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Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 12:11 AM
Most of us that have been around high school football (Texas perspective) over the years have learned that just because a team has 7 or 10 (D-1) college level athletes on it doesnt make it a great team.

I could sit here and give probably 20 examples of that just from a Texas perspective over the last 20 years.

But, hearing some people from other areas of the country proclaim that they had a great superior team because they had several D-1 athletes on it in their Senior and Junior class is funny.

2004 Irving MacArthur had 11 kids sign D-1 and has about 6 Juniors that will be D-1 athletes and they were at best about the #10th best team in Texas last year. Wow, roughly 17 kids on last years Irving macArthur team will be college D-1 football players and they were about #10th in Texas in 2004.

2004 Desota had roughly 9 kids sign D-1 and the they have about 6 juniors that will be D-1 athletes. That's 15 D-1 athletes on their 2004 team and they were what ? About #15 in Texas last year with all that D-1 talent.

I could sit here and give about 10 more examples of 2004 Texas teams that will have roughly 10 or so Seniors and Juniors from their 2004 team that will be D-1 athletes and those schools were only #7 thru #20 in Texas.

Than schools like Katy, SLC and Smithson Valley keep making it to the 5A State Semis and Finals with just 5 to 7 Seniors/Juniors that will be D-1 athletes in college.

So, when I see someone post that their team (from their State) was just so powerful because it has 10-12 (D-1), (Seniors/Juniors) on it and that made it superior. I just have to kind of laugh.

Just had to get that off my shoulders.

Anyone have anymore Texas examples of Texas teams that were loaded with alot of D-1 football players but didnt win State ?

GoOwls
05-26-2005, 12:27 AM
The team that sticks out in my mind is the 1999 South Grand Prairie team. Seems that they had 10 or more go D-1, but Garland beat them in a rain storm at Texas Stadium that is listed in the greatest games ever section of this web site.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 12:30 AM
The team that sticks out in my mind is the 1999 South Grand Prairie team. Seems that they had 10 or more go D-1, but Garland beat them in a rain storm at Texas Stadium that is listed in the greatest games ever section of this web site.


Ya, that team had some talent on it. I think their headline player was Wr-BJ Johnson (Texas) if I remember right.

svhorns
05-26-2005, 12:32 AM
Smithson Valley wolud be lucky to have 3 D-1 players on their team at one time.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 12:37 AM
Smithson Valley wolud be lucky to have 3 D-1 players on their team at one time.

Ya, but I do think last years team will have about 4 or maybe even 5 (Senior/Juniors) that will go D-1.

I know the LB went to Baylor and the OL went to Texas State. Just so you know I thought that OL was dang good. He must of wanted to stay close to home because he was talented enough to go to at least SMU, Baylor , Houston, UTEP or even Texas Tech in my opinion.

Isnt there about 3 Juniors that will go D-1 from last years team. I see the one kid has already verballed to A&M. The Fuller kid will probably get an offer from Tech like his brothers.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 12:43 AM
Smithson Valley wolud be lucky to have 3 D-1 players on their team at one time.
By the way Smithson Valley.. That QB from last years team. I know he probably doesnt have all the entangables that college D-1 scouts are looking for. But, what a heck of an athlete he is. He was a tough "Throwback style" type of football player. I really enjoyed watching him play in the State Title game. I dont know what kind of grades he has but he would be perfect running the offense at a school like Rice, Navy or Air Force.

pack0808
05-26-2005, 12:50 AM
are those numbers really right?? they had that many last year?? where did half of them go lousiana lafayette?? lol i thought lufkin's 11 div1 signees in 2 years was amazing?? lufkin was 2nd in 2003 behind lamarque i am almost positive?? i also think that having 4 current nfl players is pretty amazing for a hs team which lufkin has. no it does not mean your team is great but it sure means you had a very talented team. i have seen many very talented teams that were mediocre because they did not play well as a team. college recruiters do not hand out scholarships for the hell of it the last time i checked. especially div1 recruiters.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 12:59 AM
are those numbers really right?? they had that many last year?? where did half of them go lousiana lafayette?? lol i thought lufkin's 11 div1 signees in 2 years was amazing?? lufkin was 2nd in 2003 behind lamarque i am almost positive?? i also think that having 4 current nfl players is pretty amazing for a hs team which lufkin has. no it does not mean your team is great but it sure means you had a very talented team. i have seen many very talented teams that were mediocre because they did not play well as a team. college recruiters do not hand out scholarships for the hell of it the last time i checked. especially div1 recruiters.

Hey Pack, I'm not sure which school you're talking about but I'll assume it Irving macarthur.

DB- Kartley Agboltah - North Tx
QB- Duane Brooks - Central Michigan
DL- Eric Childs - Kansas St.
Wr-D. Hoskin - Central Michigan
SS- M.McMillian - Florida A&M
Ath- Jeff Moturi - Houston
DB- H. Nickerson - Tx Tech
Fs- T. Nickerson - Prairie View
Db- L. Vation - Tx Tech
Wr- C. Harris - Tulane.

They also have about 5 to 6 Juniors from the 2004 team that will sign D-1.

The Lufkin team from 2 years ago was insane with college talent. Probably one of the fastest teams ever.

pack0808
05-26-2005, 01:32 AM
fllorida a&m and prarie view are not considered div1 football and you listed a total of 10. come on man!! so that means 8 legit div1 scholarships. that makes a lot more sense. the lufkin 2003 team had 7. aaron darks- kansas st tyson kirksey- washington st. kevin bryan texas a&m jacorrey shepperd-rice chris pilot- houston and joseph hadnot and ray givens lousiana lafayette. i made fun of la lafayette earlier but at least they are a legit div1 team. prarie view and florida a&m are 1aa like sfa i am almost positive. well i know they are not div1 no question. why on earth would you think that?? if i added 1aa to div1 lufkin would have about 15 in the last 2 years instead of 11.

concha
05-26-2005, 08:28 AM
I saw a post awhile back about an article in Student Sports and D1 (I believe D1A) recruit production by high schools across the country. Last year, they reported that 34 schools had 5 or more. The vast majority were in CA (5), TX (6) and FL (14). My own state of Ohio had 2. That leaves 7 spread across the rest of the nation. Amazing.

garland04
05-26-2005, 11:05 AM
The team that sticks out in my mind is the 1999 South Grand Prairie team. Seems that they had 10 or more go D-1, but Garland beat them in a rain storm at Texas Stadium that is listed in the greatest games ever section of this web site.


Wasn't Garland's 2003 team loaded as well?
If i remember correctly, D'Andre Jackson, Taurence Rawls, Brandon Tapps, TaTa Thompson, Steve Richardson were just a few of the outstanding recruits. Were there any others?

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 11:46 AM
fllorida a&m and prarie view are not considered div1 football and you listed a total of 10. come on man!! so that means 8 legit div1 scholarships. that makes a lot more sense. the lufkin 2003 team had 7. aaron darks- kansas st tyson kirksey- washington st. kevin bryan texas a&m jacorrey shepperd-rice chris pilot- houston and joseph hadnot and ray givens lousiana lafayette. i made fun of la lafayette earlier but at least they are a legit div1 team. prarie view and florida a&m are 1aa like sfa i am almost positive. well i know they are not div1 no question. why on earth would you think that?? if i added 1aa to div1 lufkin would have about 15 in the last 2 years instead of 11.

First , Florida A&M and Prairie View are D-1AA programs. Therefore D-1.

Second, go check out the recent article from Dave Campbells (Texas football). I just posted the D-1 kids from Irving Mac. that I know of. Dave Campbells (the #1 Texas recruiting source) says that 11 Irving Mac. players from 2004 team signed D-1 so go tell Dave Campbell that his got it wrong ok.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 11:51 AM
fllorida a&m and prarie view are not considered div1 football and you listed a total of 10. come on man!! so that means 8 legit div1 scholarships. that makes a lot more sense. the lufkin 2003 team had 7. aaron darks- kansas st tyson kirksey- washington st. kevin bryan texas a&m jacorrey shepperd-rice chris pilot- houston and joseph hadnot and ray givens lousiana lafayette. i made fun of la lafayette earlier but at least they are a legit div1 team. prarie view and florida a&m are 1aa like sfa i am almost positive. well i know they are not div1 no question. why on earth would you think that?? if i added 1aa to div1 lufkin would have about 15 in the last 2 years instead of 11.

Pack, I was referring to D-1. That's both D-1A and D-1AA. But, ya if you wanted to refer to just D-1A. I believe they had 8 legits D-1A Seniors. They have about 6 Juniors that will sign D-1A. So, that's going to put about 14 or so Senior/Juniors from the 2004 Irving Mac. team that will be D-1A players.

Not bad for the #10th team in Texas.

pack0808
05-26-2005, 12:13 PM
i do not count div1aa in the same category as legit div1. big big difference. they are not listed together and they compete for a different title. they are not a legit div1 program or i could have added many more to lufkin's 11 legit div1 players in the last 2 years. i can name one just thinking about it. ford?? i cannot remember his first name. he signed with prarie view. if i said that player lufkin would have 6 div1 players on their defense alone instead of 5 in 2003. i know you are not meaning it but i am surprised anybody would put div1 and div1aa in the same category?? if everybody is doing that then i need to go back and tell you a different number for lufkin because there would be plenty more. the swac is not legit div1 football. div1aa is a whole different ball game. and 8 legit div1 recruits is great do not get me wrong but i knew that 11 seemed blown up a bit. now i know why.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 03:30 PM
i do not count div1aa in the same category as legit div1. big big difference. they are not listed together and they compete for a different title. they are not a legit div1 program or i could have added many more to lufkin's 11 legit div1 players in the last 2 years. i can name one just thinking about it. ford?? i cannot remember his first name. he signed with prarie view. if i said that player lufkin would have 6 div1 players on their defense alone instead of 5 in 2003. i know you are not meaning it but i am surprised anybody would put div1 and div1aa in the same category?? if everybody is doing that then i need to go back and tell you a different number for lufkin because there would be plenty more. the swac is not legit div1 football. div1aa is a whole different ball game. and 8 legit div1 recruits is great do not get me wrong but i knew that 11 seemed blown up a bit. now i know why.

I agree with you some Pack buddy. But, there are some D-1AA programs that can beat many of the lower half D-1A teams. I mean this past season Maine (D-1AA) beat Miss St (D-1A) and a SEC team.

I think many years teams like Sam Houston St, Texas St. and SF Austin can play with many of the lower 1/3 teams in D-1A football.

I was at a game a few years ago (S.F Austin vs La Tech) and SF Austin put it on La Tech. in Ruston.

I would say most years that the top #1 --#10 in the nation in D-1AA football are about equal to #60 -#80 in D-1A .

pack0808
05-26-2005, 04:08 PM
i can buy that argument maybe?? the 2 biggest powerhouses of 1aa have had some success in the div1 in marshall and troy st. especially marshall. theu have had some solid years since joining. that is a little deceiving though. when a team moves from div1aa to div1 they get many more scholarships and more interest from recruits because they will get to compete on a div1 level.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 04:21 PM
i can buy that argument maybe?? the 2 biggest powerhouses of 1aa have had some success in the div1 in marshall and troy st. especially marshall. theu have had some solid years since joining. that is a little deceiving though. when a team moves from div1aa to div1 they get many more scholarships and more interest from recruits because they will get to compete on a div1 level.

That's true. The scholarship limit goes up so they get some stronger depth. Plus, they usually get a few more talented kids right out of high school.

I would say that #1- #10 in the D-1AA football are equal to #60- #80 in D-1A football.

Heck, I would say that even #11- #15 in D-1AA football are on par with #100 -#117 in D-1A football.

Do you think last years Sam Houston St team was better than SMU, Rice and Baylor ?

pack0808
05-26-2005, 04:28 PM
yeah i can but into that also but you cannot compare div1 ball to div1aa ball overall. that was my whole point. 2 totally different leagues overall.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 04:39 PM
yeah i can but into that also but you cannot compare div1 ball to div1aa ball overall. that was my whole point. 2 totally different leagues overall.


Once you get out past team #15 in D-1AA, the football level is more on the level with D-11 football.

Shoot, there is usually a few of those D-11 football teams around the nation that could play with #80- #100 in D-1A football.

I think Texas A&M Kingsville could give SMU one heck of a game. You

NewSherriffInTown
05-26-2005, 05:49 PM
It doesn't matter if they can give them a game or not...


D1 is D1-A

D1-AA is D1-AA huge difference...

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 05:57 PM
It doesn't matter if they can give them a game or not...


D1 is D1-A

D1-AA is D1-AA huge difference...


The point being NewsherriffinTown is that there is some D-1AA programs that can compete with D-1A programs. There are a few D-11 programs that can compete against the lower 1/4 of D-1A football.

But, I will agree that the top echlon teams in D-1A football (#1 - #40) dont take a back seat to anyone on the college level.

I guess the whole point about (#1-#15) in D-1AA football and even the top (#1-#5) teams in D-11 football is that there is some very talented football players on those teams.

JudsonStud19
05-26-2005, 07:13 PM
Judson has had consistinly great teams one right after another and have very rarely sent many players to continue on at the D-1 level... I dont think in order to be a good team in 5a you have to have talent at the big time level... I just think it helps... In my 4 years here we have had i think maybe one or 2 guys that i know of go D-1... Titus Brothers went to Nebraska... And I aint to sure were "Buck" ended up... I also think Aaron Ivey may have went to TCU... but I am not to sure...

drgnbkr
05-26-2005, 08:51 PM
I don't believe Carroll has ever had more than 3 D-1 signees in a season.....as I always say in golf..."It's not how you drive, it's how you arrive"... ;)

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 08:57 PM
Judson has had consistinly great teams one right after another and have very rarely sent many players to continue on at the D-1 level... I dont think in order to be a good team in 5a you have to have talent at the big time level... I just think it helps... In my 4 years here we have had i think maybe one or 2 guys that i know of go D-1... Titus Brothers went to Nebraska... And I aint to sure were "Buck" ended up... I also think Aaron Ivey may have went to TCU... but I am not to sure...


I know a few of those Judson kids have gone on to D-1AA football at places like Sam Houston, Texas St and SF Austin. Plus, I believe there seems to always be a few Judson kids that are D-1 talented but end up going the JUCO way.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 09:02 PM
I don't believe Carroll has ever had more than 3 D-1 signees in a season.....as I always say in golf..."It's not how you drive, it's how you arrive"... ;)

Looking back at Carroll over the last few years it looks like they usually on good years have 3 kids sign D-1A. I do believe off of last seasons SLC team there will probably be around 7 kids (Seniors & Juniors) sign D-1A.

Doesnt Carroll have like 200 plus kids in there High school football program (Freshman, JV and Varsity teams) ?

drgnbkr
05-26-2005, 10:09 PM
I think 7 would be high, off of last years and this years teams.

Texasfrog
05-26-2005, 10:36 PM
I think 7 would be high, off of last years and this years teams.

Well, maybe so. I'm not from SLC so I dont claim to be an expert on them. I did see them play 4 times last year. (SV, Lufkin, Abilene and Midland Lee).

QB-Chase Daniel (Missouri)
Ol- Mitch Enright (SMU)
LB- Pete Fleps (Navy)

plus, for all-purpose RB- Aaron Luna was a D-1A caliber football player. Just he choose college baseball.

I do think the junior class will have 5 or 6 kids sign D-1A that played on last years team.

Wr- Jacobsen (BYU)
Wr- Renfro (several offers)
Wr- Allen
Ol- Prince
DE- Boydston
LB- Benoist
SS- Agnew

JudsonStud19
05-26-2005, 10:42 PM
I know a few of those Judson kids have gone on to D-1AA football at places like Sam Houston, Texas St and SF Austin. Plus, I believe there seems to always be a few Judson kids that are D-1 talented but end up going the JUCO way.
Yea I know alot of them have gone to JUCO... Heck Campbell ended up going to Cisco JUCO in Dallas... And as far as 1AA... Texas State seems to get all the Judson kids... Heck even Mark Kolentz... I belive that is how you spell his name... He was in the Army all american bowl back in '03... And Chauncy in '04... Those kids must have D-1 talent...