250k-the biggest lie

[dragonsdaddy]

does anyone really believe the promise to not raise taxes on couples making 250k? does anyone believe obama had a bank of cpas determine that figure? the only numbers guys involved with that number were the demographics and electioneering gurus who decided that 250k sounded believeable enough to the most voters. the only thing sacrosanct to the dems is their social engineering and wealth redistribution stategies. anyone making more than median income better get ready to be considered ripe for increased taxation asap.

[yallerjacket]

You just have a hunch?

[dragonsdaddy]

You just have a hunch?

yeah, i tend to believe that the libs, when given the choice between cutting the above mentioned programs and raising taxes on the "rich", won't have many qualms ignoring the 250k pledge.

[mad_fan]

does anyone really believe the promise to not raise taxes on couples making 250k? does anyone believe obama had a bank of cpas determine that figure? the only numbers guys involved with that number were the demographics and electioneering gurus who decided that 250k sounded believeable enough to the most voters. the only thing sacrosanct to the dems is their social engineering and wealth redistribution stategies. anyone making more than median income better get ready to be considered ripe for increased taxation asap.

I guess you could do that...
Or just get the info from irs.gov...
Use current and proposed tax rates...
Figure the difference...

[Alurista]

Forgive me for my ignorance, but will Obama be granted dictator-like powers once he triumphs in November? Doesnt the Govt have a Senate and House of Reps to check the Executive Branch's power?

Obama can promise us the moon, but I won't believe it till I set foot on it.

[dragonsdaddy]

Forgive me for my ignorance, but will Obama be granted dictator-like powers once he triumphs in November? Doesnt the Govt have a Senate and House of Reps to check the Executive Branch's power?

Obama can promise us the moon, but I won't believe it till I set foot on it.

those checks and balances are still in place, but with a dem house and possibly senate, a dem president wouldn't feel the need to sign many vetoes.

[the_phoenix612]

those checks and balances are still in place, but with a dem house and possibly senate, a dem president wouldn't feel the need to sign many vetoes.

possibly the senate?

come november we're going to see a massive rejection of republican policies by the american people.

count on it.

[pied]

does anyone really believe the promise to not raise taxes on couples making 250k? does anyone believe obama had a bank of cpas determine that figure? the only numbers guys involved with that number were the demographics and electioneering gurus who decided that 250k sounded believeable enough to the most voters. the only thing sacrosanct to the dems is their social engineering and wealth redistribution stategies. anyone making more than median income better get ready to be considered ripe for increased taxation asap.

I don't know. I am also not privvy to who was part of the policy decision.

Question for you. How will McCain fund the GAP plan and the direct refundable tax credit, while lowering taxes?

John McCain Will Reform The Tax Code To Offer More Choices Beyond Employer-Based Health Insurance Coverage. While still having the option of employer-based coverage, every family will receive a direct refundable tax credit - effectively cash - of $2,500 for individuals and $5,000 for families to offset the cost of insurance. Families will be able to choose the insurance provider that suits them best and the money would be sent directly to the insurance provider. Those obtaining innovative insurance that costs less than the credit can deposit the remainder in expanded Health Savings Accounts.



John McCain Will Work With States To Establish A Guaranteed Access Plan. As President, John McCain will work with governors to develop a best practice model that states can follow - a Guaranteed Access Plan or GAP - that would reflect the best experience of the states to ensure these patients have access to health coverage. One approach would establish a nonprofit corporation that would contract with insurers to cover patients who have been denied insurance and could join with other state plans to enlarge pools and lower overhead costs. There would be reasonable limits on premiums, and assistance would be available for Americans below a certain income level.


http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/19ba2f1c-c03f-4ac2-8cd5-5cf2edb527cf.htm

[DragonFan0316]

I don't know. I am also not privvy to who was part of the policy decision.

Question for you. How will McCain fund the GAP plan and the direct refundable tax credit, while lowering taxes?




http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/19ba2f1c-c03f-4ac2-8cd5-5cf2edb527cf.htm


McCain will start by cutting the 700 billion going to fariegn countries that don't like us so much. He said it last night.

[stevefoxsc]

possibly the senate?

come november we're going to see a massive rejection of republican policies by the american people.

count on it.
you mean the liberals or the terrorist as they would say.

[stevefoxsc]

I don't know. I am also not privvy to who was part of the policy decision.

Question for you. How will McCain fund the GAP plan and the direct refundable tax credit, while lowering taxes?




http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/19ba2f1c-c03f-4ac2-8cd5-5cf2edb527cf.htm

you know mean of the laws he voted against hes now for, irony?

[the_phoenix612]

you mean the liberals or the terrorist as they would say.

oh, sorry.

count on 57+ terrorists in the Senate come november.

not counting Joe LIEberman.

[stevefoxsc]

oh, sorry.

count on 57+ terrorists in the Senate come november.

not counting Joe LIEberman.
i wonder if they would consider jesus a liberal.

[pied]

McCain will start by cutting the 700 billion going to fariegn countries that don't like us so much. He said it last night.

If I were not to believe BO on the tax cut off, why would I believe McCain regarding that?

Which countries?

Also, does anyone know if the $700 billion figure is annually or over a period of time.

[stevefoxsc]

If I were not to believe BO on the tax cut off, why would I believe McCain regarding that?

Which countries?

Also, does anyone know if the $700 billion figure is annually or over a period of time.

would have to assume its over a period of time.

[Firebird]

;)If I were not to believe BO on the tax cut off, why would I believe McCain regarding that?

Which countries?

Also, does anyone know if the $700 billion figure is annually or over a period of time.


Steve is correct. The U.S. spends nowhere near 700 billion on foreign aid annually. It is tough also to figure out sometimes what counts as foreign aid. Does money spent to rebuild Iraq count, for instance? If you just want to count the bills, in 2007 the FY amount alloted to foreign assistance was 23 billion.

Also remember that Israel gets more than any other nation. I would guess that they do not dislike us there. Then there are the Georgians, and "we are all Georgians now", so that isn't really even foreign aid, right.;) Columbia gets a bunch. Our new allies in Eastern Europe get a bunch. Some does go to the Palestinians, Egyptians, and other groups that might not like us.

That statement was a puzzle. I suppose that you could figure out a period of time where we gave a total of 700 billion to countries that don't like us, but you'd have to really play with the numbers.

[HUM398]

possibly the senate?

come november we're going to see a massive rejection of republican policies by the american people.

count on it.

What term paper did you read that from....?

[TrojanHorse03]

possibly the senate?

come november we're going to see a massive rejection of republican policies by the american people.

count on it.

I think that's wishful thinking on your part, because the truth is people fear change even if it's from bad to good.

[HUM398]

I think that's wishful thinking on your part, because the truth is people fear change even if it's from bad to good.

No kidding... Ever try to get a kid to change his cloths...

[pied]

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1410.htmlI don't know. I am also not privvy to who was part of the policy decision.

Question for you. How will McCain fund the GAP plan and the direct refundable tax credit, while lowering taxes?




http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/19ba2f1c-c03f-4ac2-8cd5-5cf2edb527cf.htm


Math based on these numbers.



During 2006, Tax Foundation economists estimate that roughly 43.4 million tax returns, representing 91 million individuals, will face a zero or negative tax liability. That's out of a total of 136 million federal tax returns that will be filed.
......
As a result, married taxpayers pay roughly 75 percent of all federal income taxes, despite filing only 40 percent of returns.

136 Million filers
40% families = 54.4 million = $272 billion
60% individual = 81.6 million = $204 billion

Total $476 billion

That's additional cost in addition to the GAP program which may establish a non-profit insurance company to insure the uninsured.

No clue aas to how much that will cost. To those that are against Obama's plan and in favor of McCain's, why?

[the_phoenix612]

I think that's wishful thinking on your part, because the truth is people fear change even if it's from bad to good.

think what you will

November 5 Ill have a thread titled "I Told You So"

[TrojanHorse03]

think what you will

November 5 Ill have a thread titled "I Told You So"

I hope so but I can't easily forget this is the country that elected George Bush twice...it concerns me.

[the_phoenix612]

I hope so but I can't easily forget this is the country that elected George Bush twice...it concerns me.

www.fivethirtyeight.com

[mojotrain]

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/1410.html


Math based on these numbers.





136 Million filers
40% families = 54.4 million = $272 billion
60% individual = 81.6 million = $204 billion

Total $476 billion

That's additional cost in addition to the GAP program which may establish a non-profit insurance company to insure the uninsured.

No clue aas to how much that will cost. To those that are against Obama's plan and in favor of McCain's, why?

I oppose dubamas plan because of those on this site who support him. Such as Socialist, pinkos, one world pushers and a few well intentioned gimmys.

[the_phoenix612]

I oppose dubamas plan because of those on this site who support him. Such as Socialist, pinkos, one world pushers and a few well intentioned gimmys.

socialism?

interesting you would bring that up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska#Permanent_Fund

[drgnbkr]

possibly the senate?

come november we're going to see a massive rejection of republican policies by the american people.

count on it.

It's not looking so good for this right now...You might want to check back in a few weeks...The lib congress is at historic lows in terms of approval numbers and on vacation after achieving exactly squat...

[the_phoenix612]

It's not looking so good for this right now...You might want to check back in a few weeks...The lib congress is at historic lows in terms of approval numbers and on vacation after achieving exactly squat...

think what you will

November 5 Ill have a thread titled "I Told You So"

:ninja:

[Dawg Fan]

:ninja:

I am not sure you have ever told us anything that we agreed with.

[KLH75287]

think what you will

November 5 Ill have a thread titled "I Told You So"

That'll be one for the H.O.F.

And if you're wrong? What will be your thread title then?

[drgnbkr]

I am not sure you have ever told us anything that we agreed with.

the minority always has to scream a little louder..

[Firebird]

I oppose dubamas plan because of those on this site who support him. Such as Socialist, pinkos, one world pushers and a few well intentioned gimmys.


Wow. Identity politics in its purest form. It really is sad what American politcs has turned into. The student of American history in me wants to say it was always like this, but I really am not sure anymore. The interwebs and 24 hour news cycle has made this ever more possible. So has the continued fracturing of news sources into various biased outlets for various ideologies.

It is no longer enough simply to disagree with people who have different political views. They cannot be decent people, much like yourself, who happen to see politics differently. They must be scoundrels, treacherous, liars, idiots, perverts, and snobs. It really is like pied says, you pick your side and then let your party and talking heads feed you hate.

No longer do we vote for or against different candidates, we vote for or against our neighbors and fellow citizens. Neither side has a monopoly on this shameful behavior. The right tells you that a vote for McCain is a vote against the Eastern "librul", elitist, secularist, weenie establishment that thinks you are stupid and backwards and overwhelmingly devoted to enthusiastic religion. The left tells you that a vote for Obama is a vote against backwoods, close-minded, irrational gun toting hillbillies, looking to enforce their medieval views by fiat. They tell you to hate each other, and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. People really do dislike each other as people because of the letter on their voter registration card.

At certain moments during both conventions I was reminded of nothing so much as Orwell's two minute hate, complete with mindless shouted slogans and jeers, manipulative imagery, and sighs of relief and joy at the appearance of the "savior." If what I have seen during the past weeks is not Orwellian, then the term is devoid of all meaning.

[the_phoenix612]

That'll be one for the H.O.F.

And if you're wrong? What will be your thread title then?

then it shall be titled "You Told Me So" and I will never post in a political thread here ever again (except for snide comments, I reserve the right to post those :p)

[mad_fan]

Wow. Identity politics in its purest form. It really is sad what American politcs has turned into. The student of American history in me wants to say it was always like this, but I really am not sure anymore. The interwebs and 24 hour news cycle has made this ever more possible. So has the continued fracturing of news sources into various biased outlets for various ideologies.

It is no longer enough simply to disagree with people who have different political views. They cannot be decent people, much like yourself, who happen to see politics differently. They must be scoundrels, treacherous, liars, idiots, perverts, and snobs. It really is like pied says, you pick your side and then let your party and talking heads feed you hate.

No longer do we vote for or against different candidates, we vote for or against our neighbors and fellow citizens. Neither side has a monopoly on this shameful behavior. The right tells you that a vote for McCain is a vote against the Eastern "librul", elitist, secularist, weenie establishment that thinks you are stupid and backwards and overwhelmingly devoted to enthusiastic religion. The left tells you that a vote for Obama is a vote against backwoods, close-minded, irrational gun toting hillbillies, looking to enforce their medieval views by fiat. They tell you to hate each other, and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. People really do dislike each other as people because of the letter on their voter registration card.

At certain moments during both conventions I was reminded of nothing so much as Orwell's two minute hate, complete with mindless shouted slogans and jeers, manipulative imagery, and sighs of relief and joy at the appearance of the "savior." If what I have seen during the past weeks is not Orwellian, then the term is devoid of all meaning.

That's where we are at...
And I don't care for it...
I don't care for Olbermann or O'Reilly either...
And I try not to treat my fellow Americans as if they are a bunch of dumd***es...because they don't agree with me...

[mad_fan]

the minority always has to scream a little louder..

The Irish???
I agree...
Only way to overcome the WASP...

[SaRattlerFan]

possibly the senate?

come november we're going to see a massive rejection of republican policies by the american people.

count on it.

Want to make a small wager on your prediction. McCain/Palin win easy on election night. Americans aren't going to fall for the promises of "The Chosen One".

[the_phoenix612]

Want to make a small wager on your prediction. McCain/Palin win easy on election night. Americans aren't going to fall for the promises of "The Chosen One".

mmm you're too far away in San Antonio to actually make that work.

Otherwise I would.

What's the line you'd give me?

[SaRattlerFan]

mmm you're too far away in San Antonio to actually make that work.

Otherwise I would.

What's the line you'd give me?

McCain/Palin by 3% and a convincing electoral college win (30 to 40).

[the_phoenix612]

McCain/Palin by 3% and a convincing electoral college win (30 to 40).

I'd take that bet in a heartbeat.