Official Top 25 Countdown Thread

[ktchamp97]

2005 5A Texas Football.com Preseason Top 25 Countdown

Here it is folks, the Countdown to #1 has begun! This is the official thread for all preseason Top 25 discussion. Use this thread for all comments about the countdown. Agree? Disagree? Have we lost our minds?

Click the following link to see the actual countdown and to read the team previews:
Main Countdown Page (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/2005_preseason_top25.htm)
***On the link above, Remember to click on each team's name to read the full preview***

2005 Preseason Top 25
1. Coming June 1st
2. Coming June 1st
3. Coming June 1st
4. Lufkin Panthers
5. Longview Lobos
6. Katy Tigers
7. Euless Trinity Trojans
8. Copperas Cove Bulldawgs
9. Converse Judson Rockets
10. Garland Owls
11. Tyler Lee Red Raiders
12. North Shore Mustangs
13. South Garland Colonels
14. The Woodlands Highlanders
15. Dallas Carter Cowboys
16. Abilene Eagles
17. Irving MacArthur Cardinals
18. Duncanville Panthers
19. Denton Ryan Raiders
20. Leander Lions
21. Pflugerville Panthers
22. Schertz Clemens Buffaloes
23. Round Rock McNeil Mavericks
24. A&M Consolidated Tigers
25. Midland Lee Rebels


Ok, let's get some good discussion going!

[Shoot2thrill]

You are going to make some Rebels mad (Midland Lee Rebels) having them so far from the top ten. That being said, I think you are dead on. They will be good but until they settle the QB spot, they have to be regarded carefully. Also, we will have to wait and see if Quis can figure out how to play a little D against some pretty potent offenses they will face. Look forward to more from you guys.... :cool:

[ktchamp97]

No doubt that one will induce some head scratching, but when you really look at them, the loss of McCoy is huge. Now, if they can settle the QB position they could very well end up in the top 10. The field is very deep this year and the fact that Lee is at 25 is a true testament to that.

Really, 25 seems "low," but we're saying that we believe they are among the top 10% of all 5A teams...which ain't bad at all.

[jtk1519]

Lee's not a top 25 team. I think they have lost too much to be there just yet.

[pack0808]

what type of offense does rr mcneill run?? i am just curious?? so far midland lee runs the spread and consolidated the wing-t right??

[ktchamp97]

McNeil runs a 1-back offense. AMC runs a Wing-T with some flexbone type stuff too...similar to what Collins runs.

[pack0808]

is a 1 back offense regular offense under the center or a 1 back spread offense or shotgun?? that collins offense is a fun running offense. lufkin was one of the rare teams that shut them down last year.

[TheDuke]

If RR is ranked at 23 I have a feeling that we aren't gonna be up there! :mad:

[ktchamp97]

pack0808,
Usually, if an offense is specified as "one-back," a great deal of it starts under center.

Duke,
While last year's results do play a role, it's far from the only thing we consider...hang in there my friend. In general, there isn't much separation between the mid teens and low twenties.

[pack0808]

ok if an offense is called a one back set it does usually mean it is under center but in reality that is not the case. shotgun spread offenses use only 1 back most of the time.

[nsmustang]

This is a tough year to pick 'em. The usual suspects will be in the running-SLC, Lufkin etc but I look for a middle of the pack to win one of the 5A titles. That I can tell so far, my Mustangs don't have a state title in the making this year but will be a district and regional contender. I would like to see them in another district, 22-5A would be a good one. They need stronger competition to really gauge them.

[CCHS77]

but I look for a middle of the pack to win one of the 5A titles.


There are 240+ teams in 5A. Are you saying that a team, thought to be ranked about 120 is going to win one of the 5A crowns?

[dragonsdaddy]

i'm betting he means the middle of the top 25 pack.

[ktchamp97]

L and G's,

Sorry for the delay in posting 22 and 21. I have been having internet issues all evening. I will get them up momentarily.

[Rerun]

If RR is ranked at 23 I have a feeling that we aren't gonna be up there! :mad:

dont feel bad, your not the only one whos team is getting no love.

[Rerun]

GUYS, about the clemens preview.its all good, but head coach is Greg Ferrera, not Lenhoff this year.

[ktchamp97]

Major brain fart...good gravy....sorry Headliner.

[Rerun]

no worries its all good. its always hard to remember coaching changes and team colors(gold to be exact, not yellow, but its same difference) its all good. surprised the hell out of me having clemens ranked at all. guess yall just may know a little something.

[ktchamp97]

Should it be blue, navy, cyan, royal, or other? Just playin' ;) . I changed ya to Gold as well.

Seriously though, we will make mistakes here and there, but we really try to get the major stuff right. If anyone sees a discrepancy about their team, feel free to let us know...hopefully in good taste. :)

[LeanderLions3033]

With Pflugerville, and RR McNeil being in the top 25, i find it highly doubtful yall make us the district favorite now :( . We'll try and prove something zero week against westlake. But dont get me wrong, the rankings arent over with yet ;) .

[ktchamp97]

Without giving anything away...

We feel like 15-5A has three really good teams and you could probably take Leander, Pflugerville, and McNeil, write them each on a piece of paper, toss them in a hat, blindly pick one and have just as good a chance to predict who will come out on top.

How's that for ambiguity?

[Rerun]

Should it be blue, navy, cyan, royal, or other? Just playin' ;) . I changed ya to Gold as well.

Seriously though, we will make mistakes here and there, but we really try to get the major stuff right. If anyone sees a discrepancy about their team, feel free to let us know...hopefully in good taste. :)

Hahaha, actually.....according to the school song, its Gold and ROYAL Blue....

Good job again guys.

[Texas Hammer]

Hahaha, actually.....according to the school song, its Gold and ROYAL Blue....

Good job again guys.
You're only saying that because they haven't put Judson in front of Clemens yet! :p

[Rerun]

l2k...converse water tower off kitty hawk-midnight saturday. its on son. :p

[lonny23]

l2k...converse water tower off kitty hawk-midnight saturday. its on son. :p
I can't fight in front of children, even with homefield advantage!

[Rerun]

I can't fight in front of children, even with homefield advantage!
thats why its by the mcdonalds-so they can go in and play on the play set inside while we "talk"

[lonny23]

thats why its by the mcdonalds-so they can go in and play on the play set inside while we "talk"
They always called it "Daddy's McDonalds". We could go to that cheap car wash and not even get wet. They lowered the price from $6 to $2 and that's still a ripoff. I could spit and wash my van better than that joint! :D I laughed when the car wash came under new management, because management is never the problem at a car wash. :confused:

[Rerun]

They always called it "Daddy's McDonalds". We could go to that cheap car wash and not even get wet. They lowered the price from $6 to $2 and that's still a ripoff. I could spit and wash my van better than that joint! :D I laughed when the car wash came under new management, because management is never the problem at a car wash. :confused:

geeeeeeezzzz lonny, you got a van??? now all my previous suspecions are confirmed.

[wide-e-wide]

Hey...hey...hey
I have a van...
As a matter of fact I just got rid of one
and got a new one.
It's either that, or borrow one of the short buses
from the school...
and with my gang, sometimes that would be appropriate.
You can't fit 4 (sometimes 6 kids) in a cool ride. It ain't
happenin'.

[lonny23]

Hey...hey...hey
I have a van...
As a matter of fact I just got rid of one
and got a new one.
It's either that, or borrow one of the short buses
from the school...
and with my gang, sometimes that would be appropriate.
You can't fit 4 (sometimes 6 kids) in a cool ride. It ain't
happenin'.
That's the truth. When I bought the van, one girl was 2 and the other one was 6 months old. I could go to war with all the stuff my wife would put in the van. It made it easier to change diapers, too.

[wide-e-wide]

I only have one left in a car seat.
I catch myself all the time...rollin'
down I-35 with the music blaring
and then I stop and think...
"Dude how big of a dork do you look like?
your jammin' in a mini-van with a car seat in
the back?"
Not exactly a Dr. Dre video...

[lonny23]

I only have one left in a car seat.
I catch myself all the time...rollin'
down I-35 with the music blaring
and then I stop and think...
"Dude how big of a dork do you look like?
your jammin' in a mini-van with a car seat in
the back?"
Not exactly a Dr. Dre video...
You can still pick up women with a minivan and a carseat...

They just happen to be divorced, have 3 kids, and make minimum wage! :D

[Rerun]

geeeezzzzzzzz l2k, wide, yall old folks are killin me. im 20- please dont scare me with stories of mini vans and single mothers.

[lonny23]

geeeezzzzzzzz l2k, wide, yall old folks are killin me. im 20- please dont scare me with stories of mini vans and single mothers.
20 multiplied a few times! :D

[Rerun]

20 x 2 = l2k??? - class of 85 judson???
20 = texas headliner - class of 2003 schertz clemens

[lonny23]

20 x 2 = l2k??? - class of 85 judson???
20 = texas headliner - class of 2003 schertz clemens
OK, your profile says you were born in 1984. I was born in 1971 and graduated in 1989.

I started laughing when you said your interest was drinking beer and you're still 20! :D

[Rerun]

i still wont mind whoppin up on an old fogey :p - car wash?mcdonalds?water tower?you pick-its go time l2k, its go time. ;)

[lonny23]

i still wont mind whoppin up on an old fogey :p - car wash?mcdonalds?water tower?you pick-its go time l2k, its go time. ;)
How did it feel losing to Judson on a missed extra point in 2002? You guys probably deserved to win that game.

[wide-e-wide]

geeeezzzzzzzz l2k, wide, yall old folks are killin me. im 20- please dont scare me with stories of mini vans and single mothers.

Believe me dude it will happen to you too. When you have partied as
hard and as long as I have...one day you'll be sittin' on your patio drinkin'
a beer and looking at your Ford Windstar with the little so and so #whatever football sticker on the back glass...and you will say to yourself...

"man...I need a nap"

[Rerun]

How did it feel losing to Judson on a missed extra point in 2002? You guys probably deserved to win that game.

lonny, thanks for bringing up another memory i had drown out with a lonestar :mad: .the game was intense.in that little tiny stadium i was squeezed in between a couple of my best friends prepared for a W. Nope.Van Syc(sp) missed and game over.OUCH.Oh well.


now its all coming back so clearly. i'll be back, its time for a few more of those lonestars. :(

[wide-e-wide]

Lone Star?
Man I had some of those in my fridge for like 8 months.
Couldn't give 'em away. No taste buds or what?

[LeanderLions3033]

We feel like 15-5A has three really good teams and you could probably take Leander, Pflugerville, and McNeil, write them each on a piece of paper, toss them in a hat, blindly pick one and have just as good a chance to predict who will come out on top.

ahhh, that right there is driving me crazy. finish these things already.

[Rerun]

Lone Star?
Man I had some of those in my fridge for like 8 months.
Couldn't give 'em away. No taste buds or what?

Thats what was the norm. for me and my friends back in hs.loved it then-love it now.Gimme a cold Lone Star and throw on some Gary Allan or Cory Morrow or Hank Williams and I'm good to go.

[Texas Hammer]

Thats what was the norm. for me and my friends back in hs.loved it then-love it now.Gimme a cold Lone Star and throw on some Gary Allan or Cory Morrow or Hank Williams and I'm good to go.
How do you do it, Headliner? You've squeezed 50 years worth of knowledge of demographics and website creation into 20 years? You must've taken the advanced course! :p

[Rerun]

How do you do it, Headliner? You've squeezed 50 years worth of knowledge of demographics and website creation into 20 years? You must've taken the advanced course! :p

I took something alright... :p and if you keep bringing back the old Clemens vs. Judson 26-5A games :( , I might have to make a trip up to the store for some help(lone star)

[wide-e-wide]

Thats what was the norm. for me and my friends back in hs.loved it then-love it now.Gimme a cold Lone Star and throw on some Gary Allan or Cory Morrow or Hank Williams and I'm good to go.

Headliner...where in the world did you grow up...on Hee-Haw?
Ya'll probably drank LoneStar 'cuz it was the only beer they sold
at Ella Mae's store huh? A man your age shouldn't be subjected to
that type of abuse.

[TheDuke]

pack0808,
Usually, if an offense is specified as "one-back," a great deal of it starts under center.

Duke,
While last year's results do play a role, it's far from the only thing we consider...hang in there my friend. In general, there isn't much separation between the mid teens and low twenties.

Sounds good!! I am gonna hold you to it!
:D

[eagleike]

Looks like Ike will be in the top 20 in 2005!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

[Mr. Buddy Garrity]

Looks like Ike will be in the top 20 in 2005!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:
If there in the top 20 MHS should be in the top 10. LMAO! :D :p

[lonny23]

If there in the top 20 MHS should be in the top 10. LMAO! :D :p
Don't you have work to do? At least I'm on leave and just haven't left town yet. I'd report you to your boss, but you might want revenge later on! ;)

[Mr. Buddy Garrity]

Don't you have work to do? At least I'm on leave and just haven't left town yet. I'd report you to your boss, but you might want revenge later on! ;)
Let's just say I love automated systems that help the customer for me. :D

[KT2000]

#20 is up....Leander Lions

#19 is in the works...will be up shortly.

In the meantime, read about Leander.

Skill talent can carry Lions a long way (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank20.htm)

[LeanderLions3033]

15-5a's stud three are now currently slated between 20-23 with Leander at 20 Pflugerville at 21 and Mcniel at 23. Should be a dog fight to say the least.

[Red Raiders]

I wonder if Tyler Lee will be top 10? don't tell me if exact but tell me yes or no. I want it surprise by no one telling me until that date or whatever!

[KT2000]

#19 is up...Denton Ryan

Read about the Raiders...

Underestimate reloading Raiders at your own peril (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank19.htm)

[KT2000]

Wow..we're up to 19 in the countdown and no Region 3 teams have been mentioned yet :eek: . Do we get a mulligan (or three)? ;) :D

[KT2000]

Raider, I won't let you know exactly where Tyler Lee is ranked, but I will say they make an appearance at some point :) . It's almost always a given (or should be anyway) that teams who played in a state championship start the next season as ranked teams.

[Red Raiders]

Raider, I won't let you know exactly where Tyler Lee is ranked, but I will say they make an appearance at some point :) . It's almost always a given (or should be anyway) that teams who played in a state championship start the next season as ranked teams.

Well, What happens if some team lose all starters last season? would they still be ranked top 25?

[KT2000]

Yes, unless the JV and sophomores were something like 1-9 or 0-10. Programs deserve the respect that comes with playing for state in my opinion. Personally, I put a lot of stock in programs that perform well in the post-season (three rounds or further more than once in a span of 3-5 years at min ideally) and Tyler Lee is obviously one of those. Post-season performance isn't all that matters to me when formulating rankings, but it's something I choose to look at very closely. How do you play against the rest of the best when it matters most?

[Favpack]

With Pflugerville, and RR McNeil being in the top 25, i find it highly doubtful yall make us the district favorite now :( . We'll try and prove something zero week against westlake. But dont get me wrong, the rankings arent over with yet ;) .

Your district is getting awfully salty. RR McNeil shocked TWHS, Pflugerville gave LP all they could handle and Leander had a huge run two years ago - not bad at all.

[eagleike]

I want some Ike Eagle props in this top 25!!

After the way the team started last year and to come on and make the playoffs was something.

Come on KT and the champ:

Give old Ike some love!!

[NewSherriffInTown]

I saw a brief portion of Leander's final spring scrimmage.


The passing game did not look spectacular, but the two athletic QBs can certainly run. I didn't get a chance to see Dunn at QB so I don't know. McKinnley(sp?) looked strong and fast. He has a powerful arm as well. He threw 2 TDs with just a flick of his wrist.


I didn't get to see Barnes run the ball too often though. Guillyen had a few carries from the slot receiver.


The defense looked good, so if you guys think they are known to put tons of points on the board, I expect them to be very very good.

[KT2000]

EagleIke,

We're not ready to hop back on the Ike party boat just yet (we really like the new head coaching hire though). I want to see the Eagles show the dominance I came to associate them with in 90s and early 00s before I rank them as one of the best in the state.

Ranking a team in the top 25 means we believe they are better than 90% of the state. Making the playoffs, after the start we witnessed against The Woodlands, was pretty incredible but I'm looking for your boys to show me something about their attitude this year. I've got to see that Ike "swagger" return.

[LeanderLions3033]

Pack,

Dont forget about Cedar Parks cinderella run last year.

[CoppellCowboy57]

I want some Ike Eagle props in this top 25!!

After the way the team started last year and to come on and make the playoffs was something.

Come on KT and the champ:

Give old Ike some love!!

yeah well i want Coppell to be in the Top 25...ha yeah right

[ktchamp97]

#18 posted #17 on the way....

#18 Duncanville Panthers (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank18.htm)

[ktchamp97]

#17 posted...

This one may be surprising, but the talent is there despite what they lost. Following an undefeated district championship season, we feel the recognition is well deserved.

#17 Irving MacArthur Cardinals (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank17.htm)

[LeanderLions3033]

This is getting interesting, not a single region 3 team.

[ktchamp97]

Still no Region 3 teams...

#16 Abilene Eagles (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank16.htm)

[ktchamp97]

Anyone seeing a pattern?

#15 Dallas Carter Cowboys (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank15.htm)

[jtk1519]

Abilene High... #16?!?!?! You've got to be kidding me. They are a top 10 with just the returning starters.

[KT2000]

I hope you're kidding, jtk. ;) AHS could very well end up a top 10 team, but you don't lose the production they did and start the next year as a top 10 team.

[jtk1519]

I hope you're kidding, jtk. ;) AHS could very well end up a top 10 team, but you don't lose the production they did and start the next year as a top 10 team.

You do when the returning talent is of the level of Taylor Potts and Lyle Leong.

[KT2000]

I thought one of Abilene's main strengths on offense last year was the fact they had so many talented skill players. No one could key on one guy without getting burned by everyone else.

I have no doubt Abilene will be good on offense because they can build around Potts/Leong/Bell (whether or not they will be great will hinge on other skill guys stepping up like last year). I think people can overlook the effect a strong defense has on a team overall. You don't lose the bulk of what was one of the best defenses in school history, and start the next year at or above where you ended the last.

If you are willing to overlook the fact that 44 lettermen are gone (to 15 returning) and 16 starters lost (8 each on O and D) then you are officially a braver man than I am. In fact, I actually had to be convinced to have them start at 16. They were around 19-20 in the original drafts.

[jtk1519]

I thought one of Abilene's main strengths on offense last year was the fact they had so many talented skill players. No one could key on one guy without getting burned by everyone else.

I have no doubt Abilene will be good on offense because they can build around Potts/Leong/Bell (whether or not they will be great will hinge on other skill guys stepping up like last year). I think people can overlook the effect a strong defense has on a team overall. You don't lose the bulk of what was one of the best defenses in school history, and start the next year at or above where you ended the last.

If you are willing to overlook the fact that 44 lettermen are gone (to 15 returning) and 16 starters lost (8 each on O and D) then you are officially a braver man than I am. In fact, I actually had to be convinced to have them start at 16. They were around 19-20 in the original drafts.

You sure cant ingnore the talent lost, but you have to take into account the fact that, despite it's low enrollment, Abilene High has turned into a program with VERY high participation numbers. They have turned into a program that is 80%-90% seniors on a 60 man roster. They are always going to be losing a lot of talent. 2004 was really the exception because they returned so much. When a program like Abilene High loses a good amount of talent year in and year out yet continues to reload year in and year out... I think you just have to assume that they are going to keep doing it. That is why I'm not at all bothered by the number of starters lost. Despite the large number of seniors lost, you will probably see another very senior heavy team fielded by the birds this year.

[cougarcb16]

What is up with Dallas Carter? Do those boys always come big? Whats in the water in that city? Well that school district.

[ktchamp97]

#14 posted...Lucky #13 on the way...

#14 The Woodlands Highlanders (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank14.htm)

[Favpack]

I think 16 is a bit low for AHS - but, yes, they did lose a ton of talent - of course, a lot of teams did. Plus - I think Potts could have a year to make us forget about Daniel - and Leong could end up first team all-state very easily at wr. If they have a decent rb to step up - they won't miss much on the offensive end - so they could conceivably give up another 7 points a game and still be just fine. It is hard to imagine 15 teams with a better shot than the Warbirds.

[KT2000]

I think the key thing to keep in mind with pre-season rankings is that they are starting points, not ending points.

Anyone who tries to formulate pre-season rankings with the idea that they'll hold up over the course of the season is not a resident of our particular dimension. As always, the rankings will play themselves out over the course of the season.

[John Vecenda voice]That's the true beauty of football and competitive sport in general.[/Vecenda voice]

[dragonsdaddy]

potts will have to improve his delivery, which i don't doubt he will, to take the next step. leong will also have to get some other skilled help or teams will spend what it takes to stop him. individual receivers aren't as successful as those who fly out of a bevy of talent.

[pack4life]

Woodlands at 14!! like that pick.. not good enough to be in top 10 at this point but good feelings about top 15.... will ranking number 13 be handed out tonight as well?

[jtk1519]

potts will have to improve his delivery, which i don't doubt he will, to take the next step. leong will also have to get some other skilled help or teams will spend what it takes to stop him. individual receivers aren't as successful as those who fly out of a bevy of talent.

Drew Breese didnt have to improve his. David Carr didnt have to improve his. Phillip Rivers, Vince Young, etc. are all doing just fine without people screwing with their mechanics. I've never understood why delivery mattered when you produce... and in the end, that's a QB's job. Taylor completed 66% of his passes for just shy of 3,000 yards. He didnt throw an INT unit the 9th game of the season. I pity the fool that would try and screw with a delivery that put up numbers like that.

[dragonsdaddy]

you may be right. heaven forbid anyone should try to improve oneself. you're right, he should step into the poy jacket without a doubt.

[Favpack]

jtk - you're becoming a Warbird apologist my man :D -- what are you gonna do when the Cougs face Potts next year?

I do agree with KT - this is a starting point - AHS only lost the state MVP on D and possibly their best rb of all time on O. I say let the Eagles get a big chip on their shoulder. This happened to LP in '02 after the '01 title run and we were one deflected pass shy of repeating.

[jtk1519]

you may be right. heaven forbid anyone should try to improve oneself. you're right, he should step into the poy jacket without a doubt.

If it aint broke, dont fix it.

[dragonsdaddy]

if it's good enough for the eagles and the techsters, it's certainly okay with me. have you changed allegiances? you didn't used to be quite so raptorphilic.

[ktchamp97]

Wow, raptorphilic, ey? I'm gonna have to use that one...with your permission of course! Too bad none of our remaining picks will display any sense of raptorphilia :D

#13 South Garland Colonels (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank13.htm)

[jtk1519]

have you changed allegiances?

Nope. I'll root for any local kid no matter what school he attends or plans to attend. Taylor is a good kid with a solid head on his shoulders. He has a God given talent that will take him places. It's hard for me to stomache the fact that Mack Brown didnt go after him, but that is another rant all together. I'll take great pleasure in watching him succeed at Tech.

[TheDuke]

#14 Sounds like a pretty fare start to the season! Sounds like we have some talent coming up this year! Should be a interesting season!

[badger95]

South Garland is a good pick. I saw their speed at the regional track meet and remember their coach, Mickey Moss, from his days at Austin High. He does a great job with getting his best players the ball with room to run.

[owlfan 1]

#13 South Garland Colonels (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank13.htm)

"... a certain arch rival appears primed to take the title back..."

You talking about Lakeview?

[KT2000]

Dang, owlfan, don't get ahead of us now... :)

[BIG FIRM]

number 13 pretty impressive im glad they finally get some recogintion for there acomplishments. :)

[dragonsdaddy]

take it with my compliments ktchamp. there's more where that came from.

[ktchamp97]

Gasp! Finally, A Region 3 team! :eek:

#12 North Shore Mustangs (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank12.htm)

[ktchamp97]

And another Region 2 team...that's 8 if you're scoring at home!

#11 Tyler Lee Red Raiders (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank11.htm)

[dragonsdaddy]

there should be at least 3-4 reg 3 in top 12 then.

[ktchamp97]

Actually, ddaddy, there will only be 2. Region 3 doesn't look too strong this year.

[dragonsdaddy]

so westfield won't make the top 25? surprising. i thought i had 9 of 10 with lview, lufkin, slc, svalley, kt, allen, trinity, garland, and westfield.

[KT2000]

Just sit back and enjoy (or yell choice phrases at the comp screen). Top 10 countdown begins tomorrow.

[dragonsdaddy]

i left judson off. i wouldn't want to short change the monster that is cj.

[CCDawgs05]

I have a quick question to the people who do the guide....ktchamp or kt2000....im not sure.....but do yall send out stuff to your top 25 teams for info on the upcoming season or what do yall do to get the info.....and if the team doesnt respond, do yall drop them from your guide's 25....cause im getting a little itchy cause its the top 10 and i havent seen cove yet.....we are top 10 quality though but i was just wondering....

GO DAWGS '05!!!!!

[KT2000]

We go directly to the coaches for the information. If we can't get information from the coaches, then we try another coach or go through the principle. If not that from the school, then we go through various contacts we've built through years the site has been up and running. Basically, we find a way to get information on teams we are evaluating.

We don't have the statewide resources that we'd like just yet (this site is a hobby for us, always has been). However, we've developed a lot of great contacts across the state since the site started in 2001. Also, it helps to follow high school football as closely as we do because then you don't have to be so reliant on others to tell you what's going on in certain parts of the state. We've made no attempt to hide our pre-season accuracy when it comes to what we end up hitting and not hitting.

We wait a lot later to start getting information than most. We didn't start doing heavy duty work on the Gridiron Guide until mid-April. Basically, the only thing we are comfortable doing in Jan-March is hammering out the format and getting players to watch information. We like to wait until spring gets underway before we go after team stuff.

[LeanderLions3033]

If cove is say, number nine, then Cedar Park would have to be number 8 right ;) . Naw im just kidding, yall have a good young qb, and yall should be fine. One thing that im wondering is, all these teams, and only one 13-5a team? And will somebody represent for 265.

[wide-e-wide]

The Red Raiders at #11. Wow...something tells me that will change real quick.

[eagleike]

SLC
Longview
Converse Judson
Euless Trinity
Garland
Katy
Lufkin
Spring Westfield
Smithson Valley

Who is the 10th selection?

[ktchamp97]

It's definitely not a team you're used to seeing in the top 10 eagleike. ;)

Dragonsdaddy, I was meaning to say that there will only be 2 more Region 3 teams, not 2 in total. I read your post wrong, initially.

[eagleike]

champ:

you are cold man........very cold!!

[ktchamp97]

Ohh crap, no you misunderstood. Sorry. :o We're used to seeing Ike up there from the past, but the team I'm talking about...I can't seem to recall when they've been ranked that high.

[Red Raiders]

The Red Raiders at #11. Wow...something tells me that will change real quick.

Our team will be young again next season like 2 season ago.

Go Red Raiders!!!

[g-town07]

SLC
Longview
Converse Judson
Euless Trinity
Garland
Katy
Lufkin
Spring Westfield
Smithson Valley

Who is the 10th selection?

how about desoto?

[Red Raiders]

how about desoto?

Yes for basketball when they lost to Humble Kingwood like 2 months ago in state champ. lol

[gtowndrumma]

idk, i have this feeling that garland wont be top 10. I just dont think that we will get that kind of respect until we start playing some games in the fall. What do yall think?

[03mustangwideout]

I think that preseason top 25's are just moreless made up of the teams that are great year after year. As a matter of fact id rather not be in the top 25 during the preseason that way the kids get mad and work harder when they see the top 25 ranking kids tend to get cocky or big headed and think that they dont have to work as hard. When the season starts just like it always does the top 25 will change big time. Im really glad to see North Shore 12 i think that is a great starting point for them. The only thing i hate is being in the same district as pasadena it just hurts us every year. it tends to make us too laid back and most of the time a loss is good for a team and in district 23-5a its not going to happen. Anyways good luck to everyone else and congrats to all the top 25 teams hope its a great year for all of yall. GO BIG RED IN 05!!!!!!

[Jtate862003]

Hmmmmm...im glad to see lee at 11 and im not glad to see lee at 11....i would have personally figured they would have been ranked higher.....i dont see much difference in this years team than last other than the fact that ciron is gone..i think jason williams can fill ty's shoes very well......i do see more size on the line now which is a good thing....i have always thought preston was a little better qb than josh just bc of his arm.....but i do definetely see the talent in lee to repeat not saying they will but it's a definite good chance...........Apparent last year you had no big stars you just had a team that had no I's and were COMPLETELY unselfish......i hear that they are alot like that this year and i also hear that the weight room is so full everyday that they are having to turn some away.....but lee will come together as a team the question is when.??

[concha]

And another Region 2 team...that's 8 if you're scoring at home!

#11 Tyler Lee Red Raiders (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank11.htm)

This is truly excellent. Wonderful write-up and commentary.

My complements.

Based on this, I see the match-up with Colerain as follows:

Colerain on Offense: Colerain will have a big size advantage at the LOS, and apparently in experience also (3/5 linemen returning and very good athletes overall). REL might make up for some of this with the speed of their smaller guys. But if I were the REL DC, I would be a little concerned. REL's strength in the secondary won't be of much help here, as Colerain rarely passes. And if REL wants to switch out smaller DBs to get some more size in the box, they will be going to the bench. Colerain's huge question mark here is at QB. Without a good one it is hard to get an option game clicking. Another is the loss of FB Mister Simpson (Michigan). Colerain's RBs will have plenty of speed, but perhaps lack a bigger, stronger power runner like Simpson.

REL on Offense: The REL o-line looks to have good size, but is inexperienced. They will match up to a similarly inexperienced Colerain d-line. However, Colerain will have a LB corps of four veteran players (one a converted lineman from the '04 team). Depending on who they fill the QB spot with, Colerain may have at least one truly excellent DB. But I think it is in the 2ndary that Colerain may have some vulnerability. REL's QB seems like a talented and athletic kid. Despite what sounds like a very solid REL RB also, it is the air game that will probably worry Colerain most.

[KT2000]

Jtate,

I see why you feel like that. Last year, Lee had a pretty weird season with the big start to the year in the first few games and then injuries set in. Then, when everyone got healthy again the team just turned it on at the right time

Lee checks in at 11 due to the younger o-line and questions at linebacker. O-line hasn't been a problem under Owens, but inexperience almost always plays a big role on the OL (at least initially anyway).

Preston Hill has the ability to really establish himself in the eyes of recruiters with a strong senior year. Right now, he's flying below the radar because he hasn't been "the man" until this season.

Also, the lower ranking is due to this being the first time Lee's ever entered a season with the champs' belt. Programs all react differently to that. North Shore cruised through the regular season last year (after winning it for the first time in 03), and just got pummeled by a hungry Spring Westfield team in the second round. Not saying Lee is going to get the same thing, but playing as a defending champ is different just because of what it will bring out of your opponents.

Tyler Lee will need to be extremely disciplined in all phases (minimize mistakes, etc.), have strong leadership (both with captains and coaches) and improve every week to get a chance at repeating.

[R E Lee]

I am mildly shocked at the 11 ranking, but am fine with it being that low. Lee will play well as an underdog. The O-line will be fine, but you are right to be watching the Linebackers. DeHaven and Scates will be hard to replace. Scates could cover any back or receiver or run them down.

[concha]

From Bucknuts.com last season:

"I attended the McKinley-Louisville 7 on 7 Saturday, primarily to check out the Bulldogs, and saw some impressive athletes.

McKinley's Antwon Hight was clearly the most outstanding player on the field. At 6' 4" 280 pounds, Hight moved like a player 75 pounds lighter. Antwon played TE and showed the ability to get deep and catch the football. This combination of size and speed makes Hight one of the top defensive ends in Ohio. Hight, ranked as one of Ohio's top players by Ohio High magazine, told me he has scholarship offers from Michigan State, West Virginia, Akron and Penn State."

Hight was a big, fast and strong kid. In the Ohio D1 title game he lined up against Colerain's Connor Smith (the son of a former Buckeye o-lineman). Smith is Scout.com's #1 recruit for the Midwest for '05. REL may have a hard-time matching up with Smith (6'5" 300+), who completely dominated Hight in the game.

I'm getting the feeling that REL will have alot of trouble with the Colerain ground game and Colerain with REL's pass attack.


This is going to be FUN to watch.

[eagleike]

Allen, Irving, or Copperas Cove?

[ktchamp97]

eagleike,

You're on target...You'll know for sure on Friday.

[ktchamp97]

I am mildly shocked at the 11 ranking, but am fine with it being that low. Lee will play well as an underdog. The O-line will be fine, but you are right to be watching the Linebackers. DeHaven and Scates will be hard to replace. Scates could cover any back or receiver or run them down.

I can understand your sentiments...but, just so you know we ain't picking on you guys...we had North Shore at #12 last year after going 15-0 and beating people 48 to 5 on average.

[cc06football1]

If A&M is 24, the copperas cove better be ranked soon. I figured we would be in the late teens, but if were not on here by 10 than i think we are left out. We are definately a lot better than A&M.

[garlandowl08]

I think Garland probably will not be ranked in the top ten. We might, but the outlook is rather grim...we haven't been preseason ranked in a while, have we?

[eagleike]

Don't sell yourself short Owl. Garland is one tough program and should receive some recognition. Very talented and dangerous.


Just ask the boys over in Lufkin what they think of the owls!! :eek:

[wide-e-wide]

Don't know much about them...they won't build a Hooters in Lufkin.
But Rice is pretty solid...helluva baseball team.

Sorry ...still a touchy subject. I refuse to accept the fact that they
went one and done that year.

[pack0808]

here is my prediction or guess??

1. slc
2. lufkin
3. longview
4. trinity
5. katy
6. judson
7. smithson valley
8. westfield
9. northshore
10. allen

[Hornified64]

Jtate,

I see why you feel like that. Last year, Lee had a pretty weird season with the big start to the year in the first few games and then injuries set in. Then, when everyone got healthy again the team just turned it on at the right time

Lee checks in at 11 due to the younger o-line and questions at linebacker. O-line hasn't been a problem under Owens, but inexperience almost always plays a big role on the OL (at least initially anyway).

Preston Hill has the ability to really establish himself in the eyes of recruiters with a strong senior year. Right now, he's flying below the radar because he hasn't been "the man" until this season.

Also, the lower ranking is due to this being the first time Lee's ever entered a season with the champs' belt. Programs all react differently to that. North Shore cruised through the regular season last year (after winning it for the first time in 03), and just got pummeled by a hungry Spring Westfield team in the second round. Not saying Lee is going to get the same thing, but playing as a defending champ is different just because of what it will bring out of your opponents.

Tyler Lee will need to be extremely disciplined in all phases (minimize mistakes, etc.), have strong leadership (both with captains and coaches) and improve every week to get a chance at repeating.


Nice response to JTate's post....KT2000.

While it DOES clarify (in your opinion)THE Preseason ranking of Tyler
Lee....it is STILL a bit of a snub in the respect department....imho.

How does a program that has now ventured into the playoffs EIGHT
consecutive times, with the last 3 years getting 4, 3, and 5 rounds
deep respectively AND returns as the defending State Champions NOT
begin the season in the Top 10 ???

How does a program return 8 starters (4 each way) and 30+ lettermen
from a State Champion NOT start the next season in the Top 10 ???

Tyler Lee may or may not go deep again this upcoming season...I'm betting
on the former...instead of the latter...but is it going to take yet another
deep playoff run for this group of players, coaches, etc.. to get some
DECENT/PROPER respect from the internet "know-it-alls" when it comes to
a subjective analysis of a preseason poll....at the VERY least a Top 10
ranking ???

If I may give an example...let me preface by stating that the following
team DOES belong within the Top 10...pretty much yearly...not picking
on them....just showing an appropriate analogy....imo! ;)

If Lufkin...which will have a GREAT defensive team...but some questions
on offense...(i.e. replacing their ENTIRE offensive line) starts in the Top
10....which as I mentioned above...will be a given THEN why can't a team
with more proven skill players returning (i.e.QB P.Hill & RB J.Williams
NOT begin the year SOMEWHERE inside the Top 10 ???

These are some VERY valid questions....I realize that in the grand scheme
of things that these Polls matter little....other than for Message Board style
debate...AND #11 isn't too bad of a place to start BUT once again I'm just
curious as to WHAT it's going to take for Tyler Lee to get the proper respect,
a TOP 10 Ranking from this Board ??

Jumping off Soap Box ......

[dragonsdaddy]

kt mentioned that there was a new team, not generally thought of when discussing top ten teams. gpns is in at 12 already.

[pack0808]

oh ok, well my guess is wrong then. :)

[pack0808]

Nice response to JTate's post....KT2000.

While it DOES clarify (in your opinion)THE Preseason ranking of Tyler
Lee....it is STILL a bit of a snub in the respect department....imho.

How does a program that has now ventured into the playoffs EIGHT
consecutive times, with the last 3 years getting 4, 3, and 5 rounds
deep respectively AND returns as the defending State Champions NOT
begin the season in the Top 10 ???

How does a program return 8 starters (4 each way) and 30+ lettermen
from a State Champion NOT start the next season in the Top 10 ???

Tyler Lee may or may not go deep again this upcoming season...I'm betting
on the former...instead of the latter...but is it going to take yet another
deep playoff run for this group of players, coaches, etc.. to get some
DECENT/PROPER respect from the internet "know-it-alls" when it comes to
a subjective analysis of a preseason poll....at the VERY least a Top 10
ranking ???

If I may give an example...let me preface by stating that the following
team DOES belong within the Top 10...pretty much yearly...not picking
on them....just showing an appropriate analogy....imo! ;)

If Lufkin...which will have a GREAT defensive team...but some questions
on offense...(i.e. replacing their ENTIRE offensive line) starts in the Top
10....which as I mentioned above...will be a given THEN why can't a team
with more proven skill players returning (i.e.QB P.Hill & RB J.Williams
NOT begin the year SOMEWHERE inside the Top 10 ???

These are some VERY valid questions....I realize that in the grand scheme
of things that these Polls matter little....other than for Message Board style
debate...AND #11 isn't too bad of a place to start BUT once again I'm just
curious as to WHAT it's going to take for Tyler Lee to get the proper respect,
a TOP 10 Ranking from this Board ??

Jumping off Soap Box ......



lufkin has several skilled offensive starters returning and lufkin is almost always replacing their o-line because they are almost always all seniors on a yearly basis. do not worry though, the ap and coaches go by way too much what happened the year before. i expect tyler lee to be in the top 5 in those 2 polls. they are all just polls but you do have a point. i do respect this preseason poll more then any other usually because it tends to be much more accurate overall then the ap or the coaches poll. it is definitely much more accurate overall then dave's pre season poll on a yearly basis.

[pack0808]

ok i see ns at #12 now. i am guessing cove as the surprise?? unless it is collins?? i do not know how many returners they have though.

[relraiderfan]

I am OK with a #11 ranking. There are definatly arguments both way. We will also find out really quick what Lee will have with a killer non-district schedule.

KT, in your analysis of the LB's I never saw mentioned a kid with the last name of Faber. He played some last year as a sophomore, and I look to see him starting and making some big plays this year for us on D. I saw him make some huge hits last year in our playoff run. I know he has nothing to really mark himself to get mentioned, but I didnt know if yall had heard about him yet, or just chose to leave his name out until he proves it on the field.

[ktchamp97]

Surprise, surprise...another Region 2 team...there are more to come, too!

#10 Garland Owls (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank10.htm)

[KT2000]

Hornified, I think snub is a fair word to use. I can definitely see that from Lee's perspective considering they're defending champs....howeva....

Tyler Lee confused the heck out of me last year in some respects. Talent wise, the '04 group wasn't as strong as '03 or '02 but they just put everything together at the right time and became a great team.

My bottom line with their #11 ranking is this...I just think they are too inexperienced in a couple of very key areas (o line and linebacker). The skill talent is great, it always is.

Pre-season rankings are a true shot in the dark. We gather as much information as possible, pick out all the programs we think are top 25 material, cut it down a time or two and then get to work on the actual order of the top 25.

Judging by our finished rankings for this pre-season, I'd say we de-emphasized how much last year's results influenced the actual order compared to previous years. However, you have to monitor past results from last year (or years in some cases) for pre-season rankings in at least some capacity. That's the most recent on-field data you have, but there are a lot of things that change from one season to the next of course. I've seen teams return 8-8 starters from a playoff team only to miss the post-season the next year.

Our pre-season rankings have held up surprisingly well in past years, we'll see what happens with this one. Personally, I like being able to give yall something to look at until the season gets here but I'm just as (if not more) ready to get the actual season started so these things can sort themselves out.

P.S.- I know Coach Owens has visited this site, as well as a few Tyler Lee players/parents (past and present) so maybe the rankings will be posted in the field house? :)

Honestly, I think a little disrespect may be exactly what they need. I know that it can be very easy to walk by a decked out trophy case, and be satisfied, but the second you do that your edge as a competitor is gone. Satisfaction is not allowed for programs that want to be more than a one hit wonder.

[dragonsdaddy]

my guesstimations are
1-lview
2-slc
3-lp
4-svalley
5-kt
6-spring westside
7-judson
8-allen
9-ccove

[Red Raiders]

Jtate,

I see why you feel like that. Last year, Lee had a pretty weird season with the big start to the year in the first few games and then injuries set in. Then, when everyone got healthy again the team just turned it on at the right time

Lee checks in at 11 due to the younger o-line and questions at linebacker. O-line hasn't been a problem under Owens, but inexperience almost always plays a big role on the OL (at least initially anyway).

Preston Hill has the ability to really establish himself in the eyes of recruiters with a strong senior year. Right now, he's flying below the radar because he hasn't been "the man" until this season.

Also, the lower ranking is due to this being the first time Lee's ever entered a season with the champs' belt. Programs all react differently to that. North Shore cruised through the regular season last year (after winning it for the first time in 03), and just got pummeled by a hungry Spring Westfield team in the second round. Not saying Lee is going to get the same thing, but playing as a defending champ is different just because of what it will bring out of your opponents.

Tyler Lee will need to be extremely disciplined in all phases (minimize mistakes, etc.), have strong leadership (both with captains and coaches) and improve every week to get a chance at repeating.

Jtate, I had the same feeling you have that Lee is number 11 and I thought they will be like number 4 or 5 but the only problem is O-Line. Its ok that Lee is 11 for me because thats the best sport for us. I really think Preston Hill will be better than Josh Hill because 1 thing is last year is when Preston beat No. 1 Lufkin 21-14 and that got us into rank 4 and Lufkin number 6. If our 0-Line was normal than we would be top 5 and our team is very young again (its wierd). Maybe we will be state in 2 years but probably not because theres alot of other teams out there that are good.

I am questinable about Lee vs Colerain game... If we win, I wonder if our rank go up? because Colerain a very good team? I really don't know much about these 2 together in good at what against. Do you really think Lee going to win what you just found out about Lee story next year on the top 25 preseason list? What did you think about that? I am very questinable about Colerain Game.

[LeanderLions3033]

Don't sell yourself short dragondaddy. You will probably be number one until proven other wise. You cant be number 1 nationally and not be number one it texas ;) . And is it just me that doesnt see Lufkin being ranked behind Longview, regardless of returning starters almost.

[odessapermian.com]

What does Cove have coming up that has them ranked so high?

[concha]

Nice response to JTate's post....KT2000.

While it DOES clarify (in your opinion)THE Preseason ranking of Tyler
Lee....it is STILL a bit of a snub in the respect department....imho.

How does a program that has now ventured into the playoffs EIGHT
consecutive times, with the last 3 years getting 4, 3, and 5 rounds
deep respectively AND returns as the defending State Champions NOT
begin the season in the Top 10 ???

How does a program return 8 starters (4 each way) and 30+ lettermen
from a State Champion NOT start the next season in the Top 10 ???



This may ruffle some feathers, but REL is playing one of the top-rated teams from Florida and one of the top-rated teams from Ohio next year. If REL wins, then it's "your state's #(highly) rated team got beat by one that wasn't even in our top ten". If REL loses, then "no big deal, they aren't even top 10 in Texas anyway".

Texas is very proud of its football (and rightly so), but REL's coach himself indicated that as a Texas coach, you don't want to be the one to potentially diminish the aura of Texas dominance in high school ball.

I see no reason for loyal Texas pollsters to be different.

[eagleike]

I told all ya'll that the Owls were a top ten team......................you might as well the ol Ike pick the top ten :D :D :D

[eagleike]

1.SLC
2.Longview
3.Lufkin
4.Spring Westfield
5.Katy
6.Euless Trinity
7.Smithson Valley
8.Converse Judson
9.CCove

[ktchamp97]

Tyler Lee may or may not go deep again this upcoming season...I'm betting
on the former...instead of the latter...but is it going to take yet another
deep playoff run for this group of players, coaches, etc.. to get some
DECENT/PROPER respect from the internet "know-it-alls" when it comes to
a subjective analysis of a preseason poll....at the VERY least a Top 10
ranking ???

I'm not sure what "internet know it alls" you're talking about, but we certainly never claimed to be that. We put this together so that people from all over the state can come together and talk football. We don't do this to feed our egos.

They're #11. You're getting all fired up over one spot out of 244...a 0.4% bump. Again, we ranked North Shore #12 last year after going undefeated the previous season. They're 49-3 in the last four years and we did not rank them in the Top 10 this year either.

We rank teams based on how they look for this season. While last year's results do factor in to the equation, they don't guarantee anything. Nobody can ever take away what Lee accomplished last season...we recognize them for that and I know from experience that it's a tremendous accomplishment.

Yes, the preseason rankings are subjective...there is no scientific, cut and dried way to do them. That being the case, we will often be proven wrong. However, if we rank a team as high as #11, I fail to see how that is a slight. We're saying that they're in the absoute upper echelon ofTexas high school football teams (the top 5%)...that is direct evidence that we feel they are an elite football team.

If Tyler Lee ends up going 4 rounds deep, they will be one of 12 teams still standing...is ranking them #11 that big of a slight???

[pack0808]

garland?? that is not a surprise team?? when yall said surprise i was thinking of teams that none of us would think of. garland was just #1 in the polls a few years back. oh and preston hill did not beat #1 lufkin last year whoever said that. lufkin won the game last year. you must be talking about 2003 when lufkin and tyler lee split with both teams winning at home.

[Redclad]

Concha get over this obsesion of yours? Yeah everybody in Texas is so concerned about our national HS reputation that the publishers of our best HS Football site have conspired to lessen the damage should REL lose. Man, you are really wigging out over this. Here's what I love about you. You first dismiss USA Today because they don't support your contention. Then you cite them when they do. Best HS atmosphere are whatever it was. Let me throw this one at you, where do you think Ohio ranked as a state in per capita representation on last years NFL combined roster? From your praise of recruiters surely this would be the ultimate gauge of talent.

Before I give you the answer let me preface it by stating that that is not at all what the subject you refuse to let go of is about. What it was about before you started losing sleep over the conspiracy monster hiding under your bed was which state, Texas or Ohio has the best HS football. That in my mind is which state consistently produces the best teams. Many of Texas' best teams continue to beat teams with better athletes through having better programs. Now I have no doubt that that is the case in Ohio as well. But to answer the question I posed, Ohio ranks # 15 in NFL players per capita with 73 players on last years combined rosters. Texas ranked 10th with 174 players, 2nd to Californias 200. California ranked 19th per capita.

Now what do Cali and Texas have in common that Ohio doesn't? It is a huge influx of people coming across the borders that contribute greatly to both states rapid and continued growth. It wasn't all that long ago that Ohio had a larger population than Texas. So the answer is that both states should have a bit of a curve as most people that cross the border don't come with footballs in hand. Now I've never been to Ohio much less seen a HS game or stadium or even a cheerleader except for one featured in Playboy and I will give due credit for that. Bottom line is this, coming on this board and trying to convince Texas HS football fans, ones who like yourself are feverish and know the game is kind of like people in Texas going on a Florida board and trying to convince them we have better beaches. Florida was #5 on the aforementioned list by the way
.
Now you seem to be a pretty hard headed sort so I'll take my time, as well as yours and anyone else that chooses to endure this increasingly long post to explain how I came up with this ranking.
I compiled the list by taking the numbers provied by the NFL of all of last years rostered players and the state they played HS ball in. I divided that number by the states population (most current) and dropped all the zeros because it is such a small fraction Ohio; 73 players divided by a population of 11,353,140 = .00000643 (rounded) or indexed to 6.43 Texas: 174 players divided by a population of 20,851,820 = 00000834 (rounded) or indexed to 8.34 which means Texas has a 29.7 per cent advantage in player talent if we are to apply this using your equally ridiculous recruiter standard.

Now why did I waste so much time and enegy on a pointless arguement? Just to waste a small fraction of your time that you have wasted of ours collectively. My appologies to my Texas Bretheren. But for those of you so bored that you continue to read this, let me offer you some interesting numbers using the same formula.

#1 Louisianna 18.80
#2 Washington D.C. 17.48 (not a state but interesting)
#3 Mississippi 16.87
#4 S Carolina 13.21
#5 Florida 10.82
#6 Georgia 10.51
#7 Alabama 9.89
#8 Hawaii 9.08 (hmmm)
#9 Iowa 8.54

Of other interest

#17 Oklahoma 6.09
#27 Pennsylvania 4.89
#30 Michigan 4.51
#36 Alaska 3.19
#46 New York 1.79
And the state that gave us Howard Dean 0.00 notta, now that tells you something. New Hampshire had no players as well. But Canada had 12 and Australia 2. American Samoa, Demark, England, Germany, Jamaica, New Zealand, and South Africa all had one.

Now this little exercise though way too long does tell us something. You can do anything with numbers, but the fact that the best HS Football is played anywhere other than the Great State of Texas is a fools arguement. And Jamaica has better football and bob sledding than does Vermont.

Now, Concha just get over it?

Good Night and Good Riddance.

[wide-e-wide]

Ummmm...uhhhhh....okay.
I guess that just about sums it up.
However, you didn't factor in the 1.21 jiggawatts
necessary for time travel.

[Jtate862003]

From Bucknuts.com last season:

"I attended the McKinley-Louisville 7 on 7 Saturday, primarily to check out the Bulldogs, and saw some impressive athletes.

McKinley's Antwon Hight was clearly the most outstanding player on the field. At 6' 4" 280 pounds, Hight moved like a player 75 pounds lighter. Antwon played TE and showed the ability to get deep and catch the football. This combination of size and speed makes Hight one of the top defensive ends in Ohio. Hight, ranked as one of Ohio's top players by Ohio High magazine, told me he has scholarship offers from Michigan State, West Virginia, Akron and Penn State."

Hight was a big, fast and strong kid. In the Ohio D1 title game he lined up against Colerain's Connor Smith (the son of a former Buckeye o-lineman). Smith is Scout.com's #1 recruit for the Midwest for '05. REL may have a hard-time matching up with Smith (6'5" 300+), who completely dominated Hight in the game.

I'm getting the feeling that REL will have alot of trouble with the Colerain ground game and Colerain with REL's pass attack.


This is going to be FUN to watch.


COncha......IF you recall LEE went into most games outmatched on the o and d-line with exception of ciron black lee's lin really wasnt that big....and i dont think many if any teams have a much bigger line than euless trinity did.,.....good examination of the game...and i just hope lee comes out on top

[ktchamp97]

garland?? that is not a surprise team?? when yall said surprise i was thinking of teams that none of us would think of. garland was just #1 in the polls a few years back. oh and preston hill did not beat #1 lufkin last year whoever said that. lufkin won the game last year. you must be talking about 2003 when lufkin and tyler lee split with both teams winning at home.

Pack,
Garland wasn't the surprise I was thinking of. We figured most people would expect them to be ranked. The team I was talking about is one that we figured few people would guess.

[pack0808]

oh!! houston westide maybe?? or how about san marcos or maybe a fossil ridge. ok i am just purely guessing now?? :) and wide lmao at the 1.21 jiggawatts. :D that one almost made some beer come out of my nose. lol

[Shoot2thrill]

Now I've never been to Ohio much less seen a HS game or stadium or even a cheerleader except for one featured in Playboy and I will give due credit for that.

LMAO. Thanks for starting my day with a laugh. Too funny. :D . The rest of the post gave me a headache but I appreciate your time you spent on this.:cool: BTW, did the Ohio Playboy cheerleader look pretty good?

[Redclad]

Sorry, it was meant to give a headache by illustrating what a bunch of numbers have to do with anything. And yes she looked quite studious. I think Texas girls are better though.

[concha]

Concha get over this obsesion of yours? Yeah everybody in Texas is so concerned about our national HS reputation that the publishers of our best HS Football site have conspired to lessen the damage should REL lose. Man, you are really wigging out over this. Here's what I love about you. You first dismiss USA Today because they don't support your contention. Then you cite them when they do. Best HS atmosphere are whatever it was. Let me throw this one at you, where do you think Ohio ranked as a state in per capita representation on last years NFL combined roster? From your praise of recruiters surely this would be the ultimate gauge of talent.

Before I give you the answer let me preface it by stating that that is not at all what the subject you refuse to let go of is about. What it was about before you started losing sleep over the conspiracy monster hiding under your bed was which state, Texas or Ohio has the best HS football. That in my mind is which state consistently produces the best teams. Many of Texas' best teams continue to beat teams with better athletes through having better programs. Now I have no doubt that that is the case in Ohio as well. But to answer the question I posed, Ohio ranks # 15 in NFL players per capita with 73 players on last years combined rosters. Texas ranked 10th with 174 players, 2nd to Californias 200. California ranked 19th per capita.

Now what do Cali and Texas have in common that Ohio doesn't? It is a huge influx of people coming across the borders that contribute greatly to both states rapid and continued growth. It wasn't all that long ago that Ohio had a larger population than Texas. So the answer is that both states should have a bit of a curve as most people that cross the border don't come with footballs in hand. Now I've never been to Ohio much less seen a HS game or stadium or even a cheerleader except for one featured in Playboy and I will give due credit for that. Bottom line is this, coming on this board and trying to convince Texas HS football fans, ones who like yourself are feverish and know the game is kind of like people in Texas going on a Florida board and trying to convince them we have better beaches. Florida was #5 on the aforementioned list by the way
.
Now you seem to be a pretty hard headed sort so I'll take my time, as well as yours and anyone else that chooses to endure this increasingly long post to explain how I came up with this ranking.
I compiled the list by taking the numbers provied by the NFL of all of last years rostered players and the state they played HS ball in. I divided that number by the states population (most current) and dropped all the zeros because it is such a small fraction Ohio; 73 players divided by a population of 11,353,140 = .00000643 (rounded) or indexed to 6.43 Texas: 174 players divided by a population of 20,851,820 = 00000834 (rounded) or indexed to 8.34 which means Texas has a 29.7 per cent advantage in player talent if we are to apply this using your equally ridiculous recruiter standard.

Now why did I waste so much time and enegy on a pointless arguement? Just to waste a small fraction of your time that you have wasted of ours collectively. My appologies to my Texas Bretheren. But for those of you so bored that you continue to read this, let me offer you some interesting numbers using the same formula.

#1 Louisianna 18.80
#2 Washington D.C. 17.48 (not a state but interesting)
#3 Mississippi 16.87
#4 S Carolina 13.21
#5 Florida 10.82
#6 Georgia 10.51
#7 Alabama 9.89
#8 Hawaii 9.08 (hmmm)
#9 Iowa 8.54

Of other interest

#17 Oklahoma 6.09
#27 Pennsylvania 4.89
#30 Michigan 4.51
#36 Alaska 3.19
#46 New York 1.79
And the state that gave us Howard Dean 0.00 notta, now that tells you something. New Hampshire had no players as well. But Canada had 12 and Australia 2. American Samoa, Demark, England, Germany, Jamaica, New Zealand, and South Africa all had one.

Now this little exercise though way too long does tell us something. You can do anything with numbers, but the fact that the best HS Football is played anywhere other than the Great State of Texas is a fools arguement. And Jamaica has better football and bob sledding than does Vermont.

Now, Concha just get over it?

Good Night and Good Riddance.

Wow. That WAS long.

A couple of questions:

1) To which "recruiter" standard of mine do you refer? I don't recall throwing out stats like this. I did point out once that Texas has more recruits than Ohio - but then that doesn't fit in with your little tirade, so?????

2) I have made quite a few posts here on this site in recent days, but don't recall saying Ohio football is superior to that of Texas. In fact, overall, I have suggested the opposite.

Perhaps your neurons are misfiring over the suggestion that Colerain might well have beaten SLC had they played last year? Or perhaps it was from the suggestion that an Ohio team might actually be able to beat one of Texas' better programs this coming September?

Take your medication. Oh, and it's time for Woppner - don't miss it.

[TheDuke]

STOP REMINDING ME ABOUT RR BEATING US PLEASE!! :mad: :D

[Hornified64]

Hornified, I think snub is a fair word to use. I can definitely see that from Lee's perspective considering they're defending champs....

I know Coach Owens has visited this site, as well as a few Tyler Lee players/parents (past and present) so maybe the rankings will be posted in the field house? :)

Honestly, I think a little disrespect may be exactly what they need. I know that it can be very easy to walk by a decked out trophy case, and be satisfied, but the second you do that your edge as a competitor is gone. Satisfaction is not allowed for programs that want to be more than a one hit wonder.


Thanks for your response...KT2000.

I must say that I nearly spewed my drink out when I read that you are
admitting a snub of REL in this Preseason Top 25.

While I clearly enjoy your website,(as it pertains to the BEST coverage
of Texas Class 5A Football on the internet), your credibility takes a hit
on this topic....imho.

Why should REL be disrespected in order to give them "what they need"
for the upcoming season ??? What's up with a statement like that ??

I,too, know Coach Owens and his entire staff for that matter, and believe
me THEY couldn't give a hoot about where they're ranked on this poll.

Yes, I'm sure that this poll MAY very well be used as incentive by
SOMEONE on the inside at REL...but why is that really necessary??

As I asked previously, what must it take to gain that respect factor from
ANY pollster ?? EIGHT more consecutive playoff trips...THREE more straight
DEEP playoff runs ??? HUH ???

BTW....REL isn't a ONE HIT WONDER either. They are a MAINSTAY on
the 5A Football playoff landscape (as shown above) and should FINALLY
be afforded that notice...i.e a CLEAR TOP 10 Ranking....not just
on the outside looking in !! To answer Ktchamp97...there's a
difference between THE TOP 10 and #'s 11-25...so give the %'s etc.
a rest in trying to show how "elite" REL STILL is in the poll !

Believe me, Owens and his staff DO NOT rest on their laurels...so
"satisfaction" of last years Title will be used as a motivating force
for this and following years to come. Also,to refresh your memory...it
took REL the first 5 years of the playoff run to get past the 2nd round and
boy have they ever....the last 3 years have been those types of seasons
that have MORE than earned them respect OR at least it should have...imo!

It's apparent, at least to me, that they may never gain that RESPECT
from this board.

[pack0808]

my lord, you act as if he insulted your mother. lol i would disagree in a big way if he had lufkin out of the top 10 and i would debate but i would not act like he just slapped my mom in the face in front of me. it is just preseason rankings and it is ok just breathe. ;) lufkin was not in the top 10 by any pre season rankings in 2002 after they just won the title in 2001 that i can remember?? i know they were not ranked in the top 10 in the coaches or ap which is rare because they are very predictable by going by what happened the year before. lufkin just used it as motivation and were #1 in the state by the 4th week of the year and almost won another titile in 2002. i agree though, i am a big believer in a great program that is consistent. you cannot go by returners when you are talking great programs. lufkin lost an absolute load in 2002 and 2004 and they made it to the state semis both those years. it is not a clear indicator but what is?? i would not want kt's job is all i am saying. you are never going to make everybody happy. some will want to torch you. that is part of the game.

[Red Raiders]

garland?? that is not a surprise team?? when yall said surprise i was thinking of teams that none of us would think of. garland was just #1 in the polls a few years back. oh and preston hill did not beat #1 lufkin last year whoever said that. lufkin won the game last year. you must be talking about 2003 when lufkin and tyler lee split with both teams winning at home.

When Josh Hill was hurt in 2003, Preston Hill took over and beat Lufkin at home.

[Red Raiders]

Ummmm...uhhhhh....okay.
I guess that just about sums it up.
However, you didn't factor in the 1.21 jiggawatts
necessary for time travel.

You look like a spammer.

[wide-e-wide]

What in the world is that supposed to mean?

[concha]

It seems that there are mutterings that the poll s being used to provide incentive to REL. Why? Is it being used to push other teams also? Isn't a poll supposed to a fair and objective assessment?

I have suggested part of the answer previously. Look at the early weeks of REL's schedule versus most, if not all, of the other Texas powers in the poll. Whose schedule has the most implications for Texas' reputation as the dominant football state in the nation?

BTW: Before I get the obligatory "You are a non-Texan" verbal assault complete with accusations of things I have not said, please note that I would not be surprised to see the same from an Ohio pollster. If you see Colerain outside the top 3 in Ohio, then somebody is trying to "push" Colerain.

[dragonsdaddy]

years ago when jesuit took on and was strummed by the big, mean ohio school, it was seen as proof of equality throughout hs football. this visit, being early in the year won't prove as much as if you could create a later season matchup. last year in week 3, tlee lost to a good trinity team which they came back and eliminated when it counted. few teams peak for non-district games. when a marathon district and po race is the goal, winning this game at all costs would be silly. i doubt you could convince the kids of it, but good coaches will use this game for what it really is, a tune-up for winning district and another run at the playoffs. i'm guessing that our northern cuz's feel similarly.

[concha]

years ago when jesuit took on and was strummed by the big, mean ohio school, it was seen as proof of equality throughout hs football. this visit, being early in the year won't prove as much as if you could create a later season matchup. last year in week 3, tlee lost to a good trinity team which they came back and eliminated when it counted. few teams peak for non-district games. when a marathon district and po race is the goal, winning this game at all costs would be silly. i doubt you could convince the kids of it, but good coaches will use this game for what it really is, a tune-up for winning district and another run at the playoffs. i'm guessing that our northern cuz's feel similarly.

Since Moe beat Jesuit, Texas has grown greatly as a football power. And Jesuit wasn't a Texas public school anyway. Though we regularly have games with neighboring states, I can't recall an Ohio power playing a distant power such as a team from Texas, Florida or California for many years. I know that Massillon and McKinley have a loss to a Miami school and a California school in the last 5-10 years, but they were both very down years (McK's worst in decades) and neither school has been amongst the creme de la creme since the late 90s (despite McKinley being in last year's state final, they were far from the best team in Northern Ohio).

[ktchamp97]

Thanks for your response...KT2000.

I must say that I nearly spewed my drink out when I read that you are
admitting a snub of REL in this Preseason Top 25.

While I clearly enjoy your website,(as it pertains to the BEST coverage
of Texas Class 5A Football on the internet), your credibility takes a hit
on this topic....imho.

Why should REL be disrespected in order to give them "what they need"
for the upcoming season ??? What's up with a statement like that ??

I,too, know Coach Owens and his entire staff for that matter, and believe
me THEY couldn't give a hoot about where they're ranked on this poll.

Yes, I'm sure that this poll MAY very well be used as incentive by
SOMEONE on the inside at REL...but why is that really necessary??

As I asked previously, what must it take to gain that respect factor from
ANY pollster ?? EIGHT more consecutive playoff trips...THREE more straight
DEEP playoff runs ??? HUH ???

BTW....REL isn't a ONE HIT WONDER either. They are a MAINSTAY on
the 5A Football playoff landscape (as shown above) and should FINALLY
be afforded that notice...i.e a CLEAR TOP 10 Ranking....not just
on the outside looking in !! To answer Ktchamp97...there's a
difference between THE TOP 10 and #'s 11-25...so give the %'s etc.
a rest in trying to show how "elite" REL STILL is in the poll !

Believe me, Owens and his staff DO NOT rest on their laurels...so
"satisfaction" of last years Title will be used as a motivating force
for this and following years to come. Also,to refresh your memory...it
took REL the first 5 years of the playoff run to get past the 2nd round and
boy have they ever....the last 3 years have been those types of seasons
that have MORE than earned them respect OR at least it should have...imo!

It's apparent, at least to me, that they may never gain that RESPECT
from this board.

Hornified,
I don't know what my partner was saying about this snub stuff. I have no idea where he's coming from with that. That's not at all what I thought when I gave my reasonings for having Lee at #11. I feel they are about where they should be going into this season. Again, what they did last year was incredible, but it's a new year.

If you want to think that #11 is disrespect, fine. To me, disrespect would be not ranking them at all, so I guess that's where our perspective differs.

The fact is, there are alot of really good looking teams at the top this year and Lee is one of them...there just happens to be 10 others that appear to have what it takes to go into the late rounds of the playoffs. In other years, Lee would be a shoe in for a top 3 or 4 with the talent they have, but there are so many teams that look just as good this year.

It's not about disrespect, it's not out of some ploy, or spite, or anything like that. I enjoy watching Lee play, I admire their program, and I wish y'all the best of luck trying to repeat.

[owlfan 1]

How can being ranked number 11 in the state to start the season be considered disrespect or a snub? REL finished with a trophy last year - a well deserved one. This year, they have a great chance to do it again, along with several other teams. Everyone knows they are a great program. They deserve to be mentioned right along with SLC, SV, Judson, Lufkin, Longview, Katy and the rest. Seems like they're getting a lot of respect, at least from my perspective...

[KT2000]

Hornified,

Tyler Lee wasn't "snubbed" on purpose. I don't see where our motive to do something like that would be. I went back and edited my message after posting because it didn't read like I intended. So, you might want to go read it again. What I was trying to say is that I understood where you were coming from by feeling snubbed, but I obviously did a crappy job of relaying that in my first post.

Ranking Tyler Lee 11th is saying we think they are better than 95.5% of the state. I don't think that would fall into the disrespect category.

[Redclad]

Wow. That WAS long.

A couple of questions:

1) To which "recruiter" standard of mine do you refer? I don't recall throwing out stats like this. I did point out once that Texas has more recruits than Ohio - but then that doesn't fit in with your little tirade, so?????

2) I have made quite a few posts here on this site in recent days, but don't recall saying Ohio football is superior to that of Texas. In fact, overall, I have suggested the opposite.

Perhaps your neurons are misfiring over the suggestion that Colerain might well have beaten SLC had they played last year? Or perhaps it was from the suggestion that an Ohio team might actually be able to beat one of Texas' better programs this coming September?

Take your medication. Oh, and it's time for Woppner - don't miss it.

Conch, you know full well what recruiter standard I referred to, it was yours.
I've been a member of this board since shorty after it started and long before that on the previous board. I just don't post every time I read something. You, with your Texas envy just compelled me to do so. As you can see from my number of posts you have surpassed me rather quickly. Now as far as my medication goes I'm fully stocked and good to go. Now as for my neurons, they are still firing away but under your wistful gaze I just get kind of nervous.

In all seriousness, you came on this board and your bait provided a catch. I just decided to chime in, my method happened to be a lampoon. You do know what a lampoon is I hope. NO it's not a boat. NO it's not something you spear a whale with. One more guess. NOOO... OK I guess it could be an aggie prom date.

[wide-e-wide]

an aggy prom date...ha!
KT2000 with lock this thread in 5....4.....3....2....

[wide-e-wide]

Enough suspense already...give us #9.

[Red Raiders]

Is Horny I meant Hornified thinks Lee shouldn't be on top 25 is that what he meant?

[Red Raiders]

Enough suspense already...give us #9.

Why do you keep double posting? say something in 1.

[eagleike]

Ya'll need to post the top 10 earlier in the day. The last few postings have been put up on the board way past my bedtime! :)

[owlfan 1]

Why do you keep double posting? say something in 1.

that's irony...

[wide-e-wide]

Why do you keep double posting? say something in 1.

Forgive me 'O Mighty God of the Message Boards...I have
committed an incredible sin. I posted back-to-back...
It will never happen again. Please forgive me...'O great one
for I am not yet as good at this as you.

[ktchamp97]

Ask and you shall receive, eagleike...

#9 Converse Judson Rockets (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank09.htm)

[NewSherriffInTown]

Wow...


that is a small team. Not expected from a "top 10 Texas HS football team" when you are coming from NY.


That speed sounds fun to watch though.

[ktchamp97]

Judson has always been small, but is has never mattered. Permian was a smaller team back in their heyday as well. They don't play small, and that is the key. Those two teams were and are the epitome of team football.

[KT2000]

Coach Rackley likes to get as much speed on the field as possible, especially on defense. Defensively, at least in my experience anyway, Judson is known as a program that tackles you in swarms. They capitalize by beating the opposition to the football, and you'd better not turn the ball over against a defense with that kind of speed on the field.

Judson has comparable size to most programs on each line. As you can see, the receivers aren't tiny. If Judson didn't have Tony Harp, it'd be fun to watch an athlete like Derrick Williams play free safety.

[concha]

Conch, you know full well what recruiter standard I referred to, it was yours.


No. I don't. Show me.

[ktchamp97]

Concha & Redclad...take it to PM's if you don't mind. Thanks.

[wide-e-wide]

I'll take a guess----

1. SLC
2. Smithson Valley
3. Lufkin
4. Katy
5. Longview
6. Spring Westfield
7.?
8.?

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y294/bogthekid/P1010067.jpg

[Favpack]

I've got no problem with REL being 11. If they make the semi's in D1 - that puts them in the top 12 or so if you consider there's still 8 teams left in DII - that's a pretty deep run to me Hornifield. They've got a ton of holes to fill - but Owens & Co. will fill it and be in the hunt come December - that's almost a lock at this point with his program.

[Rerun]

why does each team have a nice helmet or logo and clemens has a pic of their lame flag on their ranking page?

[KT2000]

We don't have helmets for everyone.

[JudsonStud19]

Coach Rackley likes to get as much speed on the field as possible, especially on defense. Defensively, at least in my experience anyway, Judson is known as a program that tackles you in swarms. They capitalize by beating the opposition to the football, and you'd better not turn the ball over against a defense with that kind of speed on the field.

Judson has comparable size to most programs on each line. As you can see, the receivers aren't tiny. If Judson didn't have Tony Harp, it'd be fun to watch an athlete like Derrick Williams play free safety.
Judson has got plenty of speed and an abundence of great athelets to compete for us next year... All with one thing that stands out above all the other teams in the state... Discipline... Tony Harp should have been named number one returning player in my mind... 117 tackles... thats big... Not knocking my Fatty Adolph any... But still.... Derrick Williams played CB as a freshmen.

[Texas Hammer]

why does each team have a nice helmet or logo and clemens has a pic of their lame flag on their ranking page?
They only need helmets and logos for Teams of the Week and state champs, not Teams of the Weak! :p

[Rerun]

http://eteamz.active.com/SA5ABASEBALL/images/ClemensLogo.jpg

[BIGrNtx12]

Judson has never been lacking in the speed and athletism catigory. Although they are and will be an excellent team, for now, I think #9 is good for them. It is sweeter to knock off the higher teams as being the underdog. I can't wait to see the SV Judson game next year. It's going to be packed, standing room only!

[Rerun]

They only need helmets and logos for Teams of the Week and state champs, not Teams of the Weak! :p

L2K YOU TELL ME WHEN YOU ARE IN SA AND ITS ON

[Texas Hammer]

They only need helmets and logos for Teams of the Week and state champs, not Teams of the Weak! :p

L2K YOU TELL ME WHEN YOU ARE IN SA AND ITS ON
I'll be back on Saturday and hopefully to see the Spurs LOSE!!

[nsmustang]

Thanks Dragonsdaddy. Let me rephrase: I look for a middle team of the top ten, (between 3 and 7) to win one of the titles. It's unreal to think a team ranked 125 would win a title unless you are from Hollywood.



There are 240+ teams in 5A. Are you saying that a team, thought to be ranked about 120 is going to win one of the 5A crowns?

[Hornified64]

Is Horny I meant Hornified thinks Lee shouldn't be on top 25 is that what he meant?


RedRaiders,KT2000, Ktchamp97.....

To clarify....

I think that REL is or should be a TOP 10 ranked team...say
SOMEWHERE in the 5- 6-7 range....imo !

#11 IS NOT a sign of respect for a school/team that is the
DEFENDING State Champions that DOES bring back just as many
if not more experienced players as say those that will be
ranked in that range.

Yes, #11 is within the Top 95.5% of all Class 5A teams (as
has been pointed out AND noted) BUT perspectives DO DIFFER
between this keyboard and the ones that are divising this
POLL.

BTW, I'm a Longview High fan/graduate....but also a fan of teams that
are well coached and are proving it with RESULTS....yet STILL aren't being
shown REAL respect....as it pertains to the poll.

I've said enough on this topic.

[Rerun]

They only need helmets and logos for Teams of the Week and state champs, not Teams of the Weak!

L2K YOU TELL ME WHEN YOU ARE IN SA AND ITS ON
__________________
"I'm a country plowboy, not an urban cowboy, and I dont ride bulls but I have fought some men, drive a pickup truck, trust in God and luck and I live to love Texas women."
-Hank Williams Jr.
Last edited by KT2000 : Today at 12:57 AM.

why am i getting black balled? why the editing? i am officially the whipping boy of this forum now.

[KT2000]

We don't allow personal attacks. Just consider it a warning, that's all. You seem pretty on edge around here lately considering it's not even June yet. Pace yourself!

[cc06football1]

This is an anwser to the question a while back that asked what does cove have coming up to make them top 10.
To start we have a running back named Donald Buchram who I would love to see anyone run him down from behind. State 100m dash runner. Runs a 4.32. His backup and one of our starting coners also is a burner with 4.4 speed.
Our QB Brent Garner is a stud athlete and is great at everything he does. Runs a 4.5 and can throw anywhere on the field. A little short but will probally still go to a D1 program. He also will get some time at kicker where he recently kicked a 55 yard field goal in our spring scrimage. His backup will be a name to remember, Robert Griffin. He is a 6'3 200lb FRESHMAN QB, who can run a 4.5 and is still getting comfortable in his body after he he grew so much. Throws a rocket and can move. Watch for when the either QB is in for the other to maybe get time in at reciever.
Our receivers are young and talented. Everyone wants to talk about Alphonso Powell(two time first team all-district) at reciever, but he will be the surprise of the year at corner. He is a beat at corner and extremely physical. So with him getting limited time at wide out we have three junior to be recievers with all running 4.5 and two of them are 6'2.
The only question on our team is the OLine, but as one of them I will tell you I would like to see someone underestemate use because of our size. We average less than 220lbs and under 6'0. We have one or two 6'1 240 guys, but thats the biggest we get. But the bright side iswe can all run sub 4.9 .
Our defense is now switching to the 3-4 and is the best D in the district.
The dline is anchored by James Porter, an unknown who moved here last year, and has blown up in workouts. He now squats 500 and benches 325, power cling 300.
Linebakers are talented. Sterling Lewis is a beast. 6'0 220 4.5 speed. He is overlooked because he was small last year but beefed up now. Trey Henderson is the other inside linebaker. A converted QB with some size, and has a nose for the ball. Dwayne Thomas is the outside pass rusher. He has the pass rushing ability of a DE and the size and speed of a corner. The other outside linebaker is Sascha Johnson who is a freak athlete. at 5'2 170 he is the strongest guy on the team. He can bench 340, squat 500, and powercling 315. He can also run a 4.4 forty.
Our Secondary might be the best in the state. Junior All-state last year Tim Atchinson is the leader at saftey. He is 6'2 190, and a big playmaker with D1 offers. Of course the before mentioned Alphonso Powell, who I know will be an all state selection at CB runs sub 4.4. The other corner is spilt with Jarrod Milsap(the num 2 RB) and Marion Gowins(Num 1 WR) both are young and very talented. We also have the district newcomer from last year Joseph Leary returning at the other Saftey spot.
I think that all constitutes a top ten

[Rerun]

l2k knows i am playing around. lets not get ridiculous.

[wide-e-wide]

why am i getting black balled? why the editing? i am officially the whipping boy of this forum now.

Does this mean I'm not the whipping boy anymore?
Woo-hoo!
Ce----le----brate good times come on......

[CCDawgs05]

This is an anwser to the question a while back that asked what does cove have coming up to make them top 10.
To start we have a running back named Donald Buchram who I would love to see anyone run him down from behind. State 100m dash runner. Runs a 4.32. His backup and one of our starting coners also is a burner with 4.4 speed.
Our QB Brent Garner is a stud athlete and is great at everything he does. Runs a 4.5 and can throw anywhere on the field. A little short but will probally still go to a D1 program. He also will get some time at kicker where he recently kicked a 55 yard field goal in our spring scrimage. His backup will be a name to remember, Robert Griffin. He is a 6'3 200lb FRESHMAN QB, who can run a 4.5 and is still getting comfortable in his body after he he grew so much. Throws a rocket and can move. Watch for when the either QB is in for the other to maybe get time in at reciever.
Our receivers are young and talented. Everyone wants to talk about Alphonso Powell(two time first team all-district) at reciever, but he will be the surprise of the year at corner. He is a beat at corner and extremely physical. So with him getting limited time at wide out we have three junior to be recievers with all running 4.5 and two of them are 6'2.
The only question on our team is the OLine, but as one of them I will tell you I would like to see someone underestemate use because of our size. We average less than 220lbs and under 6'0. We have one or two 6'1 240 guys, but thats the biggest we get. But the bright side iswe can all run sub 4.9 .
Our defense is now switching to the 3-4 and is the best D in the district.
The dline is anchored by James Porter, an unknown who moved here last year, and has blown up in workouts. He now squats 500 and benches 325, power cling 300.
Linebakers are talented. Sterling Lewis is a beast. 6'0 220 4.5 speed. He is overlooked because he was small last year but beefed up now. Trey Henderson is the other inside linebaker. A converted QB with some size, and has a nose for the ball. Dwayne Thomas is the outside pass rusher. He has the pass rushing ability of a DE and the size and speed of a corner. The other outside linebaker is Sascha Johnson who is a freak athlete. at 5'2 170 he is the strongest guy on the team. He can bench 340, squat 500, and powercling 315. He can also run a 4.4 forty.
Our Secondary might be the best in the state. Junior All-state last year Tim Atchinson is the leader at saftey. He is 6'2 190, and a big playmaker with D1 offers. Of course the before mentioned Alphonso Powell, who I know will be an all state selection at CB runs sub 4.4. The other corner is spilt with Jarrod Milsap(the num 2 RB) and Marion Gowins(Num 1 WR) both are young and very talented. We also have the district newcomer from last year Joseph Leary returning at the other Saftey spot.
I think that all constitutes a top ten


Very Well said.....i can sum it up in four words........WERE GONNA BE GOOD

[LeanderLions3033]

WERE GONNA BE GOOD

Better than Cedar Park? ;)

[lonny23]

Very Well said.....i can sum it up in four words........WERE GONNA BE GOOD
I have a question for you guys. You talked a lot of trash in pre-season last year and played decent against Judson, but lost by 16 on the road. I still propped you guys up and you lost in Bi-District.

You had talent and speed last year and I'm wondering if you'll play better this year or if you're Waco Southwest.

[lonny23]

l2k knows i am playing around. lets not get ridiculous.
I don't know what you said, but I do know you're joking around about stuff.

[Rerun]

they didnt edit my words, they edited my size. it was in huge font and i guess that was "pushing it" because it was in large print and bold. :rolleyes:

[CCDawgs05]

I have a question for you guys. You talked a lot of trash in pre-season last year and played decent against Judson, but lost by 16 on the road. I still propped you guys up and you lost in Bi-District.

You had talent and speed last year and I'm wondering if you'll play better this year or if you're Waco Southwest.


I think we will be better this year....we have the talent and alot more speed and im not worrying about....lets respect each others team before and after week one...alrightly lonny :D

[ktchamp97]

Week 1 (Sep. 2nd) at Bulldawg stadium should be fun...

#8 Copperas Cove Bulldawgs (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank08.htm)

[jtk1519]

Week 1 (Sep. 2nd) at Bulldawg stadium should be fun...

#8 Copperas Cove Bulldawgs (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank08.htm)

I cant say is Cove is worthy of such a ranking or not, but I saw their QB play during the Abilene 7 on 7 SQT last year and he was the real deal. Probably the best looking QB out there and that was a tournament that featured Taylor Potts and Chris Hall.

[KT2000]

JTK, you know who this Cove group reminds me of? The Dawgs remind me of Abilene going into last year with a few differences obviously.

Abilene entered last season off of an 8-5 season the year before. They had 15 starters back including a bunch of all district players

Cove has 13 starters back from a 10-2 team that went undefeated in a district where 6 of the 8 teams finished with winning records. 10 of those 13 returning starters are all-district.

Cove has a ? on the OL, and I think Abilene did as well going into last season. Cove returns an experienced QB, which Abilene did not (seemed to work out ok). Cove returns a ton of skill talent just like Abilene did last year as well as all of their key players on defense.

I think Cove has a chance to top their 1998 season with Vontez Duff this year, but we will see.

[eagleike]

Allen is not even worthy of the top 25?

[KT2000]

Allen graduated a ton of production from their 9-3 squad last year. Charles Opeseytian is the saving grace to what was an otherwise decimated offense to graduation. Nathan Dick (junior to be) got some playing time last year behind is older brother, but threw for less than 50% and had 4-4 TD-INT ratio in his time. I'm sure he'll be a lot better with some varsity experience under his belt. The top two receivers are gone including all-star talent Brennan Gleason. The most talented player on the defense, Marcus Shavers, is also gone.

The above mentioned Opeseytian and the punter are the only two all-district guys that Allen has back. They have a lot of numbers in the program, but it's never easy to replace the kind of production that they lost. Of course, they can play their way into the top 25, but we're not going to start them out there.

[ktchamp97]

Well, Allen lost their QB, their 1st and 3rd leading rusher, and their top two receivers. They've had a solid program in recent years, so I expect that to continue, but they don't have enough coming back to warrant a preseason ranking in our estimation. Charles Opeseytian will be really good as their feature RB, but he's about their only sure thing.

[Red Raiders]

I'll take a guess----

1. SLC
2. Smithson Valley
3. Lufkin
4. Katy
5. Longview
6. Spring Westfield
7.?
8.?

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y294/bogthekid/P1010067.jpg

Thats about the same with me except Lufkin would be number 2.

[wide-e-wide]

I think KT2000 and KTchamp both know that any time you
put out a poll you are subject to ridicule. And for that I admire
them. Howeva,(voice of Steven A. Smith) I hope that in doing this
poll they make an a-- out of themselves. It makes for better discussion
on the board. I plead with them not to do the PC thing and automatically
put SLC at #1...Longview deserves it...give it to 'em.

[supercentex]

For the past two years Cove has gotten Waco High and A&M Consolidated at home.

This year, they have both of them on the road.

But yeah, those guys are loaded. Can't wait to see Judson play at Cove.

[KT2000]

Wide, I'm sure you saw is coming but why do you think Longview should be ranked #1 ahead of say...Lufkin or even Westfield? Not trying to be a punk, an honest question.

Both teams seem to return about the same about of key players on each side. Lufkin is better set in the secondary and at receiver. Longview has a better backfield. Both teams will have amazing front sevens on defense.

Westfield has key players back at every position from a team that went to the state championship game last year as a group full of juniors and some sophomores who started. Southlake Carroll has won 47 of 48 games in class 5A...that speaks for itself.

Why, in your opinion, should Longview be ranked ahead of programs like that to start the season? Not saying the Lobos can't win state this year, but based on what we have to go on right now...what would be your reasoning?

[wide-e-wide]

KT2000 ...I have already stated that the only thing better
than beating Longview 10 times in a row...is beating them
10 times in a row and doing it while they are ranked #1.
Other than that I have no reason. I know that in December
they will be there. No doubt....all of this mumbo-jumbo now
is meaningless. I mean it supplies a pacifier to the masses...
But in the end you and I both know these polls are pointless.

So again to answer your question...just because I guess.
For selfish reasons....Just so when LP spanks that (bleep)
we can say " I thought ya'll were #1?" ...thats all

[eagleike]

1. SLC
2. Spring Westfield
3. Lufkin
4. Longview
5. Katy
6. Smithson Valley
7. Euless Trinity

ktchamp or KT2grand: Tell eagleike he's got it right!!

[Texas Hammer]

1. SLC
2. Spring Westfield
3. Lufkin
4. Longview
5. Katy
6. Smithson Valley
7. Euless Trinity

ktchamp or KT2grand: Tell eagleike he's got it right!!
It's pretty clear that Longview is behind Lufkin and Westfield, but you have S Valley too low.

[ktchamp97]

Eagleike, you are oh so close. Texas lonny Hammer is trying to spoil the surprise, but y'all still don't quite have it. ;) Just a couple more days fellas.

[Xfballphenome05]

maybe this?

1. SLC
2. Lufkin
3. Spring Westfield
4. Longview
5. Smithson Valley
6. Katy
7. Euless Trinity

[LeanderLions3033]

I honeslty think that fballphenome127 has nailed the top 7. It just seems like the right order.

[Texas Hammer]

I honeslty think that fballphenome127 has nailed the top 7. It just seems like the right order.
It may be the right order. There is no disparity between D1 and D2 this year. We might have the same D1 semifinal matchups as last year. There are going to be some great non-district and district games this year! :)

[KT2000]

No one has it so far. All will be clear by Wednesday. Hang in there!

[NewSherriffInTown]

Did we figure out who is the team that isn't usually in the top 10 yet??

Was it Cove??

[eagleike]

Honestly, how the h#%ll did you actually become a starter writing posts like the last one................CCove? Go back and read some of the previous posts for lord's sake :mad:

[NewSherriffInTown]

I know they are a good program, but they lost to a nobody last year. It seemed like some people didn't like their ranking up there...it was a question because the rest of the supposed top 10 seems like better programs than them to me....

When we heard that a top 10 team was going to be a non perennial contender I was hoping for something crazy.

If the team is Westfield then I think it doesn't count. It's WELL documented that Westfield had one of the youngest teams around last year and they played for a state title.

[NewSherriffInTown]

ok i see ns at #12 now. i am guessing cove as the surprise?? unless it is collins?? i do not know how many returners they have though.



Here is a veteran who asked the same thing...so why don't you worry about yourself Allenike....thanks...have a great day.

[ktchamp97]

Goodness ike, why the animosity? It was a legitimate question. Since we've been doing this, Cove has been good, but never that highly ranked. So yes, that was the one we were talking about.

[NewSherriffInTown]

Thanks, KT...

I didn't know what to think there. I'm sorry to everyone if I ever screw something up. I've never seen a Texas game in my life. I think I'm doing pretty well in the "what's going on in Texas" dept.

[wide-e-wide]

Think fast...what's the state flower?

[NewSherriffInTown]

I heard this last week....Bluebonnet


but I did forget already lol

thank god for the internet

[ktchamp97]

You are relentless wide-e. Hah. I don't even know the answer to that one, but I bet it grows way out in the country...like, say, in Lufkin.;)

[wide-e-wide]

KTChamp...now I know you took Texas History at some point back in
school...we had to learn all that stuff in 7th grade. Now if I can remember
it and that was almost 20 years ago...you should too...LOL

No actually we have a huge field of them down the street from my home here in Waco...wait a minute...does that make Waco country?
I told my wife when we first moved here. Waco is Lufkin with
a major university and an interstate.

[Rerun]

you know what really pisses me off? when parents take pictures of their little kids along the side of the highways in the blue bonnets. get out of my area with that weak crap. dont make traffic slow down just so baby jackson can have a pic taken of his so that grandma beverly can see it.

[NewSherriffInTown]

A major university and an interstate go a long long way.



I'll be sure to slap the momma of any kid that I see getting his picture taken in some bluebonnets for ya :D

[wide-e-wide]

"Get out of my area" hahahahaha...that's funny.
Like the only freakin' bluebonnets in the state are on the
side of the highway.

Okay back to the countdown...got side-tracked for a minute.

[Rerun]

"Get out of my area" hahahahaha...that's funny.
Like the only freakin' bluebonnets in the state are on the
side of the highway.

Okay back to the countdown...got side-tracked for a minute.

for real. im tryin to go 90 on loop 1604(aka death loop as called here in SA) and these ugly soccer moms are takin pics of there ugly kids slowin down traffic. i got stuff to do - get outta my way women!!!

[ktchamp97]

Speaking of rankings...I'm getting #7 ready to go. It should be up by 5:00pm.

[wide-e-wide]

5:15 what's the deal KT?
you didn't forget about us did you?

[ktchamp97]

Nah man...got held up a bit...Here it is...

#7 Euless Trinity Trojans (http://5atexasfootball.com/05rank07.htm)

[wide-e-wide]

Okay...I have read the formula that you guys use when
picking who's who...So am I to be under the assumption
that even if a team went undefeated last season...it doesn't
matter...we are going off of this years returning players...
and what impact they had with last season's team...? right?
What I'm getting at is this....
Why do I get the feeling the Pack is going to be #1?
call me crazy...but I think it's gonna happen...

[ktchamp97]

You are correct in the assumption that we weigh heavily the team's returning starters and what impact they had on last year's team, but it is combined with their record last year, and their tradition of being able to fill the apparent gaps. Those, I would say, are the main criteria and they've worked pretty well for us.

Some teams don't usually return alot, but are always good. When those teams do return a bunch of productive players, then you have to consider them as one of the very best...as is Trinity's case.

We've said for awhile now that any of the teams ranked #1 through #7 have an equal shot at winning state...there's just not much separating any of them.

So, to your hunch...Lufkin could be our #1, but even if they're #6 (either could true, neither could be true;)), I'm telling you that we recognize that they have everything they need to win a state title.

[NewSherriffInTown]

Personally...

I know the preseason is just preseason and rankings mean nothing and all that jazz but in a year where 7 teams can certainly win a title supposedly...there is no way that SLC can be moved from #1. If they didn't bring anyone back and some other team looked sooo powerful, sure...

but if everyone is admitting how tight the race is, SLC has to be #1.

and everyone is talking about who loses what, SLC lost big pieces in Daniels and Luna, but Lukfin lost a huge piece (literally) in Lane.

So I think they return the same amount of talent. It will depend on who's holes get filled better thats all.


KT...

As a newbie to Texas I just want to thank you guys for this site, and the countdown. It's been fun. I can't wait to meet all my fellow Texas HS football nuts sometime down the road.

[ktchamp97]

Sherriff...thank you, and you're quite welcome. This is fun for us too.

[wide-e-wide]

You are correct in the assumption that we weigh heavily the team's returning starters and what impact they had on last year's team, but it is combined with their record last year, and their tradition of being able to fill the apparent gaps. Those, I would say, are the main criteria and they've worked pretty well for us.

Some teams don't usually return alot, but are always good. When those teams do return a bunch of productive players, then you have to consider them as one of the very best...as is Trinity's case.

We've said for awhile now that any of the teams ranked #1 through #7 have an equal shot at winning state...there's just not much separating any of them.

So, to your hunch...Lufkin could be our #1, but even if they're #6 (either could true, neither could be true;)), I'm telling you that we recognize that they have everything they need to win a state title.



Cool...so we are on the same page.
I didn't think you would lead on one way or the other...
I still have a feeling they are gonna be up there. 1 or 2 ...

[ktchamp97]

Further evidence of how strong the top 7 are...

#6 Katy Tigers (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank06.htm)

[Dds115]

Man I wouldn't have expected some of these teams to be so low! Must be one heck of a top 6 if you ask me. Hopefully you won't be showing my dragons for another 5 days. haha

[eagleike]

Ktraitor2000:

You cannot be serious!

Smithson Valley ahead of the Houston titan? Give me a break. Did you not watch the finals last year? Yes, SV played a hell of a game but the boys played way over their head. There is no way the rangers have more talent than your own home town boys!!!!!

[Red Raiders]

My Final Prediction :)
1. Lufkin
2. Southlake Carroll
3. Smithson Valley
4. Spring Westfield
5. Longview (same rank as last year)

[ktchamp97]

You got two of them right. ;)

[eagleike]

Give me and the board an explanation:

Compare SV to Katy. Give us a one on one comparison. Position by position. Man on man.

This is the only way I will ever accept the cheatin rangers as the top 6 in :mad: the state!!!

SA Madison, Katy deserve better!!!!!!!!! :mad: :mad:

[Xfballphenome05]

well ,considering the talent we have returning,and in the past meetings with katy we have won,i think its fair that we are ranked ahead of katy.and its not who has the best players ,"man to man" its who plays better as a team,and if theres on thing coach hill prides himself on is his players playing as a team.and i definatly think its fair we are ranked ahead of madison.would u like to explain y u r so mad at the rangers?(personal problems with them).

[eagleike]

Just having some fun with the SV fans ............gotta have some controversy to keep the excitement level up!!

The Rangers are more than deserving to be ranked in the top 5. Great coaching, quality kids, and loyal fans................what more could you ask for?

How about taking the number 1 ranked team in the state and nation down to the last play of the DII state title game!!!

Good luck this season...........at least until the semis!! :)

[ktchamp97]

Possibly the best preseason #5 ever...

#5 Longview Lobos (http://www.5atexasfootball.com/05rank05.htm)