Next Year draft [Archive] - 5A Texas Football Forum

PDA

View Full Version : Next Year draft

Hdshrinker

10-31-2005, 06:23 PM

If you were drafting #1 next year and VY, Leinart, and Bush are all in the draft who do you chose?

Reaganrattler07

10-31-2005, 06:39 PM

Easily Reggie Bush.....

garlandowl08

10-31-2005, 07:11 PM

I hate to say this, but young finds a way to win...

Reaganrattler07

10-31-2005, 07:22 PM

I hate to say this, but young finds a way to win...

I normally don't call people stupid or idiotic....but do you even know who Reggie Bush or Matt Leinart are?

jtk1519

10-31-2005, 08:30 PM

Depends on the situation my team is in. If I'm in desperate need of an impact player, I select Reggie Bush without question. He is the one player of the three that can probably make a big impact from day one.

However, If my team is pretty solid and I can take a chance, I would select Vince. Vince is still raw. He's getting better, but he is not going to be an immediate impact player. If I could afford to select a player and help develop him, it would be Vince without hesitation. His potential is far greater than Leinart's or Bush's.

Reaganrattler07

10-31-2005, 08:33 PM

Hdshrinker, it probably would've been better if you had added "unbiased opinions" to the title.....

Primetime536

10-31-2005, 10:22 PM

If you were drafting #1 next year and VY, Leinart, and Bush are all in the draft who do you chose?
dawg, no discusion, VY is NOT going to be a pro QB, throws side arm, slow release, poor choices, not good under presure.

This is a little stupid

ML Nothing to think about, hes so good.

Texasfrog

10-31-2005, 10:30 PM

dawg, no discusion, VY is NOT going to be a pro QB, throws side arm, slow release, poor choices, not good under presure.

This is a little stupid

ML Nothing to think about, hes so good.

I heard a couple of NFL Scouts debating about ML. There is a question about how good he really is... Is he really an elite QB or is he a pretty good QB that is playing in a good system surrounded by alot of great players ??

Hdshrinker

10-31-2005, 11:10 PM

Hdshrinker

10-31-2005, 11:12 PM

I heard a couple of NFL Scouts debating about ML. There is a question about how good he really is... Is he really an elite QB or is he a pretty good QB that is playing in a good system surrounded by alot of great players ??

Let's see how good Bush is without him in the line-up. In fact I don't think he stays because of that.

Prime brings up a great point about VY's sidearm throwing...

wide-e-wide

11-01-2005, 12:15 AM

Let's see how good Bush is without him in the line-up. In fact I don't think he stays because of that.

Prime brings up a great point about VY's sidearm throwing...

Yeah that is a great point...because everybody knows ...you only get 5 points if you throw a TD side-armed... :rolleyes:

wide-e-wide

11-01-2005, 12:15 AM

Take Vince off of the poll question anyway....
He's coming back to UT next year.

jtk1519

11-01-2005, 01:07 AM

Good answer JTK. Now if you are Houston...who do you pick?

D'Brickashaw Ferguson, the big OT out of Virginia. Houston doesn’t need either any one of the three mentioned here. They have a good RB that can catch and they have a very good young QB. Unfortunately, they aren’t allowed to do much behind what may be the worst O-line in football.

Put it this way, If I'm running the San Francisco 49ers, I select Reggie Bush without hesitation. Matt Leinart would be a waste since you used the #1 pick on a QB last year. Vince Young is too big of a project for a team as bad as San Francisco. However, If I'm a team like the Dallas Cowboys, and by some miracle Leinart, Bush and Young are all on the board when it's time for the Cowboys to pick, I give a serious look at Vince. You have a couple of great young RBs on the roster already so you don't need Bush. You have a QB that can serve the team for another couple of years so you can afford to take a bit of a chance. Some of the best QBs in the league were taken in later rounds so it is nothing to turn down a Matt Leinart.

Leinart is good and without question the top QB in the draft, but people keep acting like he is the second coming of Peyton. Get a grip. There is a reason all the NFL scouts are questioning Leinart's true abilities. He is surrounded by one of the greatest supporting casts in the history of college football. Think about this... How do you think Leinart would perform as the QB for the Texans? He would be doing about as good as David Car, that's how. A QB is only as good as those around him.

FootballJunkie

11-01-2005, 01:12 AM

D'Brickashaw Ferguson, the big OT out of Virginia. Houston doesn’t need either any one of the three mentioned here. They have a good RB that can catch and they have a very good young QB. Unfortunately, they aren’t allowed to do much behind what may be the worst O-line in football.

Put it this way, If I'm running the San Francisco 49ers, I select Reggie Bush without hesitation. Matt Leinart would be a waste since you used the #1 pick on a QB last year. Vince Young is too big of a project for a team as bad as San Francisco. However, If I'm a team like the Dallas Cowboys, and by some miracle Leinart, Bush and Young are all on the board when it's time for the Cowboys to pick, I give a serious look at Vince. You have a couple of great young RBs on the roster already so you don't need Bush. You have a QB that can serve the team for another couple of years so you can afford to take a bit of a chance. Some of the best QBs in the league were taken in later rounds so it is nothing to turn down a Matt Leinart.

Leinart is good and without question the top QB in the draft, but people keep acting like he is the second coming of Peyton. Get a grip. There is a reason all the NFL scouts are questioning Leinart's true abilities. He is surrounded by one of the greatest supporting casts in the history of college football. Think about this... How do you think Leinart would perform as the QB for the Texans? He would be doing about as good as David Car, that's how. A QB is only as good as those around him.

Well he( leinart )sat behind Carson Palmer...If he is on par with him, which he seems to be.. he will be fine in the NFL.

jtk1519

11-01-2005, 01:43 AM

dawg, no discusion, VY is NOT going to be a pro QB, throws side arm, slow release, poor choices, not good under presure.

This is a little stupid

ML Nothing to think about, hes so good.

I have heard a lot of ignorant things said on the subject of Vince Young, but this ranks among the dumbest.

You can always tell somebody who is truly uneducated on the subject because the first thing they will bring up is throwing motion. They do this completely ignorant of the fact that there are QBs all over the league with low releases. All Vince's throwing motion does is change the level at which the ball is released. This would be a problem is Vince were 6'1, but he's not. Because Vince is approaching 6'6 the ball actually leaves his hand at a higher level than a Mike Vick or Drew Breese thus rendering the "throwing motion" argument futile.

Release is too slow?

I had to do a double-take on that one because I have never heard something so stupid. Vince's release isn’t too slow... it too FAST. Vince gets rid of the ball quicker than most QBs. Because his release is so fast it doesn’t allow him to set his feet and use his legs to help throw. That is one of the reasons some of his passes look bad. It has nothing to do with release or throwing motion, it has to do with the fact that his arm is throwing the ball quicker than his weight can shift between his legs. In fact, if you look at all of the great passes Vince has thrown this year, you will see that he sits in the pocket, gets his feet shoulder width apart and shifts his weight from his back leg to his front leg as the ball is being released. When he does that, his release actually slows down a bit and allows him to make the big throws. However, if you will look at his bad passes, you will see that most are caused because he flings the ball out so quick that most of his body weight is still on his back leg when the ball is released. This will cause easy passes to be overthrown.

Vince's problem has never been his throwing motion, a slow release or any of the other garbage the idiots of the world spew out. Vince's problem has always been his mechanics from the waist down. Specifically the transition of his body weight during the course of the release. When Vince sets his feet, slows his release just a tad and uses his body weight and legs to help him throw, he can throw just as good a pass as the best QBs in college football... it won't be the prettiest, but it will get the job done just as well as any good QB. Vince has an incredibly strong arm and can throw the ball almost anywhere on the field. The only time Vince makes bad passes is when he hurries things up and doesn’t use the bottom half of his body right. However, he is learning. If you look at film from last year and film from this year, the first thing you will notice is that Vince is using his entire body to throw the ball, whereas last year he relied on nothing but the strength of his arm. That is why Vince is one of the nation's leaders in passing efficiency and that is why he has throw for as many yards so far this year as he did all of last year. That is why he is on pace to throw for 3000 yards and 26 TDs. Not bad for a QB that "can't throw."

One of these days, the feeble sheep of the world will learn to think for themselves and actually formulate their own opinions before regurgitating the ignorant and baseless propaganda that has perpetuated the college football world. One of these days.

jtk1519

11-01-2005, 01:52 AM

Well he( leinart )sat behind Carson Palmer...If he is on par with him, which he seems to be.. he will be fine in the NFL.

I like Leinart a lot... I really do. He isn’t the most talented or athletic guy, but he is a tremendous leader and he is a winner. He is unselfish and uses his teammates the right way. I have to laugh when I see him getting all this praise now because I remember how everybody trashed him after Palmer graduated. They said his arm was too weak and he couldn’t lead this team. Everybody said he wasn’t talented and would be a huge drop from Palmer. Leinart was supposed to be nothing more than a guy to keep the QB seat warm until Booty could take over. Funny how times change.

Hdshrinker

11-01-2005, 06:57 AM

I like Leinart a lot... I really do. He isn’t the most talented or athletic guy, but he is a tremendous leader and he is a winner. He is unselfish and uses his teammates the right way. I have to laugh when I see him getting all this praise now because I remember how everybody trashed him after Palmer graduated. They said his arm was too weak and he couldn’t lead this team. Everybody said he wasn’t talented and would be a huge drop from Palmer. Leinart was supposed to be nothing more than a guy to keep the QB seat warm until Booty could take over. Funny how times change.

I wonder if that has anything to do with coaching? or is it just maturity?

jtk1519

11-01-2005, 01:31 PM

I wonder if that has anything to do with coaching? or is it just maturity?

I honestly think Leinart isnt quite as gifted as Palmer. The difference is the talent around him. It isnt hard for Leinart to look good when you look at the players around him. He is surrounded by several first round draft picks and it is possible that every offensive starter will be in the NFL within a couple of years. I don't know if this is the best "team" in history, but it will go down as one of the most talented.

Hdshrinker

11-01-2005, 02:54 PM

I honestly think Leinart isnt quite as gifted as Palmer. The difference is the talent around him. It isnt hard for Leinart to look good when you look at the players around him. He is surrounded by several first round draft picks and it is possible that every offensive starter will be in the NFL within a couple of years. I don't know if this is the best "team" in history, but it will go down as one of the most talented.

Could we say the same thing about Texas players? They do have the best in Texas......hard to lose with talent..unless you are mack of course....

dada

11-01-2005, 03:03 PM

dawg, no discusion, VY is NOT going to be a pro QB, throws side arm, slow release, poor choices, not good under presure.

This is a little stupid

ML Nothing to think about, hes so good.
So was Ryan Leaf.

jtk1519

11-01-2005, 06:30 PM

Could we say the same thing about Texas players? They do have the best in Texas......hard to lose with talent..unless you are mack of course....

No, you can't. I like the way Billy Pittman has stepped up and he along with Sweed have a chance to be something special, but they sure as hell arent Dwayne Jarrett and Steve Smith. Selvin Young is a good back and Jamaal Charles has the potential to be something very special, but at this point in time, they sure as hell are Reggie Bush and LenDale White.

Texas has more talent on defense and maybe a slight advantage on the O-line, but USC is one of the few schools in the nation that, talent wise, is a step above Texas.

GoOwls

11-01-2005, 06:46 PM

Hdshrinker, it probably would've been better if you had added "unbiased opinions" to the title.....

Like you or The Shrink are "unbiased" against the Horns? You guys crack me up with your hypocracy.

Skins, you may be a conservative, but you argue like a liberal.

wide-e-wide

11-01-2005, 07:13 PM

Could we say the same thing about Texas players? They do have the best in Texas......hard to lose with talent..unless you are mack of course....

I was thinking the same thing. All Mack does is lose...every since he came to UT...what is his overall record at Texas?

Hdshrinker

11-01-2005, 09:05 PM

Like you or The Shrink are "unbiased" against the Horns? You guys crack me up with your hypocracy.

Skins, you may be a conservative, but you argue like a liberal.

Who ever told you I was unbiased against the horns? I've made it very clear. I don't like mack. Unbiased? Do you not the meaning of unbiased? I call the man a weasel, how is that unbiased? He's their leader. The sooner they lose the sooner he's gone I hope. Then I will be unbiased.

It amazes Me the things you and your hero attribute to Me. I suppose you saying so makes it so eh? LOL

Hdshrinker

11-01-2005, 09:07 PM

No, you can't. I like the way Billy Pittman has stepped up and he along with Sweed have a chance to be something special, but they sure as hell arent Dwayne Jarrett and Steve Smith. Selvin Young is a good back and Jamaal Charles has the potential to be something very special, but at this point in time, they sure as hell are Reggie Bush and LenDale White.

Texas has more talent on defense and maybe a slight advantage on the O-line, but USC is one of the few schools in the nation that, talent wise, is a step above Texas.

I wasn't referring to the nation, but to Texas in Texas. They have the best talent around...so then we can say the same thing about them here. I know they don't have the best talent in the nation. That's part of the resaon they aren't going to be #1 when the smoke and mirrorrs fall apart.

Reaganrattler07

11-01-2005, 09:08 PM

Skins, you may be a conservative, but you argue like a liberal.

Whoa....that was wayyyy unnecessary.....I'm not that low.....

Primetime536

11-01-2005, 09:09 PM

I heard a couple of NFL Scouts debating about ML. There is a question about how good he really is... Is he really an elite QB or is he a pretty good QB that is playing in a good system surrounded by alot of great players ??
Look at carson palmer, he has the same talent, well almost the same, and look how good he is. Norm chow is amazing with college QBs

Primetime536

11-01-2005, 09:12 PM

:cool: Yeah that is a great point...because everybody knows ...you only get 5 points if you throw a TD side-armed... :rolleyes:
ok, wide, who knows so much about sports. Throwing sidearm is less acurate, and throws a low ball. In the NFL DLinemen are to good for low balls, he would have passes deflected all game. Plus his throwing skills not make up for it. Hmm, maybe i should be in the NFL, 5'10 QBs still get 6 for a TD :cool:

ThEgReAtOnE

11-01-2005, 09:37 PM

First off...there's this dumb notion, in this world, of "here comes another black qb...he's too stupid to read coverages and schemes....but he surrree can run! lets stick him at receiver in the NFL!" There's a new age of the College/NFL QB....and it utilizes alot of agility/speed! No longer can a QB stand in the pocket while LB's that run 4.4 or 4.3 40's cracking them in the mouth....or DE's that are litterally as quick as cats crush them, over and over! The speed of the game is, now, amazing...so I believe Qb's of the future need to equal or surpass that speed in order to make plays happen!

With that said...
I think it would be a huge mistake Vince Young to come out this year! I think he could stay in school...work on his mechanics, pass for 3500 yds and 30 tds, next year, showing he can be a solid passer. Just imagine what Vince Young, (RB) Young, Charles, Sweed, Taylor, Pittman, Ross, Moody, MaGee and Kindle could do next year, for the Univeristy of Texas! WOW! But it all starts with Vince Young - who will, no doubt, win the 2006 Hesiman Trophy if he stays!

Bush should come out, because he doesn't play the hardest position on the field, QB, and he's the best overall player in the draft! He's a great skill back...he can play kr, pr, receiver and rb. He's easily the best, all around, threat....even though I just don't see him as a "solid rb" in the league.

Leinart will adapt very easily to hitch-n-go/timing style of the fast pace NFL. He's played in big games, and he'll be rattled every now and then by the speed and aggression of the league, but he'll settle down and become a productive qb. I do think he needs a team around him, though! I mean if he were the starting qb for the Atlanta Falcons he'd probably be in trouble....no receivers, very little mobility. He's a pocket passer..San Francsico and Miami would love to utilize his abilities!

Reaganrattler07

11-01-2005, 09:39 PM

Hdshrinker

11-01-2005, 09:42 PM

Ever heard of two fine guys named Michael and Donovan? Last I checked, they played quarterback....and were damn good ones. And there's also a fine young man with potential by the name of Jason in DC.

I don't think that is the problem. I think the problem is their speed. It influences them to leave the pocket and all too often.....as a result...they are all walking wounded.....thus they rarely make it through the season healthy which of course affects pre-season play.

Reaganrattler07

11-01-2005, 09:44 PM

I don't think that is the problem. I think the problem is their speed. It influences them to leave the pocket and all too often.....as a result...they are all walking wounded.....thus they rarely make it through the season healthy which of course affects pre-season play.

True....Donovan can't run as much and Michael can't stand staying in the pocket whereas Marcus stays only in the pocket....I haven't seen too much about Jason C. though...

Primetime536

11-01-2005, 09:54 PM

pass for 3500 yds and 30 tds,

ok ok lets get real thats will never happen

VY-I promise will not a be GREAT nfl qbs.

About your comment about black qbs, i think black qbs are just as good as white, as soon as one wins the superbowl all that talk will be gone

Reaganrattler07

11-01-2005, 09:55 PM

Primetime536

11-01-2005, 09:58 PM

One already did....Doug Williams.
how many people have? ONE, ya only one, and i can assure VY will not be the next.,

Reaganrattler07

11-01-2005, 09:59 PM

how many people have? ONE, ya only one, and i can assure VY will not be the next.,

And I could agree with you more....until he got injured, I would've said McNabb....but i'd probably go with michael now....

pack4life

11-01-2005, 11:35 PM

:cool:
ok, wide, who knows so much about sports. Throwing sidearm is less acurate, and throws a low ball. In the NFL DLinemen are to good for low balls, he would have passes deflected all game. Plus his throwing skills not make up for it. Hmm, maybe i should be in the NFL, 5'10 QBs still get 6 for a TD :cool:

Remember Rich Gannon? He wasen't too bad huh? Threw sidearmed quite and bit and was one of the most accurate QBs in the NFL. Espically when you are 6'5", it makes throwing the ball sidearmed a little more tolerable.

jtk1519

11-02-2005, 12:02 AM

NFL scouts have already looked at Young's release point and said it his higher than David Carr's and Drew Brees' release point.

Don't look now, I see a sidearm throwing motion...

http://cy90.tripod.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/philiprivers.jpg

Good thing somebody didnt blow a first round draft pick on a tall QB with a crappy release point. Oh wait... :o

wide-e-wide

11-02-2005, 12:13 AM

Who cares?
I don't give a sh... if he throws it under-handed...as long as it gets there...and he runs like freakin' Carl Lewis....does it really matter?

Don't answer that.........
Let's ask all of the d-coordinators in the NCAA....

Ummm...they said HELL NO