it a rest.

[OWLBAIT]

Somewhere along the way it turned to coaches?? Not my point of focus, it's the open door policy on illegal recruiting that interest me!! If it's done by certain schools ???? you here nothing more than grumbling.. If other schools do it, there is a meeting and hell to pay!! It's a fact, talk to other coaches to get a unbiased opinion, not the word of the ones doing it!!
Unbiased opinion from other coaches? I have given you way too much credit, Rough.

[Roughrider]

Well, you know what they say about history. Every country has their own version of history, dependent o their perception of same. Possibly he thought, as a younger man, he had to do things to impress folks. I don't know. Over 30 years I'm sure the man changed, I know I have. However, there is no doubt that the guys on our team were left with the definite opinion that Grant was a big shot and a heavy hitter in the district. Our "coach" would just hang his head in disgust at what favoritism South got and what we didn't get.

I love Homer Johnson now and I believe him to be a treasure. But back in my HS days, I hated his guts because of the percieved injustices against his old school, of all things. The dang man had sold out to all the South cash and power, or so it seemed to us at the time. Homer was not liked or respected on our team. Over the years, with maturity, I have seen what was in play and why he did what he did, and I consider him to be somewhat of a friend, for no more often than I see him. But he always remembers me and remembers that I played on the Garland golf team and he is just a wonderful man and I'm proud to know him.

I think that believing that there is a bias towards Garland is the easy way out. It excuses past failures on other teams part in this district. I, only partially, but effectively, above, pointed out that Homers coaching hires over the years point to, if anything, that he give the best hires to other schools so as to deflect the same criticism that you guys give him anyway. I remember being livid when Lakeview got Tommy Watkins and not us. Can you imagine how much you guys would be trashing him if he had placed Watkins or Joe Allen or some of the others at Garland? We have always gotten the experiments......period. He placed the guys with skins at the other schools.

If Moss does good at South, it makes the whole district look better. Nobody is going to look for his head if he has success or beats Garland. The better he makes South, the better our district will be, over time, and the better Garland will be, and the better all our chances to have deep runs in the playoffs.

I totally agree with you about our districts competitive disadvantage and that the long playoff run will be the exception and not the norm, due to the way things are set up.

Please guys, stop it with the conspiracy theories. In this case there isn't anybody on the Grassy Knoll....please give it a rest.

Again...... the fact that you are talking about golf and making any type of comparison to football is unbelievable!! You sound like strakeRake talking about country club sports...

[Roughrider]

Unbiased opinion from other coaches? I have given you way too much credit, Rough.

It's understood that I'll take a shot or two when the opportunity presents itself:D But I have other fires that burn alot hotter!

[sgfantoo]

Well, you know what they say about history. Every country has their own version of history, dependent o their perception of same. Possibly he thought, as a younger man, he had to do things to impress folks. I don't know. Over 30 years I'm sure the man changed, I know I have. However, there is no doubt that the guys on our team were left with the definite opinion that Grant was a big shot and a heavy hitter in the district. Our "coach" would just hang his head in disgust at what favoritism South got and what we didn't get.

I love Homer Johnson now and I believe him to be a treasure. But back in my HS days, I hated his guts because of the percieved injustices against his old school, of all things. The dang man had sold out to all the South cash and power, or so it seemed to us at the time. Homer was not liked or respected on our team. Over the years, with maturity, I have seen what was in play and why he did what he did, and I consider him to be somewhat of a friend, for no more often than I see him. But he always remembers me and remembers that I played on the Garland golf team and he is just a wonderful man and I'm proud to know him.

I think that believing that there is a bias towards Garland is the easy way out. It excuses past failures on other teams part in this district. I, only partially, but effectively, above, pointed out that Homers coaching hires over the years point to, if anything, that he give the best hires to other schools so as to deflect the same criticism that you guys give him anyway. I remember being livid when Lakeview got Tommy Watkins and not us. Can you imagine how much you guys would be trashing him if he had placed Watkins or Joe Allen or some of the others at Garland? We have always gotten the experiments......period. He placed the guys with skins at the other schools.

If Moss does good at South, it makes the whole district look better. Nobody is going to look for his head if he has success or beats Garland. The better he makes South, the better our district will be, over time, and the better Garland will be, and the better all our chances to have deep runs in the playoffs.

I totally agree with you about our districts competitive disadvantage and that the long playoff run will be the exception and not the norm, due to the way things are set up.

Please guys, stop it with the conspiracy theories. In this case there isn't anybody on the Grassy Knoll....please give it a rest.

I think Grant did a good mind job on you guys and you became a weaker golfer and team because of what you thought. In this Grant gained a competitive edge. He did a good job of winning the mind game.

Help me out with some info. I think that each high school has two middle schools that have been labeled "feeder schools." The coaches of these middle schools help the high school coach with scouting and other duties throughout the football season. Is this correct? If so what middle schools are assigned to GHS?

Help me out, please?

BTW, is it not grand that neither the owls or colonels deal with the situation at Plano Sr. High?

[sgfantoo]

Well, you know what they say about history. Every country has their own version of history, dependent o their perception of same. Possibly he thought, as a younger man, he had to do things to impress folks. I don't know. Over 30 years I'm sure the man changed, I know I have. However, there is no doubt that the guys on our team were left with the definite opinion that Grant was a big shot and a heavy hitter in the district. Our "coach" would just hang his head in disgust at what favoritism South got and what we didn't get.

I love Homer Johnson now and I believe him to be a treasure. But back in my HS days, I hated his guts because of the percieved injustices against his old school, of all things. The dang man had sold out to all the South cash and power, or so it seemed to us at the time. Homer was not liked or respected on our team. Over the years, with maturity, I have seen what was in play and why he did what he did, and I consider him to be somewhat of a friend, for no more often than I see him. But he always remembers me and remembers that I played on the Garland golf team and he is just a wonderful man and I'm proud to know him.

I think that believing that there is a bias towards Garland is the easy way out. It excuses past failures on other teams part in this district. I, only partially, but effectively, above, pointed out that Homers coaching hires over the years point to, if anything, that he give the best hires to other schools so as to deflect the same criticism that you guys give him anyway. I remember being livid when Lakeview got Tommy Watkins and not us. Can you imagine how much you guys would be trashing him if he had placed Watkins or Joe Allen or some of the others at Garland? We have always gotten the experiments......period. He placed the guys with skins at the other schools.

If Moss does good at South, it makes the whole district look better. Nobody is going to look for his head if he has success or beats Garland. The better he makes South, the better our district will be, over time, and the better Garland will be, and the better all our chances to have deep runs in the playoffs.

I totally agree with you about our districts competitive disadvantage and that the long playoff run will be the exception and not the norm, due to the way things are set up.

Please guys, stop it with the conspiracy theories. In this case there isn't anybody on the Grassy Knoll....please give it a rest.

I think Grant did a good mind job on you guys and you became a weaker golfer and team because of what you thought. In this Grant gained a competitive edge. He did a good job of winning the mind game.

Help me out with some info. I think that each high school has two middle schools that have been labeled "feeder schools." The coaches of these middle schools help the high school coach with scouting and other duties throughout the football season. Is this correct? If so what middle schools are assigned to GHS?

Help me out, please?

BTW, is it not grand that neither the owls or colonels deal with the situation at Plano Sr. High?

[OWLBAIT]

What harrassment? How is Moss (and other coaches like him) made to feel unwelcome?It is hard for me not to believe that every coach in GISD is probably recruiting kids, football, basketball, baseball, volleyball, girls basketball etc. That is the nature of the beast of the GISD system. IMO there is even an unspoken attitude that this school will excel in football, another in basketball, another in baseball, and yes another in golf. (Not withstanding what I believe to be erroneous remarks about Bill Grant.)

We all live in a glass house. We better not through rocks.

What bothers me is the harassment that Moss and others like him receive. They are made to feel unwelcome. In the long run this will hurt GISD football and GHS football.

If Moss continues to be successful, beating GHS some and advancing further in the playoffs than GHS, the allegations and criticism will grow and Moss will choose to leave. This statement can neither be proven true or false. It is only an opinion.

[sgfantoo]

What harrassment? How is Moss (and other coaches like him) made to feel unwelcome?

I refer you to the question in my previous post. (I apologize for posting it twice. I lost conection and did not realize it was already posted.) Do each of the high schools have two middle school coaching staffs assigned to help out with football responsibilities? If so, what two are assigned to GHS?

[GTown02]

I refer you to the question in my previous post. (I apologize for posting it twice. I lost conection and did not realize it was already posted.) Do each of the high schools have two middle school coaching staffs assigned to help out with football responsibilities? If so, what two are assigned to GHS?
The only one I know for sure is Austin... Ive seen a few coaches on the sidelines from Austin Middle School.

[g-town07]

garland has 3 feederes
austin, sellers, and bussey
ive only seen austin and sellers coaches on the sidelines though during games although a bunch of our players come from bussey also

[thisisfeedingwhatiam]

Normally the high school coaches(frosh) are the ones that go over to middle schools and work with the players in off-season.

[sgfantoo]

garland has 3 feederes
austin, sellers, and bussey
ive only seen austin and sellers coaches on the sidelines though during games although a bunch of our players come from bussey also

Interesting that GHS has three feeders. (I am not sure that Bussey is an official feeder school. That might be the reason the coaches are never on the sidelines. Not for sure though. Bussey certainly behaves as a feeder school.)

Now this question. We will limit it to Sellars, Bussey, and the students at Austin who live within two miles of Austin or are bussed to Austin but not in the gt program. When these kids go to high school and live out side of two miles from a high school and bus transportation must be provided to a high school, are any of these students bussed to schools other than GHS? Or are the only bus routes in the attendance zones of Bussey, Sellars, and Austin bussed to GHS?

Now another question. What are the feeder schools for SG?

G-town07, thanks for the info.

[GoOwls]

I think Grant did a good mind job on you guys and you became a weaker golfer and team because of what you thought. In this Grant gained a competitive edge. He did a good job of winning the mind game.

Help me out with some info. I think that each high school has two middle schools that have been labeled "feeder schools." The coaches of these middle schools help the high school coach with scouting and other duties throughout the football season. Is this correct? If so what middle schools are assigned to GHS?

Help me out, please?

BTW, is it not grand that neither the owls or colonels deal with the situation at Plano Sr. High?

You missed my earlier point that he didn't need to get in our heads. We were rank amateurs, we posed no threat to them in a match....they new it.... and we knew it. The three years I was there, their 5 would shoot 35-40 in the nine hole matches, we would usually shoot 41-47. 44 was bogey golf and if we shot bogey or a few strokes better, we were pretty happy. The best 9 hole match I had against a South golfer was a 3 and 2 loss. In 30 official matches against South golfers, we won 1 match while I was there. Nope, there wasn't a bluff, unless it was a major conspiracy amongst all the members of EHCC who played there every day and treated him like he was a king. Seriously. And he and Neese were like two peas in a pod.

Also, why didn't our coach or Coach Pickle from North ever "mind game" the South players? Because they couldn't....they and we knew South had the talent. It just proves my point that if he just scammed us for 3 years that he was a very gifted golf coach.........thanks for making my point for me.

The feeder schools mean very little here in Garland....and I think you know that. I'm not sure where your point is going, but I smell a rat. I'm a mailman and I see kids every day who live next door to each other, but go to different schools. It not uncommon at all. There all kinds of kids who attend high schools that are further away than their closest school. They, for what ever reason, have chosen to go to that school, filled out the choice of school form, and if they are lucky, they get to go to that school. I know a kid who should go to South, but he has always dreamed of playing for Garland. He filled out his form, and he got in. I know of others who should go to Garland who go to North, South, and Rowlett. The feeder system is a nice idea, but with the mobility these kids have now, it really doesn't matter much.

[GoOwls]

Again...... the fact that you are talking about golf and making any type of comparison to football is unbelievable!! You sound like strakeRake talking about country club sports...

Rough, you about as successful at reading the intent of my posts as your football team is of beating something above 3A teams.:D

The point is about perceptions. We percieved a bias against us from Homer, but we were wrong, and with maturity, we understand the mechanics of what was going on. We know why it appeared the way it did.

Isn't it about time you pablum pushers grew up also and blamed the coaches and players for not being sucessful instead of some grand conspiracy that gives you an excuse for your failures.

I've already proved that Garland always got the experiments and the other schools got the proven coaches. Now you want us to believe there was some other grand conspiracy involved, I guess?

If Homer is such a grand manipulator against South and the other schools, why, during the stretch from 1971-1991 did Garland, who had some great running backs and players through those years, only win district once? It's because we had sub-par coaches to train and motivate the kids.

Go fix your own house before you come peaking in my door.:D

[sgfantoo]

You missed my earlier point that he didn't need to get in our heads. We were rank amateurs, we posed no threat to them in a match....they new it.... and we knew it. The three years I was there, their 5 would shoot 35-40 in the nine hole matches, we would usually shoot 41-47. 44 was bogey golf and if we shot bogey or a few strokes better, we were pretty happy. The best 9 hole match I had against a South golfer was a 3 and 2 loss. In 30 official matches against South golfers, we won 1 match while I was there. Nope, there wasn't a bluff, unless it was a major conspiracy amongst all the members of EHCC who played there every day and treated him like he was a king. Seriously. And he and Neese were like two peas in a pod.

Also, why didn't our coach or Coach Pickle from North ever "mind game" the South players? Because they couldn't....they and we knew South had the talent. It just proves my point that if he just scammed us for 3 years that he was a very gifted golf coach.........thanks for making my point for me.

The feeder schools mean very little here in Garland....and I think you know that. I'm not sure where your point is going, but I smell a rat. I'm a mailman and I see kids every day who live next door to each other, but go to different schools. It not uncommon at all. There all kinds of kids who attend high schools that are further away than their closest school. They, for what ever reason, have chosen to go to that school, filled out the choice of school form, and if they are lucky, they get to go to that school. I know a kid who should go to South, but he has always dreamed of playing for Garland. He filled out his form, and he got in. I know of others who should go to Garland who go to North, South, and Rowlett. The feeder system is a nice idea, but with the mobility these kids have now, it really doesn't matter much.

I am not sure you understand the competitive nature of coaches. In my limited coaching (never on Friday nights or for district championships) if I was ever able to play a mind game with other teams even If it meant I would beat them by 20 points instead of 15 points, I did it as most coaches would do. Face it, Grant's players not only beat you by nine stokes, you were beaten into submission and developed the idea, "We can't win." A far cry from GHS' "We Will Win" attitude. This was not because SG was given preferential treatment by Homer and a D1 college golfer was hired. It was simply a PE coach who played some golf, doing his job.

I have some questions out on the board and at least some GHS fans are taking this discussion seriously and answering my questions. The "rat" you smell is my attempt to answer the question, "How are Moss and other coaches liked him harassed?"

The feeder system does matter. "There is no feeder system in Garland" is a myth. I still have some new questions out about bus routes for Bussey, Sellars, and Austin.

Another question. Do Notre Dame, Texas, USC, and other schools have a competitive edge over say TCU because of television exposure? I think yes. How many playoff games did GHS play in 2005? How many playoff games did SG have in 2005? How many GHS playoff games were broadcast on GRS-TV? How many SG playoff games were broadcast on GRS-TV? SG vs Lufkin boasted some great talent that many GISD patrons would have enjoyed watching. But they never had a chance. GISD sent folks to tape the GHS vs CC game but not the SG vs Lufkin game. More exposure for GHS. More young kids see GHS on TV. More kids choose GHS. If I were Moss and fighting for SG, I would feel harassed that all three GHS playoff games were televised while only the SG vs LH playoff game was televised. Thankfully, SG vs LH was on the same day at the same site as GHS vs Carter. If it had been in conflict with GHS, the SG vs LH game would have never been seen on TV.

One district championship between 1971 and 1991. How many did any other GISD schools have? South went to the playoffs around 73 and did not return till around 90 - 91. What GISD team kept GHS from winning district titles and going to the playoffs between 71 and 91, except for SG in 73?

Please give me answers to my questions GoOwls4X56636499. Thanks to those who have.

I am very grateful to Jordan and Moss for getting so many to the next level. Let's do everything we can to keep the streaks alive!

[OWLBAIT]

garland has 3 feederes
austin, sellers, and bussey
ive only seen austin and sellers coaches on the sidelines though during games although a bunch of our players come from bussey alsoWrong. Bussey is North Garland's feeder. Only Austin and Sellers feed Garland. I believe that Sam Houston was a Garland feeder, but was taken away and given to South Garland, but I may be wrong about that.

[GarlandOwl06]

You sure about bussey being a feeder to North Garland. Hmmmm lets see there school colors are black and gold and there mascot is the owlets. Half of the football team comes from bussy...... Antwine, Crosby, Devonta, Devin, .............. and yea so you could say that techinicaly it is but it really is not. In considereing football the only players from bussey that go to North are the second tier players.

[sgfantoo]

You sure about bussey being a feeder to North Garland. Hmmmm lets see there school colors are black and gold and there mascot is the owlets. Half of the football team comes from bussy...... Antwine, Crosby, Devonta, Devin, .............. and yea so you could say that techinicaly it is but it really is not. In considereing football the only players from bussey that go to North are the second tier players.

I do not know about Bussey. If what GarlandOwl06 says is true, and if I were the NG coach, I would feel dissed and harassed. Are all Bussey students provided transportation to NG? Or do some live within two miles of GHS and they go there. Are all students who attend Bussey that live farther than 2 miles from a high school provided transportation to NG?

I do understand that SH, the smallest middle school, is a feeder for SG. Do all students who go to SH live in the SG attendance zone? Are some students who attend SH provided transportation to another high school? I do not know. Maybe someone does.

Next year the OWLS will have the next senior Malcolm Williams. It is my understanding that he went to SH. Is this true? If he attended SH, and if he had wanted to play football for Moss and the Colonels, would GISD have provided transportation for Williams to SG?

It is also my understanding that O'Banion is a feeder school for SG. But a good portion of O'Banion students are transported to Lakeview.

Club Hill, three blocks from SG, and Handley students, the might Panthers, are directed to Brandenburg, a Lakeview feeder. There was even a rumor several years ago that a Brandenburg coach would not allow Brandenburg athletes to wear SG shirts during athletics. Probably an urban legend. SG is harassed by not being able to direct many Brandenburg athletes who will eventually attend SG and Lakeview is harassed by not really having Brandenburg as a true feeder school.

Intentionally or not, there is a bias in GISD towards GHS football. I do not believe it to be an urban legend. If there is an unintentional bias toward GHS football, it should be intentionally dealt with and removed.

BTW, no one has yet responded to my question about GHS football games being on GRS-TV as another way that GISD is biased towards GHS.

[g-town07]

BTW, no one has yet responded to my question about GHS football games being on GRS-TV as another way that GISD is biased towards GHS.

lets think logically here
ok, so lets see, playoffs week 1, 3 games, all at 2 o clock

rowlett vs mesquite
garland vs jt
sg vs longview

which has the potential for the best game?
rowlett has the edge on mesquite
longview was predicted to blow sg out of the water (major MAJOR props to sg on that upset)
and garland vs jt was a tossup
which one to you pick if your a gisd official in charge of grs?

rowlett indeed ended up handily beating mesquite
sg pulled the upset of the year, which would of been a great game for grs to televise, but pregame predictions? what were the papers saying and such?

week 1 of playoffs, garland vs jt had the potential for the best matchup across the board and higher viewing quality

week 2, it worked out that all 3 games were at different times, and 2 were at the same venue, so all 3 games were able to be televised

week 3, i dont know why sg vs lufkin wasnt televised as well, i have no idea either, garland played on a friday night, and south played that saturday. distance might of factored in, seeing how waco is about an hour or 1 1/2 hours closer than nacodoches or however you spell it (not from et, sorry lol)

week 3 remains unexplained and i have no answer for that, but hopefully that will clear up some of your week 1 concerns

[GoOwls]

I am not sure you understand the competitive nature of coaches. In my limited coaching (never on Friday nights or for district championships) if I was ever able to play a mind game with other teams even If it meant I would beat them by 20 points instead of 15 points, I did it as most coaches would do. Face it, Grant's players not only beat you by nine stokes, you were beaten into submission and developed the idea, "We can't win." A far cry from GHS' "We Will Win" attitude. This was not because SG was given preferential treatment by Homer and a D1 college golfer was hired. It was simply a PE coach who played some golf, doing his job.

I have some questions out on the board and at least some GHS fans are taking this discussion seriously and answering my questions. The "rat" you smell is my attempt to answer the question, "How are Moss and other coaches liked him harassed?"

The feeder system does matter. "There is no feeder system in Garland" is a myth. I still have some new questions out about bus routes for Bussey, Sellars, and Austin.

Another question. Do Notre Dame, Texas, USC, and other schools have a competitive edge over say TCU because of television exposure? I think yes. How many playoff games did GHS play in 2005? How many playoff games did SG have in 2005? How many GHS playoff games were broadcast on GRS-TV? How many SG playoff games were broadcast on GRS-TV? SG vs Lufkin boasted some great talent that many GISD patrons would have enjoyed watching. But they never had a chance. GISD sent folks to tape the GHS vs CC game but not the SG vs Lufkin game. More exposure for GHS. More young kids see GHS on TV. More kids choose GHS. If I were Moss and fighting for SG, I would feel harassed that all three GHS playoff games were televised while only the SG vs LH playoff game was televised. Thankfully, SG vs LH was on the same day at the same site as GHS vs Carter. If it had been in conflict with GHS, the SG vs LH game would have never been seen on TV.

One district championship between 1971 and 1991. How many did any other GISD schools have? South went to the playoffs around 73 and did not return till around 90 - 91. What GISD team kept GHS from winning district titles and going to the playoffs between 71 and 91, except for SG in 73?

Please give me answers to my questions GoOwls4X56636499. Thanks to those who have.

I am very grateful to Jordan and Moss for getting so many to the next level. Let's do everything we can to keep the streaks alive!

You write like one of those cocky rich folks, so here goes smart guy. We played our butts of trying to beat those guys, but we had a competitive disadvantage, somewhat like you claim poor old South suffers from in football, just that it's OK when you do it to us, but you get kind of torqued if you think we are doing it to you. Typical paranoia from the South folk.

Let's forget the whole coach idea for a minute. The golfers at South were playing golf since childhood and getting lessons for as long. Their parents were members of a country club and had the means and desire to fund their childrens golf development. The five guys on my teams dads had the following jobs: receiving clerk at Kraft Foods, Garland policeman, production line worker at Kraft Foods, semi-unemployed bum, and house framer. The cash was short and the lessons and good equipment were not to be had. We had more important things to do, like survive and pay the bills. Most of us had K-Mart specials or old used sets of clube we pieced together at different municipal course club houses. The South kids were getting Ping irons and woods and always played with new, fresh balls. We were laughed at by those same kids because we would troll around the creeks and ponds looking for water balls so we could have something to hit the next day. They got at least weekly lessons from a professional, we looked at each others swings and tried to help each other out, not having an idea if we were right or wrong. My mom and dad gave me $20 a week, from which I had to budget, gas for the week, school lunches, cokes at the golf course, and date money for the weekend. The South players played for a dollar a hole on most days, sometimes as much as $5 a hole. One time I saw a bet of $50 that a guy couldn't hit a ball across the water from where he was. The money changed hands on the spot......just like always.


In reality, Grant didn't have diddly squat with beating us. We were at such a disperate competitive disadvantage, his influence didn't change a thing. In fact, their arrogance made us tougher and we played them touger than we had a right to, on most occasions, just to let them know we weren't gonna roll over for them and die. No, it certainly just made us tougher and better having to deal with that old time South arrogance and money.

Look sir, I'm sure you're a nice guy. Yes, the other schools had nothing to do with us winning only one district championship from 71-91, just as Garland has nothing to do with your success, or lack thereof, over time. Each school has roughly the same number of kids. Either you have the heart and desire to win or you don't. Quit looking for the man on the grassy knoll and look inward to solve your problems. Maybe the kids just don't have the heart to win and maybe, like Garlands coaches during that 20 year span, just don't have the desire it takes to mold the confidence in those kids to be a winning program. There is plenty of that in this district.

Your OLD South arrogance is shining through. There is no grand conspiracy. Just round up your kids and play and whoever wins.......wins...... period...and leave it at that. You really cheapen the accomplishments that South has achieved over the last few years with your moaning and hypothosizing.

BTW, maybe your kid would respond better if the parents and fans would turn out for more that just the BIG games. There are games where you guys don't pack more than 2,000 in the stands. I wonder if the lack of commitment from the fan base, as a whole, could affect the players confidence?

As for my knowledge of South arrogance, my cousin was the QB of that South team that went to the playoffs in the early 70's, I had 11 other cousins who graduated from there , and I had 2 uncles who were members of Eastern Hills and another uncle and his son who were club pros. I was never asked to play a single round of golf with any of them or get a lesson. That is my "very close" family and they all went to South or had kids who went there. They couldn't even bear to help me since I was going to Garland. I loved my dad, he passed away in 1997, but he was the underachiever of the family, or so they all thought. I look at them now and see that he was the only decent man or woman in the bunch.

You guys just go ahead and keep on whining, it cheapens your whole school and any legacy that you may have or had.

As for the TV stuff, they follow winners......nuff said.

BTW, I married a South graduate....the only decent one I know, and had all six of our kids graduate from there. Don't even begin to tell me anything about South.......I already know the truth.

[Roughrider]

Rough, you about as successful at reading the intent of my posts as your football team is of beating something above 3A teams.:D

The point is about perceptions. We percieved a bias against us from Homer, but we were wrong, and with maturity, we understand the mechanics of what was going on. We know why it appeared the way it did.

Isn't it about time you pablum pushers grew up also and blamed the coaches and players for not being sucessful instead of some grand conspiracy that gives you an excuse for your failures.

I've already proved that Garland always got the experiments and the other schools got the proven coaches. Now you want us to believe there was some other grand conspiracy involved, I guess?

If Homer is such a grand manipulator against South and the other schools, why, during the stretch from 1971-1991 did Garland, who had some great running backs and players through those years, only win district once? It's because we had sub-par coaches to train and motivate the kids.

Go fix your own house before you come peaking in my door.:D

Apples to Oranges!!! You are just trying to "stick and move" avoiding the whole point!! By the way, there are designated feeder schools and on those campuses only that high school and it's representatives (coaches) are allowed.. Check it out through Homer's office... It's a fact!! That doesn't stop some of those black and gold snakes from crawling over to a kids house (illegal) and trying to "encourage" them to go to Garland!! Now you are right, if that athlete, on his/her on account, decides to go to a school that is not a feeder, it is their choice.. But contact with a nonfeeder is prohibited under AD's guidelines!!

[Roughrider]

You write like one of those cocky rich folks, so here goes smart guy. We played our butts of trying to beat those guys, but we had a competitive disadvantage, somewhat like you claim poor old South suffers from in football, just that it's OK when you do it to us, but you get kind of torqued if you think we are doing it to you. Typical paranoia from the South folk.

Let's forget the whole coach idea for a minute. The golfers at South were playing golf since childhood and getting lessons for as long. Their parents were members of a country club and had the means and desire to fund their childrens golf development. The five guys on my teams dads had the following jobs: receiving clerk at Kraft Foods, Garland policeman, production line worker at Kraft Foods, semi-unemployed bum, and house framer. The cash was short and the lessons and good equipment were not to be had. We had more important things to do, like survive and pay the bills. Most of us had K-Mart specials or old used sets of clube we pieced together at different municipal course club houses. The South kids were getting Ping irons and woods and always played with new, fresh balls. We were laughed at by those same kids because we would troll around the creeks and ponds looking for water balls so we could have something to hit the next day. They got at least weekly lessons from a professional, we looked at each others swings and tried to help each other out, not having an idea if we were right or wrong. My mom and dad gave me $20 a week, from which I had to budget, gas for the week, school lunches, cokes at the golf course, and date money for the weekend. The South players played for a dollar a hole on most days, sometimes as much as $5 a hole. One time I saw a bet of $50 that a guy couldn't hit a ball across the water from where he was. The money changed hands on the spot......just like always.


In reality, Grant didn't have diddly squat with beating us. We were at such a disperate competitive disadvantage, his influence didn't change a thing. In fact, their arrogance made us tougher and we played them touger than we had a right to, on most occasions, just to let them know we weren't gonna roll over for them and die. No, it certainly just made us tougher and better having to deal with that old time South arrogance and money.

Look sir, I'm sure you're a nice guy. Yes, the other schools had nothing to do with us winning only one district championship from 71-91, just as Garland has nothing to do with your success, or lack thereof, over time. Each school has roughly the same number of kids. Either you have the heart and desire to win or you don't. Quit looking for the man on the grassy knoll and look inward to solve your problems. Maybe the kids just don't have the heart to win and maybe, like Garlands coaches during that 20 year span, just don't have the desire it takes to mold the confidence in those kids to be a winning program. There is plenty of that in this district.

Your OLD South arrogance is shining through. There is no grand conspiracy. Just round up your kids and play and whoever wins.......wins...... period...and leave it at that. You really cheapen the accomplishments that South has achieved over the last few years with your moaning and hypothosizing.

BTW, maybe your kid would respond better if the parents and fans would turn out for more that just the BIG games. There are games where you guys don't pack more than 2,000 in the stands. I wonder if the lack of commitment from the fan base, as a whole, could affect the players confidence?

As for my knowledge of South arrogance, my cousin was the QB of that South team that went to the playoffs in the early 70's, I had 11 other cousins who graduated from there , and I had 2 uncles who were members of Eastern Hills and another uncle and his son who were club pros. I was never asked to play a single round of golf with any of them or get a lesson. That is my "very close" family and they all went to South or had kids who went there. They couldn't even bear to help me since I was going to Garland. I loved my dad, he passed away in 1997, but he was the underachiever of the family, or so they all thought. I look at them now and see that he was the only decent man or woman in the bunch.

You guys just go ahead and keep on whining, it cheapens your whole school and any legacy that you may have or had.

As for the TV stuff, they follow winners......nuff said.

BTW, I married a South graduate....the only decent one I know, and had all six of our kids graduate from there. Don't even begin to tell me anything about South.......I already know the truth.

Damn!! You talking about somebody whinning.. And you haven't let go of the "golf" thing yet while posting a dissertation??? Please, the fact that you are so sensitive to the whole issue leads one to believe that not only is it true but you Ollies work hard to cover it up!! Everybody in district knows who gets the perks... You can bellow all you want to but the other schools in district have a clear understanding...... and 1,2,3,4---- deep breath and 1,2,3,4 LMAO!!
SGfan way to go, haven't seen 2x4 this worked up in a while:D
Shouldn't be long before Owlfan1 comes to his defense!!

[sgfantoo]

lets think logically here
ok, so lets see, playoffs week 1, 3 games, all at 2 o clock

rowlett vs mesquite
garland vs jt
sg vs longview

which has the potential for the best game?
rowlett has the edge on mesquite
longview was predicted to blow sg out of the water (major MAJOR props to sg on that upset)
and garland vs jt was a tossup
which one to you pick if your a gisd official in charge of grs?

rowlett indeed ended up handily beating mesquite
sg pulled the upset of the year, which would of been a great game for grs to televise, but pregame predictions? what were the papers saying and such?

week 1 of playoffs, garland vs jt had the potential for the best matchup across the board and higher viewing quality

week 2, it worked out that all 3 games were at different times, and 2 were at the same venue, so all 3 games were able to be televised

week 3, i dont know why sg vs lufkin wasnt televised as well, i have no idea either, garland played on a friday night, and south played that saturday. distance might of factored in, seeing how waco is about an hour or 1 1/2 hours closer than nacodoches or however you spell it (not from et, sorry lol)

week 3 remains unexplained and i have no answer for that, but hopefully that will clear up some of your week 1 concerns

g-town07 I like your style. Well thought out. Logical. To the point.

You are exactly right about week one. GISD made the correct choice. Week two of the playoffs. GISD made the right choices. Week three of the playoffs. GISD blew it.

Here are stats for the year. GHS plays 13 games. 11 are on GRS-TV. All 8 games played in GISD were televised plus the three playoff games. GHS vs Plano East, GHS vs Carter, and all six district games. The only two not televised were played in Desoto (pity it was not taped) and in Ennis.

Neither of the non district games SG played at a GISD stadium were televised. One of the six district games was not televised and only one of the three playoff games was televised. Of SG's 13 games, six were televised. A comment was made about following winners. South was the undefeated champ in 04. South is a winner.

Let me end my posts on this thread with these statements. g-town07 keep representing GHS they way you are. It speaks well of you, GHS and the GISD.

Let's give Jordan and Moss a big thank you for making Garland, GISD, and football in this town and district something to be proud of. May we speak of them as others do of coaches who made careers of winning at one school. Let GHS and SG have a friendly battle each year seeing which school can send the most to D1 and other schools to continue their football careers. GISD, let's have a double - double every year.

sgfantoo signing off on this thread.

[GoOwls]

Damn!! You talking about somebody whinning.. And you haven't let go of the "golf" thing yet while posting a dissertation??? Please, the fact that you are so sensitive to the whole issue leads one to believe that not only is it true but you Ollies work hard to cover it up!! Everybody in district knows who gets the perks... You can bellow all you want to but the other schools in district have a clear understanding...... and 1,2,3,4---- deep breath and 1,2,3,4 LMAO!!
SGfan way to go, haven't seen 2x4 this worked up in a while:D
Shouldn't be long before Owlfan1 comes to his defense!!

Not whining, just stating facts...something you two wouldn't know anything about if it bit you on the butt. If you'll notice, your buddy was the one pusHing the golf issue, I was merely responding to the already famous South arrogance and paraonia.

You types are so predictable, you start a fight, get clobbered with facts from someone who knows them, then throw a few rocks and go hide under a bigger one.

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!

Typical South fans. sgfan had the sense to get out of a tussel with someone who wasn't 16 and actually knew something, and didn't let your dis-information infleunce their thoughts.

When you guys bring your bag to a fight, it's like bringing a chihuahua to fight a pit bull........lots of noise and a tore up little dog.

Sad part of this is, is that I know more about your school than you do.....very sad. And I even grew up in the town of Roughs' school.....his real school.....not his dream school....South.

Come on guys, start a fight you can win.:D :D :D

LET'S GET READY TO RUMBLLLLLLLLLLE!!!!!

[Roughrider]

Not whining, just stating facts...something you two wouldn't know anything about if it bit you on the butt. If you'll notice, your buddy was the one pusHing the golf issue, I was merely responding to the already famous South arrogance and paraonia.

You types are so predictable, you start a fight, get clobbered with facts from someone who knows them, then throw a few rocks and go hide under a bigger one.

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!

Typical South fans. sgfan had the sense to get out of a tussel with someone who wasn't 16 and actually knew something, and didn't let your dis-information infleunce their thoughts.

When you guys bring your bag to a fight, it's like bringing a chihuahua to fight a pit bull........lots of noise and a tore up little dog.

Sad part of this is, is that I know more about your school than you do.....very sad. And I even grew up in the town of Roughs' school.....his real school.....not his dream school....South.

Come on guys, start a fight you can win.:D :D :D

LET'S GET READY TO RUMBLLLLLLLLLLE!!!!!

You close your eyes tonight with this running through that thick balding head of yours............... The black and gold got it EASY!!! Homer is just that, A HOMER for his ollies... We all know it and have come to expect it. We would have alot more respect for you bird flu carrying jokers if you would be man enough to say "Hell yeah" and go on... But no, you would rather embarrass yourself by getting on here and comparing golf to football and whinning about how everything is slanted against GHS ohhhh we got it so bad.... Please, you boys got athletes, there is no denying that!! You also got the advantage, and there ain't no denying that either!! Live with it, Moss and others including Red at Sachse have down more while being behind the eight ball than Jordan and his stacked deck could dream to accomplish... Night-Night:D

[GoOwls]

You close your eyes tonight with this running through that thick balding head of yours............... The black and gold got it EASY!!! Homer is just that, A HOMER for his ollies... We all know it and have come to expect it. We would have alot more respect for you bird flu carrying jokers if you would be man enough to say "Hell yeah" and go on... But no, you would rather embarrass yourself by getting on here and comparing golf to football and whinning about how everything is slanted against GHS ohhhh we got it so bad.... Please, you boys got athletes, there is no denying that!! You also got the advantage, and there ain't no denying that either!! Live with it, Moss and others including Red at Sachse have down more while being behind the eight ball than Jordan and his stacked deck could dream to accomplish... Night-Night:D

That was weak, even for you, Rough. I accept this victory on behalf of all Garland Owl fans (Ollies) and would like to point out that facts will always overcome disinformation and jealousy, not to mention arrogance and paranoia, but then, I said I wouldn't mention it, didn't I.....I lied. :D :D

[Roughrider]

That was weak, even for you, Rough. I accept this victory on behalf of all Garland Owl fans (Ollies) and would like to point out that facts will always overcome disinformation and jealousy, not to mention arrogance and paranoia, but then, I said I wouldn't mention it, didn't I.....I lied. :D :D


The TRUTH often meets such resistance!! I know that it is harsh and often painful but still a necessary thing to hear! In fact the Ollies should go off on their own, secede from the district... Become their own little district within a district..... wait a minute??? that's the way it is now!:cool:

[garlandowl08]

This thread=:D

(why don't we have a face that is laughing so hard it's crying...thats what I really wanted to put)

[GoOwls]

This thread=:D

(why don't we have a face that is laughing so hard it's crying...thats what I really wanted to put)


Yep, just a bunch of old toots having a jousting match.......but it's fun...ain't it?:D

[OWLBAIT]

With all the name calling, I'm beginning to wonder if one of our most outspoken posters is a snot-nosed kid.

[Stranglehold]

I do believe Florence was sought after and almost gotten but I do not think we had the money to dish out to a prestigous coach like Florence. Someone who applied for the job and was not even considered was none other than David Beaty who should have gotten the job with Jordan at defensive coordinator making for a great staff.

There is not an A.D at any respectable 5A school in texas who will give a position coach his 1st Head coaching job if he has no coordinators experience.
As I recall Jordan was hired only after the likes of Florence and a few others turned it down. Not only that, the kids who were there at the time askedfor Jordan to be the head coach. He had been the DC there for at least 8-10 years while Beaty had been a position coach there for about 2 years I think. For a guy that Mr. Johnson didn't even want I would say Jordan has done a good job.