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lonny23
05-01-2009, 01:46 AM
Guys and gals,

You've seen me gripe for years on this site about Stern and the NBA, but I always try to be fair and I've got to throw the boys a bone this year. I started watching the NBA in 1980 and remember to this day watching Magic Johnson play Center for an injured Kareem in Game 6 of the NBA Finals and take home a title as a rookie and I was hooked on the NBA from that day forward. I was a Mavs fan from franchise day 1 in the 80-81 season and never stopped. Man, I loved the playoff games in the 80's and it was FUN being a Mavs fan as they grew up and turned into a pretty good team after a few years. I was living in New Orleans for Moody Madness, but I remember hearing the score after the game was over and the Mavs won the first playoff series they ever had against the Sonics. I was watching in the next round when Derek Harper dribbled out the clock against the Lakers as a rookie. I said it before, but when I was in high school, we didn't have cable just outside the city limits (We had cable in Pittsburg from 85-86, but never in Mt. Pleasant from 86-91) so I had to go elsewhere to watch Mavs games and most of the playoff games I saw. I was in Pittsburg for that Jordan scoring explosion in Boston in 86. I also remember the Boston-Atlanta series in 88 that was so great as I do the Lakers-Pistons Finals series.

One of the funniest things I ever saw was in the Dallas-Denver series in 88. I was at home and saw Fat Lever beat the Mavs late to go up 2-1 in the series, but Denver never won another game. I went to a friend's house to watch Games 4 and 5 on HSE (The forerunner to Fox Sports Southwest) and Reunion was rocking for Game 4 and Game 5 was a great road win for Dallas. That set up Game 6 back in Dallas and Denver had the lead, but Dallas came firing back in the 4th quarter. We had all kinds of high-fiving and hollering going on as the Mavs were about to close them out and go to the WCF for the first time to play the Lakers and I'd been thinking about playing Magic all year that year. My friend's dad got so excited late in that game that one time he moved his recliner forward about 6 feet and never left his chair. I don't know how he did it, but we fell on the floor laughing and that's the kind of intensity we had watching that game!:D For the record, the biggest outburst of emotion I've shown during an NBA game was throwing a pack of cards when Stockton hit that 3-pointer to beat the Rockets in 97. There's a simple answer for my biggest outbursts not happening in 06 (My kids were around for Games 3, 4, and 5 and were at the game with me for Game 6) or 07 (I was deployed and working during the games).

The point I'm making is the NBA was fun in the 80's. I saw Game 1 of the 85 NBA Finals when Boston killed the Lakers, but LA came back and won the series. I've said it before, but before NBC took over the TV contract, we used to have quite a few blowouts in the playoffs and I was OK with that. Some nights you just don't have it and the other team doesn't miss. Starting with the 90-91 playoffs, we saw the NBA try to keep games close, but it was a fraud and fake and I started enjoying the games less and less. I started to question the legitimacy of the results and it turned into WWE with a ball. I've often said that Michael Jordan and David Stern ruined the NBA (Stern helped give the Bulls a few more titles than they probably deserved, he gave the Lakers and extra one in 02, and he put a bow on the 06 Heat title), but I have another confession to make.

Tim Donaghy brought the NBA back for me. You've heard my rants about the 06 playoffs and that has ultimately been good for basketball because so many people have called the NBA Finals a fraud that Stern had to pull back with the crap he was pulling. My only gripe about the 07 playoffs was that I felt the refs propped up the Cavs in the Detroit series to get LeBron in The Finals, but the Spurs won the title and deserved it (They should've given a ring to the Warriors for knocking out Dallas for them!:p). An amazing thing happened during the 08 playoffs. The Celtics and Lakers were good and deserved to play each other and the NBA didn't try to fix the games and I appreciated it. I think Stern saw the Donaghy scandal meant the gig was up and he better run a legitimate game because he was being watched. Stern actually let the games play out like they should and that meant some blowouts and quick series unlike all the 6 and 7 game series and 3 point games that the NBA had crafted for 15 years.

That brings us to the 09 playoffs. I have no gripes so far about ref funny business. We've had quite a few series end early. We've had extreme blowouts and I love it. In the midst of the NBA not trying to create drama, we've had the Celtics-Bulls series that will go to a Game 7 and has had two OT games, a 2OT game, and a 3OT game tonight. It's one of the best series I've ever seen and it's 100% legit and I love it. What I'm seeing in the NBA this year is what made me love the game to start with. We have 3 rounds to go and there is still time for shady stuff to happen (If it happens, it's probably going to be helping Kobe or LeBron out), but I do truly believe the worst of the shady stuff went out the door with Tim Donaghy in July-August 2007. The guy that was supposed to sink basketball might be the savior and he is for this NBA fan. I said at the time that I hoped the scandal would clean basketball up. If Stern keeps it up, I'll even stop calling him Satan!:D

For reference sakes, let's look at some previous years:

I loved the 88 playoffs and check out how many went the distance (5 games in Round 1 and 7 games in the other 3 rounds).
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1988.html

89 shows you it wasn't fixed with 9 sweeps.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1989.html

90 had 5 go the distance and 3 sweeps, but it also had quite a few end before the magical 6th game that became so prevalent in later years so each team could get 3 homes games. The Bulls were going to win the title in later years, but they weren't going to do it in under 6 games in most years.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1990.html

91 was when NBC took over the contract and wanted Chicago to win with the Lakers on their last hurrah, the Pistons losing their grip, and the Celtics falling off. The 92 NBA Finals against Portland was the first time I thought the NBA was fooling with the games when Chicago had that massive 4th quarter comeback vs. the Blazers. To me, that year is the year that the NBA started making the series go longer and longer on a consistent basis and it's around the time they started making each playoff game stay closer and try to prevent blowouts.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1992.html

By 93 the series were consistently longer than before.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1993.html

94 had a few end early, but it was just like recent years where very few series after Round 1 ended in under 6 games.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1994.html

There were varying length of series for the next decade with some Finals series actually being sweeps and there were some years where it seemed like the NBA wasn't trying to prop up any certain teams, but the head with all the shadiness was the 06 playoffs and it wasn't just The Finals. That playoff year was shady the whole way through like all the crap in the Mavs-Spurs series, the Heat game vs. Chicago when the Bulls shot like 38 free throws to the Heat's 5, how Phoenix had to go to a Game 7 twice and the general vibe of the close games and series lengths.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2006.html

That brings us to the 07 playoffs which had to be more legit with the 06 scrutiny. The 06 playoffs had 4 series end in under 6 games, while the 07 playoffs had 8 of 15 series end in under 6 games. A lot of what I say is my own original material and research and ideas, but the magic 6 game theory was one I heard from somewhere else a few years ago.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2007.html

I don't have any gripes about the 08 playoffs. I was deployed and maybe they kept some games close, but they didn't seem to be making series go longer or try to push teams into the next round.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2008.html

Having 4 of the 8 series so far this year end early gives me hope they won't try to drag out the last 3 rounds.

Slim-Rob
05-01-2009, 02:13 AM
dude the refs helped the mavs beat the spurs are you not happy?? :confused:

hunterbunter
05-01-2009, 02:18 AM
Not to rain on your parade Lonny. But Im willing to bet you'll be crying foul again when Dallas loses.

lonny23
05-01-2009, 02:22 AM
dude the refs helped the mavs beat the spurs are you not happy?? :confused:
You are very confused to come into a thread and ask me if I'm not happy when the whole purpose of the thread is for me to discuss recent events that make me happy.

If you're talking about 2006, I've said often that there are games that the refs helped Dallas vs. the Spurs and the Mavs deserved to win, anyway and I said there was a game Dallas didn't deserve to win. Likewise, there were 2 games the Spurs won and didn't deserve to win and Game 7 was a game that Dallas won, but the refs were heavily on the Spurs side for most of the game. I've been upset since 06 that there were only 2 legit games in the whole series and each team won 1 of those games.

As far as 09 goes, my opinion is that the refs mostly let the teams play. There were non-calls on both sides and some bad calls, but nothing that I'd classify as overly shady to prop up one team over the other. The Spurs were legitimately called for some fouls that they normally don't get called for, but deserve to. Likewise, I saw some bad calls go against the Spurs, but I think the Mavs were the better team and deserved the wins.

lonny23
05-01-2009, 02:31 AM
Not to rain on your parade Lonny. But Im willing to bet you'll be crying foul again when Dallas loses.
I was on this board for the 04 playoffs and said nothing like 06. There was a non-call or two that Dallas didn't get late in close losses to the Kings, but that's pretty much normal late in most games. I was more upset that Dallas players had shots to win the games and would miss.

I was initially mad about Game 6 vs. the Suns in 2005, but after I went back to watch that game again one day, I never said another word about bad refs.

I was griping about the refs all through the Spurs series in 06 and never stopped griping that year. I even griped about non-calls on Shaq elbowing Dirk and Stack in the Games 1 and 2 wins. I really blew a gasket after Games 3, 5, and 6 and the intensity only got stronger.

I never griped one bit about refs in the Warrior series in 07.

I said nothing about the refs in the Hornet series last year. My gripes in the last 2 playoff years were squarely focused on Avery Johnson.

Rain someplace else. I've consistently cried foul about 1998, 2002, and 2006. I guess that means I'm due in 2010!:D I haven't griped about the other years with any fervor. I can't say if I'll gripe or not this year. Dallas might get beat down and I'll say it. If I think they're getting ripped, I'll say it. I'll just hope for them to win!:D

lonny23
05-01-2009, 02:39 AM
Since I mentioned it earlier, I never would've thought when I threw the cards in the 97 playoffs that would be the last time I saw the Rockets play a game past Round 1 for 12 years. Congrats on FINALLY making it back to Round 2!:cool: Last night on ebay, I was finally able to find one of the late 90's Rockets jerseys in an adult size that fits me and isn't one of those crap screen print versions. I looked for one of those jerseys quite a few times last year and they were always kids jerseys or a crappy screen printed jersey. I know Rockets fans like to give me grief, but I'm not the enemy. I'm a proud owner of old school Olajuwon and Drexler jerseys from the 80's and 90's (Cougars and Rockets) and I even found some NBA Finals patches from 1995 to get sewn on the jerseys.

lonny23
05-01-2009, 03:03 AM
I would also like to discuss perspective. The Mavs get called losers, but the truth is they're nothing like what Denver and Houston has done over the years. The Mavs were horrible in the 90's but have 9 straight 50 win seasons this decade and have been a decent playoff team:

01 Round 2 (4-6)
02 Round 2 (4-4)
03 Round 3 (10-10)
04 Round 1 (1-4)
05 Round 2 (6-7)
06 Round 4 (14-9)
07 Round 1 (2-4)
08 Round 1 (1-4)
09 Now Round 2 (4-1)

46-49 this decade and I know it's not as good as Detroit, SA, or LA!:D

I saw Dikembe beat Seattle in 94 and since then here is what Denver has done:

95 Round 1 (0-3)
04 Round 1 (1-4)
05 Round 1 (1-4)
06 Round 1 (1-4)
07 Round 1 (1-4)
08 Round 1 (0-4)
09 Now Round 2 (4-1)

8-24 since 1995.

I saw Utah beat Houston in 97 and look at since then:

98 Round 1 (2-3)
99 Round 1 (1-3)
04 Round 1 (1-4)
05 Round 1 (3-4)
07 Round 1 (3-4)
08 Round 1 (2-4)
09 Now Round 2 (4-2)

16-24 since 98.

shs13
05-01-2009, 12:48 PM
healthy manu=spurs beat dallas in round 1

lonny23
05-01-2009, 01:28 PM
healthy manu=spurs beat dallas in round 1
1. A healthy Manu didn't beat Dallas the last time in 2006.
2. Why do people even want to throw out him being healthy when he gets hurt so much?

svhorns
05-01-2009, 02:20 PM
healthy manu=spurs beat dallas in round 1

A healthy Manu is a healthy anteater...

I wonder if Manu can balance a basketball on that schnauze