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adcwalker
06-15-2005, 04:07 PM
So how do you think this game will go. Some background, Texas beat Michigan by a point or two in the Rose Bowl. Ohio State beat Michigan by 16 at Ohio State. I live in Texas and was raised in Ohio. I'm an Ohio State fan but love the way football is the state sport of Texas. I see this as a game that will be a classic just like the 3 OT National Championship game between Miami and Ohio State a couple of years ago.

Lp78
06-15-2005, 04:18 PM
Ohio State by 10+

mtbray
06-15-2005, 05:06 PM
So how do you think this game will go. Some background, Texas beat Michigan by a point or two in the Rose Bowl. Ohio State beat Michigan by 16 at Ohio State. I live in Texas and was raised in Ohio. I'm an Ohio State fan but love the way football is the state sport of Texas. I see this as a game that will be a classic just like the 3 OT National Championship game between Miami and Ohio State a couple of years ago.

Keep in mind each teams lost players after the season. I'm not sure if Ohio State lost very many important players, but I know the hit at Texas was minimal.

wide-e-wide
06-15-2005, 08:45 PM
Too early to say.
I would like to think Texas will be prepared for the "shoe"
and play like I know they can.
However, playing there is tough. It wouldn't take much for
the momentum to shift and OSU could really pour it on 'em.
In June my answer is I don't know.
In September.....I hope I will feel better about playing them in Ohio.

Texasfrog
06-15-2005, 09:35 PM
Too early to say.
I would like to think Texas will be prepared for the "shoe"
and play like I know they can.
However, playing there is tough. It wouldn't take much for
the momentum to shift and OSU could really pour it on 'em.
In June my answer is I don't know.
In September.....I hope I will feel better about playing them in Ohio.

I would feel better if I knew what type of running game Texas would have this coming season. Alot depends on Selvin Young in my opinion. Hopefully he can get his act together and come on and be the player that everyone knows he can be .......

wide-e-wide
06-15-2005, 10:28 PM
Yep...exactly.
Couple that with the fact that Romaunce Taylor and Quon Cosby are
unproven backs...there is a lot left to be seen.

TheDuke
06-16-2005, 09:38 AM
Don't leave out Chris Ogbonnaya!! He is 6'1 220 back from Strake J.!! He can play also. Texas has so many backs that is my least concern. Our Defense has to step it up BIG! We gotta stop Ginn Jr. if we are gonna win this game period! Also got to block AJ HAWK or he will kill all our backs! This game will set the tone for the season!

farmerfan
06-16-2005, 10:32 AM
Ginn is a important role player, but if you put to much emphasis on stoping him, Santonio Holmes will have a breakout game. The OSU defense is stout, led at LB by AJ Hawk, Bobby Carpenter and Anthony S.(can never spell is name right). Their secondary is big and physical, I dont see much scoring in this game, I feel that Texas is coming in the more talented team, but playing at night in Columbus will be a huge advantage for OSU. I think OSU beats Texas, in a great football game, I also feel that Texas will rebound from a early loss to OSU to go on and beat OU. I think this is going to be one of the better football games played all season long, their are so many matchups that I am looking forward to taht I can not wait for September 10

TheDuke
06-16-2005, 11:29 AM
I agree!! I am very pumped about this upcoming season! Who is the QB for OSU this year? Who is the RB?

farmerfan
06-16-2005, 11:40 AM
Justin Zwick will start the season, Troy Smith has to sit out a game this year but will be back for the Texas game, I believe it was Smith that led OSU out of that 3 game losing streak last year and was able to breathe some life into the OSU offense.
As far as RB goes, I think they are going to go by a commitee, but I may be wrong, from what I can tell, it looks as if OSU will become more of a pass first and run second type of team this year.

TheDuke
06-16-2005, 11:44 AM
That will be good for TX then. If Smith's 1st game will be against us, then I would say that is a advantage for us! I hope we pull it out and then beat OU because I would love to see us in the National Championship!

adcwalker
06-16-2005, 04:17 PM
The primary RB should be Antonio Pittman. He will be a Soph. Started a few games last year. There is another RB that he is fighting with to be the starter but can remember the name right know. Receivers will be Holmes and Ginn. I think Smith is the more mobile QB between him and Zwick. He reminds me of V. Young. Maybe not as fast but I think he throws better. Both OSU QB's throw the ball well. I think the TE might play a big part in this game. OSU defense is tough and Linebackers are probably the best in the nation. The LB's need to come to play to contain V. Young. I think OSU learned a lot watching him in the Rose Bowl against Michigan.

Lufkin_Class_Of_08
06-16-2005, 06:07 PM
I will pull for Texas for 2 reasons

1. they are representing the state
2. I hate Ohio State

dragons08
06-16-2005, 09:22 PM
I will pull for Texas for 2 reasons

1. they are representing the state
2. I hate Ohio State
good enough reasons for me

LarryFine
06-16-2005, 09:41 PM
Keep in mind each teams lost players after the season. I'm not sure if Ohio State lost very many important players, but I know the hit at Texas was minimal.Are you KIDDING? UT lost their best D player & the only reason the OU game was even close last season. DJ was a HUGE loss on D. Then who does UT have at RB to take some focus off of Vince? UT took some pretty big hits, they are still loaded, but they lost 2 very big pieces.

The Horseshoe is a very tough place to play. I can't see UT winning this game. I'll be rooting for them, but I don't expect a win. It would be a huge win if they did and would set a great tone for their season.

ktchamp97
06-16-2005, 11:16 PM
DJ and Ced are two of the best players the state of Texas has produced and they will be missed for sure.

But...You can't assume that Texas won't be able to win big games without them. In the Rose Bowl, neither Ced or DJ played very well, but, instead, younger players like Vince, Ramonce, Tim Crowder, Derek Lokey, and Aaron Harris stepped up huge.

Expect to see a RB by committee from Texas this fall. Selvin Young, as most forget, was seriously challenging Benson for playing time when he was healthy. Unfortunately, he has proven to be quite injury prone. Although all of the talent is there to be a star, it's unreasonable to expect Selvin to carry the mail at this point.

Ramonce Taylor is a guy I expect to have a huge season. He had an excellent spring and has positioned himself to get plenty of carries this fall. Last year he averaged 10 yards per carry. Taylor won't be the bruiser Ced was, but he will be a threat to go the distance every time he touches the ball. The Horns may experiment with both Ramonce and Selvin in the backfield together...that is scary.

Last but not least, Jamaal Charles will see his share of carries too. There's no way this guy doesn't see the field this year...he's just too talented.

Any of these three guys next to, or behind Vince Young in the backfield is going to produce major headaches for opposing defenses...especially when you consider how good the offensive line is going to be. The slightest crease for any of these guys is bound to spring a big gain. Of course, as explosive as they are, it's reasonable to expect many more minimal gainers and even negative plays, because none of them will be as reliable or as powerful as Ced in short yardage situations. Texas may have to pass more in the red zone than they have in the past four years. To me, Cedric's production in the red zone will be what is missed the most.

It will certainly be different without Ced, but I don't think you'll see much of an overall production drop off...if any at all.

jtk1519
06-17-2005, 12:30 AM
Anybody remember the old, "UT will suck because they lost Roy Williams and the rest of the Big 3." 11 wins and a Rose Bowl trophy later and we're hearing it all over again. Some people never learn.

GTown02
06-17-2005, 01:45 AM
You obviously cant replace a DJ, but Aaron Harris is almost as great, and even a better hitter.

jtk1519
06-17-2005, 02:41 AM
Aaron Harris more than proved himself in the Rose Bowl when he made people forget DJ for a few minutes... he was that good.

As for the argument that without Cedric, defenses will be able to key in on Vince. This is a flawed argument because Cedric was ineffective in the Rose Bowl. He went down with that early injury and wasnt Cedric anymore. Michigan saw this and started keying in on Vince more. 200 rushing yards and 4 TDs later and now Michigan realizes that you can key in on Vince all you want... that doesnt mean you'll stop him.

Vince's best friend this year probably wont be the RB like last year, but it should be his receivers. If Texas can get better play from the receivers, that will force teams to respect the pass more and that will force the DBs to stay back in coverage instead of coming up to stop the run. In other words, no more 8 man fronts. That will help to open up running lanes for VY and the RBs and that is why I think the running game doesnt lose much steam.

Of course, Texas will lose all the power that Cedric brought to the game, but in his place will be much... MUCH more speed. Take your pick. Selvin, Ramonce, Wilkerson, Charles, etc. There will be a sick amount of speed in that backfield no matter who is lined up a TB providing a look that other teams havent seen yet. Then you'll still get some of the power from Houston and later Melton... just to keep the defense on their toes. Personally, I would like to see Vince lined up in the shot gun with the freak speedster in Ramonce to one side and the 6'3 270 Henry Melton lined up on the other. How the hell do you defend that?

GTown02
06-17-2005, 03:20 AM
Hopefully Selvin can stay healthy, he sure is good when he is! :cool:

LarryFine
06-17-2005, 05:32 AM
Ced kept Michigan from concentrating on Young, he played very well in the Rose Bowl. Cedric was ineffective in the Rose Bowl because Michigan took him out of the game, but they couldn't take both out. No Ohio State doesn't have to. They can focus on shutting down Young and then Taylor or Charles has to take over. It isn't like Vincent Young is going to beat anyone passing.

Selvin Young, as most forget, was in a junior college during spring work outs and may not even be with the team in August.

I think Ramonce Taylor is better than anyone thinks but not an elite RB like Cedric. Charles is interesting.

Plus, the Longhorns lost the two defensive coaches that brought the mental toughness sorely lacking since Mack Brown took over. We will have to wait and see if that keeps going or if they go back to the Carl Reese days.

ktk1519, I don't think I ever said UT will suck, I only posted surprise people talked about the minimal hit UT took.

ktchamp97
06-17-2005, 06:34 AM
LarryFine,

I know it seems counterintuitive, but it's not just UT homers who think that Texas will be better this year. Just about every preseason publication has Texas ranked higher than last year and having a better season. That, and the return of players like Selvin Young, Jordan Shipley, Quan Cosby, Eric Foreman, and Mike Williams is the reason that most UT fans are not as concerned about the loss of Ced and DJ.

As for the defense, all UT did to replace Greg Robinson was go out and hire the country's #1 defensive coordinator, Gene Chizik. Chizik led Auburn to an undefeated season and the #1 scoring defense in the nation. He will have even more talent to work with at UT. Nobody is worried about the defense.


It isn't like Vincent Young is going to beat anyone passing.
:D Not that he hasn't done it already...but...let's revisit this quote next January

rattlerbacker
06-17-2005, 07:59 AM
It isn't like Vincent Young is going to beat anyone passing.


I hope OSU, and every Texas opponent for that matter, thinks this way and plans their defensive scheme accordingly.

Its as for sure as for sure can be that Selvin will be playing this fall. Biggest concern is keeping him healthy.

LarryFine
06-17-2005, 09:28 AM
I know it seems counterintuitive, but it's not just UT homers who think that Texas will be better this year. Just about every preseason publication has Texas ranked higher than last year and having a better season. That, and the return of players like Selvin Young, Jordan Shipley, Quan Cosby, Eric Foreman, and Mike Williams is the reason that most UT fans are not as concerned about the loss of Ced and DJ.Well then shut my mouth. The preseason mags never over rated UT in the past. No, wait, that is nearly a yearly occurance.

Quan hasn't played football in 4 seasons but he is going to step right in at the highest college football level?

Selvin may be there, then again, he may be at that junior college or somewhere else. Jordan Shipley is coming off a serious knee injury where not everyone returns true to form.

No, Vincent Young isn't going to beat anyone passing. That just isn't going to happen. UT had to bring Chance Mock against Tech's worst D in college football and he showed no signs of improving since.

UT recruits well every year and will have a 10 plus win season, but don't get mad at me for being a little objective. Longhorn fans love to make fun of us Red Raiders for being myopic, but you guys aren't any different.

Then you got to understand OSU is as talented and well coached as UT. They won a bowl game basically without a QB. They have two QBs from the Elite 11 camp. They have the most explosive player in college football. Their D has a great ability to put a bad play behind them and shut down the next play. They are the best at goal line stands than any team I ever seen. This isn't like the Rose Bowl played on a nuetral site. UT will play at one of the toughest stadiums to travel to.

But what do I know? UT will dominate. ;)

ktchamp97
06-17-2005, 10:20 AM
Hey, I never said anything about us walking into the Shoe and coming out unscathed. We will be fortunate to escape with a victory, and that's the truth. I was merely addressing the comments about the loss of DJ and Ced and how they'll affect the team.

Sorry, but I'm far from myopic as a college football fan. I brought out the positives and negatives about losing a phenomenal player like Cedric, but I was pointing out that the loss may not hit as hard as the casual observer might think.

And no, preseason mags don't tell you everything. The point was that every one of them knows what we lost, yet they still rank us as high if not higher than last year. Whether it's too high or not is not the point...it's relative to where they had us last year.


No, Vincent Young isn't going to beat anyone passing. That just isn't going to happen. UT had to bring Chance Mock against Tech's worst D in college football and he showed no signs of improving since.

As I recall, last year Vince was 10-15 for 142, 1 TD and ran for 158 yards and 4 TD's against Tech while leading UT to a 51-21 win in Lubbock and sent most of the crowd home early...and Mock didn't play a meaningful down.

In 2003, Vince completed 16 of 25 for 213 and 2 TD's against Tech...Yes, they brought in Mock, but Vince was hardly struggling.

For his career, against Tech Vince is 26-41 (63%) for 355 yards, 3 TD's and 2 int's with 211 yards rushing and 4 rushing TD's...and you're saying he can't pass, and we're the ones who're myopic?

I'm not mad at you at all, I'm just pointing out facts.

As good as I think Texas will be this fall, I will be absolutely floored if they go into Columbus and beat tOSU. Texas has struggled in early season games every year...and against far lesser competition. The Buckeyes will have the best defense we see all year and they simply don't make mistakes. They're not a team we can out-talent, we'll have to outplay them and that will be difficult...especially with a lame-armed 6'5 running back trying to somehow direct an offense with no backs and no receivers. ;)

jtk1519
06-17-2005, 11:26 AM
You're right. Vince will never beat a team passing...

http://www.jcdenton40.com/UTvKU04-TonyJeffrey-TD(DivX).avi


Ced kept Michigan from concentrating on Young, he played very well in the Rose Bowl. Cedric was ineffective in the Rose Bowl because Michigan took him out of the game, but they couldn't take both out.

I'm afraid you are wrong in your account of the game. Benson was hurt on one of the first drives of the game. He came out of the game and walked it off, but returned soon after. He just wasnt Cedric after that. Cedric did not play very well as his 3.0 ypc and 0 TDs would attest. It had nothing to do with the Michigan defense because as Michigan folks will tell you themselves, they came into that game willing to concede that Cedric was going to get his yards. The focus of the Michigan D was to stop Vince... they failed.

rattlerbacker
06-17-2005, 12:16 PM
Wow, I guess Texas is the only team in history where players never improve.

Vince hasn't improved his passing since the Tech game his freshman year? Vince won't beat anyone passing? Well how about these historical facts?

Vs. Ok. St. as a sophomore set the school record for completion percentage, going 18 for 22, 2 Ints and 1 TD, 278 yards, 15.44 per completion.

Vs. Kansas as a sophomore, 21 yard TD strike to Tony Jeffrey with 11 seconds left in the game to win the game.

Vs. Michigan in the Rose Bowl, went 5 for 7 in the 4th quarter for 79 yards, 15.8 yards per completion.

Yeah, Vince hasn't improved at all since he was a RS freshman. On top of that, we can't expect any of our RS and true freshmen receivers from last year to improve either. Shipley won't play even though he was 90% or better during the spring, ahead of schedule. And Quan, one of the top athletes in the state, if not the nation, won't remember how to catch a football or run a route even though he's already in school and working out all summer.

Shoot, I wonder how we'll even win a game this season.

GTown02
06-17-2005, 05:45 PM
Shoot, I wonder how we'll even win a game this season.
If we win 1 game, its a successful season! :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

businesstron
06-18-2005, 07:18 AM
Vince might have to beat OSU with his arm, OSU plays pretty decent against big 12 teams. But going by Phil Steele Texas has the #1 O-line in the country but OSU has the #2 LB Unit and the #2 Receiving unit in the country BUT Texas DB are ranked #5. Overall it's going to be two pretty good Defenses. The thing is that OSU usually does well against QBs built from Vince's model(well I can only think of El Roberson), mainly because of their terrific LBs. But if Mac Brown or whatever his OC name is doesn't call a bland game Texas can win. It is tough to accomplish anything @ OSU but that game will definitly be a classic.

pack0808
06-19-2005, 12:27 AM
i would never bet against osu at the shoe and i do not care who they play!! my iowa hawks embarrassed osu last year but that was in iowa. it would have been a different story at the shoe where iowa has not won in forever. i am telling you that place is tough to win at. scary homefield advantage!!

wide-e-wide
06-19-2005, 12:29 AM
True...
I am worried more about that one than the one at the Cotton Bowl
in Oct.
If UT can pull that one off....look out.

GarlandOwl06
06-19-2005, 02:17 PM
I think if Texas can win they might beat OU and go undefeated, until they go to Kyle Field! But I'm pretty sure they will lose badly.

farmerfan
06-19-2005, 05:57 PM
No way will OSU beat Texas bad, I am not a horn fan, and would love to see them get killed, but you have to be realistic, OSU will not kill Texas. If the Bucks win, I look for it to be a close game, remember OSU perfected the art of winning close games. Texas is to loaded to get blown out in any game this year, and that includes playin in the Shoe.

wide-e-wide
06-19-2005, 07:10 PM
Hey Farmer...did you see the piece on HS spotlight on FSN about
Lewisville and their coach?...it was a good story. He was given an award...

farmerfan
06-19-2005, 08:11 PM
No I did not catch it
However it probably was a award to recogonize coach Ronnie Gage who has stepped down from his coaching duties to take over the AD duties of the LISD. He is as class a guy as I have ever met and represented our community and school with nothing but dignity for the past 14 seasons. He may not be considered a legend around the state, but he will forever be a legend and icon to people around Lewisville.

dragonsdaddy
06-19-2005, 09:27 PM
i'd say that he has the whole metromess in his corner as far as respect.

jtk1519
06-19-2005, 09:34 PM
Ohio State wont blow Texas out because they just dont score much. That is what Jim Tressel is known for... great defense and an offense that is just good enough to not blow the game. Kinda like Baltimore when they won the Superbowl a couple of years ago.

The average score of Ohio State games last year was OSU 24 - Opponents 18... not exactlly a team that blows people out. This is a team that averaged just 320 yards of total offense a game last year while giving up 332 yards of offense per game. Texas outscored thier opponents last year by an average score of 35-16 while averaging 465 yards of offense a game and giving up 320 yards a game.

Combine all that with the fact that Texas brings in what many call a top 10 defense and a top 10 offense and I find little statistical evidence to support the claim that Texas will lose... much less get blown out.

stevefoxsc
06-19-2005, 10:01 PM
I will pull for Texas for 2 reasons

1. they are representing the state
2. I hate Ohio State

fine for me and if i may add

i hate the way they drive up there!!

pack0808
06-19-2005, 11:51 PM
i do not think ohio st will beat texas bad i say more like a 24-10 score. you can throw all that statistics stuff out when you go to the shoe because they make almost every team play ugly there. i will be pulling for texas even though i am a huge big 10 fan because texas is my 2nd favorite team behind iowa. now when ut plays a&m i will be rooting for texas to win but i want all the lufkin player's to have great games. is that asking for too much?? lol if texas can win at the shoe they will beat ou in my opinion. if this game was at texas i think the longhorns would win by a td. this team is just different team at the shoe i am telling you. not to mention they have finished in the top 10 3 years in a row i believe?? and just won a national championship a few years ago. the buckeyes are tough and they usually make teams play really ugly.

GTown02
06-20-2005, 12:27 AM
and just won a national championship a few years ago
Miami should have won, but lets stay on topic...

I hope that Texas can beat OSU, but *IF* they do lose, it will be a pretty close game.
I cant wait for that game in the Cotton Bowl...

farmerfan
06-20-2005, 12:53 AM
Pack
I think the Bucks have been top 10 2 out of the last 3 years. Last year they had 4 losses.
You are right about how the Bucks seem to always make teams play ugly up there, I have never been able to watch a complete OSU game under Tressel with the exception of the national title game. Something about those games are just plain boring. The best part of this game is going to be the fundamental tackling of OSU going up against Vincent, the difference in OSU and Michigan is that OSU usually will not miss the tackles that Michigan did in the Rose Bowl, if Vince finds a way to do that in Columbus then the heisman will be a two man race between Leinart and Young.

pack0808
06-20-2005, 11:20 PM
you are right farmer i guess i was thrown off because ohio st dominated somebody in a bowl game last year?? i know iowa has finished #8 three years in a row though. that is strange to finish at the same number 3 years in a row. hey garland nothing is worst then a should of could of would of fan but lets stay on subject. lol the fact is, ohio st is seriously a tough team to beat anywhere but especially at the shoe. iowa beat ohio st by over 3 td's last year but it is a different story when they play them at the shoe.

GTown02
06-21-2005, 12:25 PM
hey garland nothing is worst then a should of could of would of fan but lets stay on subject

Thats exactly what I said in my original reply....