Celina

[stevefoxsc]

This 3a team has more potential than alot of 5a and i know some of you will come in here and go what!?!? thats a 3a team 5a is far superior.... no not really.....

They have posted more shut out's than any other team this year so in all honestly who think's that they could compete in the 5a i honestly believe so

[GTown02]

I watched them play Hamilton on friday night, and I have never seen a bigger gap in talent between two teams. Celina is a great 2a team and will go far in 2a playoffs. I think they play Crawford friday night.

[Redneckn]

You're gonna get to hear about a hundred lectures on "depth".

[grayowl60]

No> Highland Park? YES!

[singularity]

I think they could beat the majority of 5A teams, but I don't think they can hang with the top 50...maybe more.

[toonman]

I think they could beat the majority of 5A teams, but I don't think they can hang with the top 50...maybe more.

I checked Jerry's Texas Football Ratings and Celina has a rating score of 176.42. If this score is transposed into the 5A category, Celina would rank at#48. However, the next 20 ranked temas lower than 48 are the following :-
Cy Falls
Leander
Houston Madison
The Woodlands
Beaumont West Brook
Victoria Memorial
Pharr-San Juan-Alamo
Lake Highlands
Denton Ryan
DeSoto
Lubbock Monterey
North Mesquite
Mesquite
Garland Rowlett
Pasadena Dobie
San Antonio Churchill
San Antonio Marshall
Grapevine
Humble
Houston Memorial

I do not see Celina beating Grapevine for example. I think Celina would be ranked at about 150, with Arlington Lamar, Arlington Martin, Lakeview Centennial, Houston Bellaire and Hurst Bell ranked 151 through 155.

[GoRangers]

Celina is NOT 3A. They're 2A.

[singularity]

You're right. They are 2A DII.

[Butch Fifield]

I doubt there are any 5a teams bad enough that they could lose to Celina. I have seen many 2a playoff games, including Celina's, and the difference is huge.

[gritty52]

If you live in the metroplex Celina plays Crawford at Pennington in Bedford on Friday night I believe! Will probably go and then onto Waco Sat. with my Trojans!!!:D :D :D :D

[WildcatFan]

I am afraid not or at least not a majority of the time.

They could beat a bunch of sub average and average teams and who knows could probably squeek out a win against a good one here or there you never know on any given Friday night.

But put them in 8-5A and they would be dead last, at least for a few years eventually with talent they would be used to playing at that level all the time and would be competitive.

I think its less about your talent and more about the talent of your opponents. You do not get beat up enough week after week to endure a 10 game 5A season.

So my answer is NO!

Now enough about 2A who cares this is a 5A fourm!

[svrangerfan]

I doubt there are any 5a teams bad enough that they could lose to Celina. I have seen many 2a playoff games, including Celina's, and the difference is huge.


After Carter, Kimball, Woodrow, Lincoln & maybe Madison, Celina would thump any other Dallas school & probably any Fort Worth inner city school. They have done it in the past.

[ruffshod]

They could possibly place 4th or 5th in 23-5a.

[farmerfan]

I am afraid not or at least not a majority of the time.

They could beat a bunch of sub average and average teams and who knows could probably squeek out a win against a good one here or there you never know on any given Friday night.

But put them in 8-5A and they would be dead last, at least for a few years eventually with talent they would be used to playing at that level all the time and would be competitive.

I think its less about your talent and more about the talent of your opponents. You do not get beat up enough week after week to endure a 10 game 5A season.

So my answer is NO!

Now enough about 2A who cares this is a 5A fourm!

They would beat The Colony and quite possibly Lewisville.

[CoveFan05]

Marshall could hang in 5a

[rancher52]

They would beat The Colony and quite possibly Lewisville.
As good as Celina has been at their level, to assume they would regularly beat 5 a schools is a stretch. I am a fan of the small school and have seen Celina play 5 or six times when GA was still there. There is a dramatic difference in overall team speed, size and depth. As an earlier poster said, they may be somewhat competitive with the lower 20-25 % of the 5A schools but even that would not produce a consistant winner. I don't think they would beat schools like The Colony or Lewisville.

[farmerfan]

As good as Celina has been at their level, to assume they would regularly beat 5 a schools is a stretch. I am a fan of the small school and have seen Celina play 5 or six times when GA was still there. There is a dramatic difference in overall team speed, size and depth. As an earlier poster said, they may be somewhat competitive with the lower 20-25 % of the 5A schools but even that would not produce a consistant winner. I don't think they would beat schools like The Colony or Lewisville.

Did you see The Colony or Lewisville this year?
If not, they were small, slow and very young. Also they looked lost out on the field. I also dont think they would beat many 5A teams, but after witnessing the worst Lewisville team of my lifetime I am convinced teams like Celina and Newton in 2A and Gainesville in 3A would all have beat Lewisville and The Colony this year.

[rancher52]

Did you see The Colony or Lewisville this year?
If not, they were small, slow and very young. Also they looked lost out on the field. I also dont think they would beat many 5A teams, but after witnessing the worst Lewisville team of my lifetime I am convinced teams like Celina and Newton in 2A and Gainesville in 3A would all have beat Lewisville and The Colony this year.
I saw the Colony (and I know that Lewisville was the only one of the two to win a game), but the Colony is much faster than the Celina team. As you move up into 3a and on to 4a the story is different and you will find more teams that definitely would compete consistently on a 5a level. At 2a the differences are just to pronounced to overcome. Look at how teams have been successful when they step down just one level. Grapevine was struggling when they opened Heritage and they immediately won a state championship. Even Richland was very successful when they stepped back to 4 a a few years ago (they had trouble winning 2 or 3 in 5a). Now that they have returned to 5a they are struggling again. The numbers do make a difference.

[farmerfan]

I saw the Colony (and I know that Lewisville was the only one of the two to win a game), but the Colony is much faster than the Celina team. As you move up into 3a and on to 4a the story is different and you will find more teams that definitely would compete consistently on a 5a level. At 2a the differences are just to pronounced to overcome. Look at how teams have been successful when they step down just one level. Grapevine was struggling when they opened Heritage and they immediately won a state championship. Even Richland was very successful when they stepped back to 4 a a few years ago (they had trouble winning 2 or 3 in 5a). Now that they have returned to 5a they are struggling again. The numbers do make a difference.

But Celina is one who stepped up a level and went to 3A and had a combined record of 21-3. Celina has speed of its own and a swarming defense to counter what anything TC or L'ville would have thrown at them. Plus the coaching of Butch Ford and his staff is one of the best around. L'ville and TC were just that bad this year and would not be able to contend with the discipline or coaching of Celina. I dont think Celina would be a playoff team in 5A, but I do think there are some 5A teams they would beat.

[rancher52]

But Celina is one who stepped up a level and went to 3A and had a combined record of 21-3. Celina has speed of its own and a swarming defense to counter what anything TC or L'ville would have thrown at them. Plus the coaching of Butch Ford and his staff is one of the best around. L'ville and TC were just that bad this year and would not be able to contend with the discipline or coaching of Celina. I dont think Celina would be a playoff team in 5A, but I do think there are some 5A teams they would beat.
Okay whatever... but is Celina 2a or 3a or have they gone up and then back down? I thought they were 2a.

[farmerfan]

Okay whatever... but is Celina 2a or 3a or have they gone up and then back down? I thought they were 2a.

They are 2A now, they were 3A in 2002 and 2003. Their first year in 3A they went 10-0 in the regular season and lost 21-20 to dangerfield in the 2nd round of the playoffs. In 2003 they played Gilmer tough and we all know how good Gilmer was in 2003 as well as how fast they were. This Celina team is on par with the teams of 99 and 2000 that had Adam Herrin at QB, Randall Cherry at DE, Jackie Wyatt, Jeriamiah Raimer at RB, Jordan Martin at RB and FS and Clay Evans at LB.
I am not saying you are wrong and I am right, I just want to defend why I think they could beat Lewisville and The Colony. Trust me Im not proud to admit they would beat the Farmers but sometimes the truth can hurt.

[rancher52]

They are 2A now, they were 3A in 2002 and 2003. Their first year in 3A they went 10-0 in the regular season and lost 21-20 to dangerfield in the 2nd round of the playoffs. In 2003 they played Gilmer tough and we all know how good Gilmer was in 2003 as well as how fast they were. This Celina team is on par with the teams of 99 and 2000 that had Adam Herrin at QB, Randall Cherry at DE, Jackie Wyatt, Jeriamiah Raimer at RB, Jordan Martin at RB and FS and Clay Evans at LB.
I am not saying you are wrong and I am right, I just want to defend why I think they could beat Lewisville and The Colony. Trust me Im not proud to admit they would beat the Farmers but sometimes the truth can hurt.
I gotcha... I had forgotten completely that they played in 3a for that time.

[GoOwls]

Celina could compete with all mid-level 5A programs amd some of the ones into the top 50. There are some districts that Celina would make the playoffs in and would be a top 10 team in Region 4. Once you get past the San Antonio schools, there isn't much there. Celinas' speed and discipline would beat all but the top 5 or 6 SA area schools. I've seen them for years. They have put a number of kids in D1 and D2 and have shut down a number of highly touted D1 and D2 recruits, Kwan Cosby, of Mart, now a wideout for the Longhorns, for example. To ignore sheer talent by prejudicing them for being in a lower classification is pure ignorance of football and football talent. It is what it is, no matter where it is classified.

[drgnbkr]

Celina would be able to beat some 5-A teams but could not crack the top 20...too few kids

[farmerfan]

Celina could compete with all mid-level 5A programs amd some of the ones into the top 50. There are some districts that Celina would make the playoffs in and would be a top 10 team in Region 4. Once you get past the San Antonio schools, there isn't much there. Celinas' speed and discipline would beat all but the top 5 or 6 SA area schools. I've seen them for years. They have put a number of kids in D1 and D2 and have shut down a number of highly touted D1 and D2 recruits, Kwan Cosby, of Mart, now a wideout for the Longhorns, for example. To ignore sheer talent by prejudicing them for being in a lower classification is pure ignorance of football and football talent. It is what it is, no matter where it is classified.


What they did to Cosby was impressive. He still managed a few big impressive runs, but they frustrated him all game. Another team they shut down taht I thought they would not was in 98 against Stanton and Kyle Herm. I thought Celina would not beat Stanton and that Herm would run all over them, but that was not the case. They also were able to counter the speed of Elysion Fields twice in state championship games. Most of the staff that was there under Coach Moore is still in tact so the program has not dropped off at all.
Other teams that come to mind that Celina beat that they should not have are:
Garison
Mart
Stanton
Gainesville
Alto and more.

[rancher52]

Celina could compete with all mid-level 5A programs amd some of the ones into the top 50. There are some districts that Celina would make the playoffs in and would be a top 10 team in Region 4. Once you get past the San Antonio schools, there isn't much there. Celinas' speed and discipline would beat all but the top 5 or 6 SA area schools. I've seen them for years. They have put a number of kids in D1 and D2 and have shut down a number of highly touted D1 and D2 recruits, Kwan Cosby, of Mart, now a wideout for the Longhorns, for example. To ignore sheer talent by prejudicing them for being in a lower classification is pure ignorance of football and football talent. It is what it is, no matter where it is classified.
You honestly think they would compete with programs in the top 50 of 5A? They have not had a lot of success in their history when they played above their classification... 1-7 against SLC; 0-2 against Rockwall; 3-3 against Coppell. I know of a few D2 recruits but you would have to give me the list of D1 recruits... and I would think it was a real short list. There is just no way a team drawing talent from a school with less than 390 people is going to consistently compete against schools who have enrollments of 2 to 4 thousand. They have been extremely successful in their own right, but to say someone with a different opinion than you is ignorant of football is just way off base. I have seen them play several times and have also seen a lot of their competitors play... and I know enough football in my 50+ years to warrant something more than ignorance.

[Redneckn]

I can't believe this was asked and not one person has mentioned the word "depth". Y'all let me down...:p

[rancher52]

I can't believe this was asked and not one person has mentioned the word "depth". Y'all let me down...:p
I did ... see post #16. For that matter, in #26 I talked about the number of players and the fact many go two ways.

[GoOwls]

You honestly think they would compete with programs in the top 50 of 5A? They have not had a lot of success in their history when they played above their classification... 1-7 against SLC; 0-2 against Rockwall; 3-3 against Coppell. I know of a few D2 recruits but you would have to give me the list of D1 recruits... and I would think it was a real short list. There is just no way a team drawing talent from a school with less than 390 people is going to consistently compete against schools who have enrollments of 2 to 4 thousand. They have been extremely successful in their own right, but to say someone with a different opinion than you is ignorant of football is just way off base. I have seen them play several times and have also seen a lot of their competitors play... and I know enough football in my 50+ years to warrant something more than ignorance.

I said COMPETE, if you would read more closely. I didn't say they would necessarily win a bunch of games, just be at least competitive with the lower echilon top 50 teams. I will get you the info on the D1 and D2 recruits and even a pro player, as soon as possible. Please check back later and I'll post the info as soon as I get it.

[BAMF cowboy]

in an average district, they'd be an average team, around .500 each year

[farmerfan]

Some of the D1 players I can think of are:
The year is the fall of their senior year.

Jarrod Martin-UNT 1995
Randall Cherry-Texas Tech 2000
Adam Herrin - Rice 2000
Jerimiah Ramier- Rice 1999
Derrek Long- Baylor 1998
Frank Maddox - Arizona State 1998

with the exception of Martin, I played against all those guys in HS. Some tough players and even better men. Not one of them was a punk and conducted themselves in a manner which you would hope kids would.

[lonny23]

It's way too far of a stretch for Celina to beat a 5A team. They could beat a lot of 3A teams and maybe some 4A teams, but not any 5A teams. There is too large of a population gap. Those power ratings get meesed up and don't always show the true strength of a tean. Valley schools get overrated, too.

You have to be a large 3A school to even have a chance to beat some 5A teams.

[farmerfan]

It's way too far of a stretch for Celina to beat a 5A team. They could beat a lot of 3A teams and maybe some 4A teams, but not any 5A teams. There is too large of a population gap. Those power ratings get meesed up and don't always show the true strength of a tean. Valley schools get overrated, too.

You have to be a large 3A school to even have a chance to beat some 5A teams.

I take it you have not seen Celina play. Not only have I played against them, but I have seen them many times. It is not a stretch to say they could beat some 5A teams. Teams such as Carrollton Newman Smith, The Colony, most of the Valley schools, most ofthe El Paso schools, some DISD and HISD schools and some more would not be able to beat Celina. The bobcats are just as physical as any team you will see play and are very deceptive in their speed. The coaching at Celina is as good as you will find anywhere in the state. Celina is one of the few 2A schools that has a small number of 2 way players and by that i mean maybe 1. I have seen the Bobcats this year, and I saw some horrible 5A teams, Celina would beat them.

[bleedgreen]

i agree that Celina could compete in 5A and even beat a few 5A teams(including us the way we choked this season)....but, to beat top 20 teams in 5A??? i don't think that would happen...given more players(athletes, a little more enrollment to 4A), they could make the transistion eventually to 5A and be successful just like SLC and Smithson Valley, just to name a few......

[lonny23]

i agree that Celina could compete in 5A and even beat a few 5A teams(including us the way we choked this season)....but, to beat top 20 teams in 5A??? i don't think that would happen...given more players(athletes, a little more enrollment to 4A), they could make the transistion eventually to 5A and be successful just like SLC and Smithson Valley, just to name a few......
Yeah, I forgot about Longview when I said they couldn't beat 5A!:p

[bleedgreen]

Yeah, I forgot about Longview when I said they couldn't beat 5A!:p
yea, i was serious!! the way we played against, Rockwall, NM, and SG, i really wouldn't doubt it, Lonny.........."running of the balls"---that's hilarious!!--LOL

[dragonfootballfan]

Celina did not win state the year that they moved up to 3A. What makes people think that they could compete in 5a

[pack0808]

yea, i was serious!! the way we played against, Rockwall, NM, and SG, i really wouldn't doubt it, Lonny.........."running of the balls"---that's hilarious!!--LOL


Longview beat's 95 percent of the 5a teams out there come on Bleed. Longview torches one of the top 4a teams every year in Marshall?? You are just talking crazy. Longview would beat Celina by 65 plus points.

[bleedgreen]

Longview beat's 95 percent of the 5a teams out there come on Bleed. Longview torches one of the top 4a teams every year in Marshall?? You are just talking crazy. Longview would beat Celina by 65 plus points.
maybe....i'm having flashbacks of three weekends ago----getting pissed again at a wasted season!!! we will all meet at the Lufkin/SLC game---i will be there..................

[pack0808]

maybe....i'm having flashbacks of three weekends ago----getting pissed again at a wasted season!!! we will all meet at the Lufkin/SLC game---i will be there..................


sounds good bro I hope it happens.

[farmerfan]

Celina did not win state the year that they moved up to 3A. What makes people think that they could compete in 5a


Celina only lost 3 games in 3A, the teams they lost to, Gilmer, Dangerfield and Gainesville all made very impressive playoff runs the year htye beat Celina.
I dont think anyone is saying that Celina would win 5A, we all know the only team who can do that is southlake :rolleyes: what we are saying is despite them being 2A they are very capable of goinng up into 5A and beating the likes of Dallas Adams, Dallas Sunset, most El Paso schools, most of the valley schools, most of the HISD schools, then you have your temas like The Colony, Carrollton Newman Smith, Ft Worth Boswell, Ft Worth Paschall then they wouold be very competitive with a host of other teams. If you have not seen Celina play this year which I dont think the majority of the posters adding their comments have, then go check them out, this Celina team might be the best team they have ever fielded.