Denton Ryan Beats themselves

[zippy]

Joey has made 3 calls so far that I just cant believe. I know Denton Ryan is not a very good team this year, but come on. You dont have to gamble that much... They were playing well against them, why the stupid calls?

[drcrow2]

that is exactly what I am thinking. The 4th down call on the opening poss. was the biggest. Does the Denton coach understand the field post. game?

[Lobo9498]

I know I might get ripped by the SLC fans, but I don't care. SLC has not shown me much. You put pressure on the QB's and they crumble. Denton Ryan has killed themselves, or this game would be closer. Just my observations from an outsider. Ryan can't run, or pass. It's not so much that SLC is that good, but Ryan is that bad.

[LoboFan07]

It's not so much that SLC is that good, but Ryan is that bad.

I agree.

[c-lisle]

Cmon Lobo9498, come on here were saying the same thing about Longview last week. This SLC team is very good. I agree if Ryan had an offense this game would be much closer. I think Carroll is more beatable this year than they have ever been in 5a. I think LP or Lview will beat them assming they go D2.

[Lobo9498]

Or Trinity, or Plano. I know they are "good", but they are showing some flaws. Just my opinion. You can't tell me you don't see them? You pressure their QB and he crumbles. They have only had a few big pass plays, but they've worked.

[Lobo9498]

Cmon Lobo9498, come on here were saying the same thing about Longview last week. This SLC team is very good. I agree if Ryan had an offense this game would be much closer. I think Carroll is more beatable this year than they have ever been in 5a. I think LP or Lview will beat them assming they go D2.

And, we were up 21-0 at the end of the 1st. SLC was only up 7-0. Go figure. Ryan has shot themselves in the foot after making some good plays. Not so much SLC's D shutting them down. Ryan's offense has shut themselves down. Longview's D WAS shutting Lee's D down.

[RidgePride]

I know I might get ripped by the SLC fans, but I don't care. SLC has not shown me much. You put pressure on the QB's and they crumble. Denton Ryan has killed themselves, or this game would be closer. Just my observations from an outsider. Ryan can't run, or pass. It's not so much that SLC is that good, but Ryan is that bad.
SLC looked pretty much the same way last year against Ryan. They Still beat Lufkin and won a state championship.

I don't think TV does SLC justice.

It is very hard to get pressure on SLC QB. Those O-Lineman are huge and very very good.

[Lobo9498]

It took a late field goal to win the title. they didn't have it in hand until then.

[ThEgReAtOnE]

Or Trinity, or Plano. I know they are "good", but they are showing some flaws. Just my opinion. You can't tell me you don't see them? You pressure their QB and he crumbles. They have only had a few big pass plays, but they've worked.


Longview isn't that great as well! And SLC would have a field day on those DB's! I think YOU STILL HAVE TO BEAT SLC before you say anyone else can!

We'll see. There's about 6-8 teams that have a shot to knock them off. Longview is one of them.


Oh and Denton Ryan isn't that bad, at all!!

[BigArab]

SLC looked pretty much the same way last year agains Ryan. They Still beat Lufkin and won a state championship.

I don't think TV does SLC justice.

Well, then I guess it's the Lobos turn to be unimpressed.

You guys somehow managed to be unimpressed with our game last week, I think all of us are in agreement that we're rather unimpressed with you guys. Go figure...maybe it is TV.

[c-lisle]

Or Trinity, or Plano. I know they are "good", but they are showing some flaws. Just my opinion. You can't tell me you don't see them? You pressure their QB and he crumbles. They have only had a few big pass plays, but they've worked.


I definately think they are human, but vI'm not sure how many flaws they have.

Keys to beating SLC IMO:

1) offense must control the clock
2) pressure the QB
3) field position - DR has been giving SLC half a field all night and SLC is just to good at the big play for that.

Like I said before they look much more beatable and I think they would have a lot of difficulty with the East Texas schools this year.

[LoboFan07]

Longview isn't that great as well! And SLC would have a field day on those DB's! I think YOU STILL HAVE TO BEAT SLC before you say anyone else can!

We'll see. There's about 6-8 teams that have a shot to knock them off. Longview is one of them.

Oh and Denton Ryan isn't that bad, at all!!

Wow.

We can say whatever we want...Just like you guys did last week. Denton Ryan is down A LOT from what they were last year. Lets not forget that beating they had againist Highland Park.

SLC did not look impressive at all in that first half. Stupid mistakes on Ryan's side such as, not tackling, leaving guys WIDE open, penalties, going for it 3 4th downs inside their own zone, has SLC up 24-0.

Ryan doesn't look anything like they did last season at this time.

[Lobo9498]

I doubt it's so much the TV. Just the competition. SLC hasn't played anyone, and won't until the playoffs. They blow everyone out, then when the title by a field goal. And, most would agree they got lucky against Lufkin. Lufkin was up on them, but handed it to them for some reason. I am all for supporting your team, I do that with the Lobos. BUT, I also look at the other teams as objectively as possible. If I was impressed with SLC, I would say so. I am impressed at how well the run the no huddle. That is something that is not easily done in high school. Their QB McElroy can pass, that's for sure. He should do just fine at TT where they like to pass and run up the score.

[c-lisle]

Longview isn't that great as well! And SLC would have a field day on those DB's! I think YOU STILL HAVE TO BEAT SLC before you say anyone else can!

We'll see. There's about 6-8 teams that have a shot to knock them off. Longview is one of them.


Oh and Denton Ryan isn't that bad, at all!!


you have no clue what you are talkiing about. Our DBs are very good. Take away Lee's TD last week and they got nothing passing the ball. Our DBs have 13 INT combined for the season. Very solid group of guys.

[BigArab]

you have no clue what you are talkiing about. Our DBs are very good. Take away Lee's TD last week and they got nothing passing the ball. Our DBs have 13 INT combined for the season. Very solid group of guys.

You've got to give that receiver credit. There was nothing that D-back could've done without drawing a foul. That was just an amazing catch.

[Lobo9498]

Also, Marshall is the ONLY team to score more than 14 on our Defense. We have to even play SLC first. We may not even meet them. They could get beat, or not even go the same way we go. We could get beat too.

You know, whenever I hear a SLC fan say we have to beat them, or that we haven't beaten Lufkin, or other crap like that, it makes me think they are scared to play Longview. Because they KNOW what kind of team we have. While, you see the Lobos saying BRING IT ON. We will play any team we have to. We will not shy away. And, if we get beat, we will say good game to the winners. THAT is the way Longview and their fans are. We aren't afraid to play ANY team. And, we win with class.

[toonman]

I think you are all being very critical of SLC. I watched the LV vs. TL and it is half time in the SLC vs DR game. Tyler Lee is a team in decline that will not reach the play-offs, so they were easy to pick off by LV. Denton Ryan is 2nd in the District, having on lost only 1 game and was on the rise, until today. I am very impressed with the SLC Defense and for Lobo fans to dismiss the SLC defense as nothing special is a bit short sighted. As for the SLC offense, I see everything it was built up to be - only the Rushing has failed to get going. However, Coach Florence is the reason DR are losing by 24 points. Why gift wrap the ball to SLC.

[BigArab]

Also, Marshall is the ONLY team to score more than 14 on our Defense. We have to even play SLC first. We may not even meet them. They could get beat, or not even go the same way we go. We could get beat too.

You know, whenever I hear a SLC fan say we have to beat them, or that we haven't beaten Lufkin, or other crap like that, it makes me think they are scared to play Longview. Because they KNOW what kind of team we have. While, you see the Lobos saying BRING IT ON. We will play any team we have to. We will not shy away. And, if we get beat, we will say good game to the winners. THAT is the way Longview and their fans are. We aren't afraid to play ANY team. And, we win with class.

It's a moot point on this board.

One thing McElroy will have to improve upon at the next level is touch. He doesn't seem to have too much touch. (I know I know...splitting hairs here.)

[c-lisle]

You've got to give that receiver credit. There was nothing that D-back could've done without drawing a foul. That was just an amazing catch.


I thought he out of bounds...but I was at the other end of the field...it was a good catch...by their best receiver I think


How about that one handed INT by Kelcie...that was the best play of the night

[c-lisle]

I think you are all being very critical of SLC. I watched the LV vs. TL and it is half time in the SLC vs DR game. Tyler Lee is a team in decline that will not reach the play-offs, so they were easy to pick off by LV. Denton Ryan is 2nd in the District, having on lost only 1 game and was on the rise, until today. I am very impressed with the SLC Defense and for Lobo fans to dismiss the SLC defense as nothing special is a bit short sighted. As for the SLC offense, I see everything it was built up to be - only the Rushing has failed to get going. However, Coach Florence is the reason DR are losing by 24 points. Why gift wrap the ball to SLC.


SLC will have a very difficult time with the running attack of Lview...that's why I think we can beat them this year.

[BigArab]

I thought he out of bounds...but I was at the other end of the field...it was a good catch...by their best receiver I think


How about that one handed INT by Kelcie...that was the best play of the night

You mean Cartez?

[c-lisle]

No..I'm pretty sure it was Kelcie. Could be wrong though. I think they both had INT's.

[BigArab]

No..I'm pretty sure it was Kelcie. Could be wrong though. I think they both had INT's.

I thought there was only 2 INTs...One by Cartez where he just stepped in front of the receiver, and another where Marcus aired it out too long and it got picked off by Laderrick (or Calvin...I forget which one is which)

[LoboFan07]

It was Cartez.

[DragonWatcher]

I doubt it's so much the TV. Just the competition. SLC hasn't played anyone, and won't until the playoffs. They blow everyone out, then when the title by a field goal. And, most would agree they got lucky against Lufkin. Lufkin was up on them, but handed it to them for some reason. I am all for supporting your team, I do that with the Lobos. BUT, I also look at the other teams as objectively as possible. If I was impressed with SLC, I would say so. I am impressed at how well the run the no huddle. That is something that is not easily done in high school. Their QB McElroy can pass, that's for sure. He should do just fine at TT where they like to pass and run up the score.


Uh I don't know what game you were watching but SLC was up on Lufkin by a lot at halftime. If your refering to 02 you would be correct but in no way was the 04 game that way. SLC was dominating at half and let lufkin come back to tie it.

[Lobo9498]

Sorry about that, got it mixed up. I've slept since then. LOL

[TrojanFan4Life]

DR looks much better this half in defense - they need to wrap their men up -

At least Florence took responsibility for the deficit of his team - I don't think either team SLC or DR are the teams they were last year. Still good but not unbeatable.

I still haven't figured out why DR is not throwing down field AT all!!!

[TrojanFan4Life]

Finally a pass down field - YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! it worked for first down - go figure!

[southlake thug]

Alright I know you guys love to criticize McElroy. So what do you guys think so far?

If he could get a little speed he could be deadly. He is straight up running people over.

[bhs06]

I knew this game would not be close at all.

The only reason its televised is because this is the toughest regular season test for the Dragons. It shows the weakness of 5-5A.

I could name hundreds of more worthwhile games for national TV

[LoboFan07]

Ok....I guess Delay of Game is legal in this game?

[BigArab]

Alright I know you guys love to criticize McElroy. So what do you guys think so far?

If he could get a little speed he could be deadly. He is straight up running people over.

The only thing I've really drawn so far is that I can see why he wants to go to TT. Other than that...touch...it needs work. He's lucky he has talented receivers.

[dragonfootballfan]

The only reason its televised is because this is the toughest regular season test for the Dragons. It shows the weakness of 5-5A.

or it could just show how strong carroll is

[dragonfootballfan]

Ok....I guess Delay of Game is legal in this game?
they did not reset the clock properly. That clock was not the official one. The referree had it

[LoboFan07]

And you know this...how?

[southlake thug]

dragons know everything

[dragonfootballfan]

And you know this...how?
not resetting the clock is a pretty common occurance and referrees always keep the official time. If the clock had expired for that long the ref would have noticed for sure.

[southlake thug]

McElroy for President!

[Reaganrattler07]

dragons know everything

Haha, of course they do....i mean, look at Draongs08!

I gotta ask this but how can you be from Southlake and be a "thug"?.... :confused: You didn't pimp out your hummer or something, did you?

[BigArab]

McElroy for President!

....you guys are acting like he's the next Peyton Manning.

[PackAttack2005]

You Lobo and Dragons are becoming fast friends. I will tell the SLC folk's one small fact, McElroy would not have that much time to throw against Longview or Lufkin. Both have much more speed than Denton Ryan. Denton Ryan is not as good as advertised, as is Tyler Lee this year. I still bet that a SLC-Longview game would be a hard fought toss up.

[southlake thug]

We have discussed the thug name way to many times. There is a good amount of sarcasim involved in the name. I am just showing a side of southlake that non of you realize.

[BigArab]

If Denton Ryan is getting penetration with 3 Defenders vs. 5 O-lineman, then Lufkin or Longview would eat their lunch. It looks like they have trouble containing the edge rushers.

[southlake thug]

Yeah I will agree, a fast blitzing team could tear this dragon O up. But I have been encouraged by the progress of this team each week. Many people dont realize that McElroy barely got any PT in each of his first 3 years of high school. He is adapting to a new level of football.
And the O-Line has been playing alot better latly.

[dragonfootballfan]

If Denton Ryan is getting penetration with 3 Defenders vs. 5 O-lineman, then Lufkin or Longview would eat their lunch. It looks like they have trouble containing the edge rushers.
I know there is so much penetration it is unbelievable. I can't believe that McElroy can throw for more than 250 yards and 5 touchdowns

[Reaganrattler07]

Yeah I will agree, a fast blitzing team could tear this dragon O up. But I have been encouraged by the progress of this team each week. Many people dont realize that McElroy barely got any PT in each of his first 3 years of high school. He is adapting to a new level of football.
And the O-Line has been playing alot better latly.

Yeah....I can imagine a lot of sarcasm intended.

I can't think of any high school that uses fast blitzing techniques though....course I don't know a lot about teams outside of Region IV though.

[BigArab]

I know there is so much penetration it is unbelievable. I can't believe that McElroy can throw for more than 250 yards and 5 touchdowns

I will say again, if Denton Ryan is getting PENETRATION (notice I didn't say sacks) with 3 D-lineman vs. 5 O-lineman, then Longview or Lufkin would eat their lunch.

Except, Longview and Lufkin would get the sacks.

[Texasfrog]

You Lobo and Dragons are becoming fast friends. I will tell the SLC folk's one small fact, McElroy would not have that much time to throw against Longview or Lufkin. Both have much more speed than Denton Ryan. Denton Ryan is not as good as advertised, as is Tyler Lee this year. I still bet that a SLC-Longview game would be a hard fought toss up.

Denton Ryan and Tyler Lee would be a good game. Ryan may be slighlty better but not much.

[dragonfootballfan]

I will say again, if Denton Ryan is getting PENETRATION (notice I didn't say sacks) with 3 D-lineman vs. 5 O-lineman, then Longview or Lufkin would eat their lunch.

Except, Longview and Lufkin would get the sacks.
truthfully there has not been much penetration. They have been in the backfield like four times, but that has stopped since the second quarter

[southlake thug]

Yeah....I can imagine a lot of sarcasm intended.

I can't think of any high school that uses fast blitzing techniques though....course I don't know a lot about teams outside of Region IV though.


I meant to say fast... and blitzing.

McElroy is starting to handle the rush and pressure better, but they are still some questions that need to be answered.

[ruffshod]

Yeah....I can imagine a lot of sarcasm intended.

I can't think of any high school that uses fast blitzing techniques though....course I don't know a lot about teams outside of Region IV though.

North Shore and Westfield are two that come to mind. And defensively, they would eat SLC's lunch and ask for seconds. Their linebackers are faster than those recievers. As the RB, Sawyer showed in the first half, SLC can't handle speed. And both NS and WF brings speed from top to bottom.

[dragonfootballfan]

North Shore and Westfield are two that come to mind. And defensively, they would eat SLC's lunch and ask for seconds. Their linebackers are faster than those recievers. As the RB, Sawyer showed in the first half, SLC can't handle speed. And both NS and WF brings speed from top to bottom.
I think Sawyer has 36 rushing yards. He is really shredding carroll's defense with his speed

[eagleike]

Let's see what everyone brings to the table in December. So far no team except Katy has stepped into the ring with the Dragons and had their hand held up at the end.

They just keep on winning while all of ya'll just keep on speculating :eek:

[Kingwolf]

absolutely amazing.............

lot of my fellow Lobos on here jumping on SLC b/c of a bad half....we have had a couple of those you know.......

ummm one question guys, we have had a very hard time bringing down Horn's and Lee's QB the last few weeks, and yet we would do better than DR????(not overall just with the sack issue)

just want your observation....

until they are beaten, they are what they are....defending champs and #1......

[GoOwls]

Wow, surprise of surprises, another thread where a few chest thumping Lobo fans want us to award them the state championship 9 or 10 games before they earn it.

You're right, SLC, Trinity, and all the rest, just lay down at the feet of the obvious champion, a team with a 70 year old championship loosing streak as their pedigree.

What a joke you make real Lobo fans look like. You do them and your team and your city a disservice.

JMHO

[Kingwolf]

Wow, surprise of surprises, another thread where a few chest thumping Lobo fans want us to award them the state championship 9 or 10 games before they earn it.

You're right, SLC, Trinity, and all the rest, just lay down at the feet of the obvious champion, a team with a 70 year old championship loosing streak as their pedigree.

What a joke you make real Lobo fans look like. You do them and your team and your city a disservice.

JMHO


still haven't swallowed 45-0 i see.............

[drgnbkr]

[QUOTE=Kingwolf]still haven't swallowed 45-0 i see.............[/QUOTE

You guys are hilarious..your legends in your own minds...The Dragons will just keep on clocking people & you guys will keep on whining...I love it!

[BigFanSLC]

Carroll's O has 9 weapons to try and stop. The Defense is fast and sure tacklers. I see a long deep run in the playoffs for the Dragons once again.

41 to 0.... is a statement. just keep looking at the Carroll D as not a big threat and once you face them you'll know. Every year the D is overlooked bc of the Offense. oh well pick your poison.

[CCHS77]

North Shore and Westfield are two that come to mind. And defensively, they would eat SLC's lunch and ask for seconds. Their linebackers are faster than those recievers.

They got Linebackers that ran in the 5A state track meet?

I'm impressed.

Oh Dang it, I forgot. Track speed and football speed are two different things!

My bad.

[Lobo9498]

I in no way am proclaiming the Lobos the champions. Yeah, SLC had a bad half. They ran the score up in the second half. All they have are the deep bombs. They don't use a short passing game at all. And their run game was non-existent. McElroy looked good. I will give him credit. DR never could get a thing going for them. They killed themselves.

I am still saying that IF you get pressure on the QB, you WILL beat SLC. You make him eat the grass. That's my opinion. I guess we'll find out, won't we? Longview hasn't even won the District title yet, much less the state title. And all the fans that keep mentioning the past, the past is over and done with. The teams we had in the past were one-dimensional run-it-up-the-middle teams. They didn't have the weapons we have had this year. I guess we'll just see who is the best.

Congrats on the win SLC. If DR is #2 in the district, what does that say about the district????

[drgnbkr]

I in no way am proclaiming the Lobos the champions. Yeah, SLC had a bad half. They ran the score up in the second half. All they have are the deep bombs. They don't use a short passing game at all. And their run game was non-existent. McElroy looked good. I will give him credit. DR never could get a thing going for them. They killed themselves.

I am still saying that IF you get pressure on the QB, you WILL beat SLC. You make him eat the grass. That's my opinion. I guess we'll find out, won't we? Longview hasn't even won the District title yet, much less the state title. And all the fans that keep mentioning the past, the past is over and done with. The teams we had in the past were one-dimensional run-it-up-the-middle teams. They didn't have the weapons we have had this year. I guess we'll just see who is the best.

Congrats on the win SLC. If DR is #2 in the district, what does that say about the district????

Lot of ifs there...bring it..it won't work out too well for ya....

[LoboFan07]

Lot of ifs there...bring it..it won't work out too well for ya....

Sounds like a lot of other teams that have said that to us in the past few years...

[BigFanSLC]

how can u say SLC had a bad half??? how is a Defense shutting out a team the whole game having any bad quarters? This SLC team is for real and have many possibilities on offense and have a great chance of repeating.

[BigFanSLC]

Sounds like a lot of other teams that have said that to us in the past few years...

untill you guys have a record of 55-1 in the last three years in 5A, have won two out of three chances at the 5A Div. 2 state championship........ then who are you? SLC doesnt lose b/c they don't know how to.

[Texasfrog]

My observation of the SLC vs Denton Ryan game and comparing them to Longview. I have no background with either school so its pretty objective opinion ( I think).

First and formost. SLC and the Lobos are two totally different style teams. The Lobos have a power run based offense and SLC has a passing offense. Both teams are deadly in different ways with several offensive weapons.

Both defensives are very stout with alot of good size and speed. Again.. SLC defense doesnt seem to get respect but they are a very solid unit (just like last years team).

The Lobos would have to try to control the clock against SLC and pound Mcgee and Ivory and try to control the clock. If the Lobos could sustain some clock killing drives and score about 28 pts they would have a good shot at beating SLC.

SLC could pass on the Lobos. Tyler Lee showed me last week with a (backup) QB that the Lobos could be passed on. REL had several nice passes caught and had about 7 wide open passes dropped that would of been big gainers for REL. So if you LOBO fans dont think the LOBOS couldnt be passed on by SLC (please think again).

It would probably be a very tight game and go deep into the 4th QT and look alot like the last two (SLC vs Lufkin) games. It could go either way.

If the Lobos could sustain long drives pounding out 4 yds a pop and get about 4 tds. They would have a good shot.

I could pretty much put (Trinity and Lobos) on even par. Both have similiar style teams. Lobos defense might be slightly better then Trinity's defense.

[ruffshod]

I think Sawyer has 36 rushing yards. He is really shredding carroll's defense with his speed

yeah, like I said; 1st half. he did do some damage on kickoff returns in the 2nd. but DR's offense was non existent outside of him. SLC plays very discipline ball, same as Katy down here. Hopefully the two can hook up again for the championship. Good luck

[PantherStang84]

I'm staying out of this one. LOL :eek:

[dragonfootballfan]

yeah, like I said; 1st half. he did do some damage on kickoff returns in the 2nd. but DR's offense was non existent outside of him. SLC plays very discipline ball, same as Katy down here. Hopefully the two can hook up again for the championship. Good luck
How can you possibly think that 36 yards in a game is good?

[Texasfrog]

how can u say SLC had a bad half??? how is a Defense shutting out a team the whole game having any bad quarters? This SLC team is for real and have many possibilities on offense and have a great chance of repeating.

It still amazes me how people can knock SLC defense....?? They have a very sound defense that doesnt make many stupid mistakes. Their solid and one of the best defensive units in Texas. 100% no doubt about it.

[GoOwls]

still haven't swallowed 45-0 i see.............

Yeah, right, I got over that one before I hit the parking lot that night. We got killed, literally, by you guys. No question. You jumped us and kept on kicking. It could have been a lot worse, but this has nothing to do with my post. I'm talking about now and this year and you throw up a reference about a game you won where you still didn't convert it into a championship. For all your wins you have grossly under-achieved and have no cause to throw rocks at SLC, or much of anybody else. That was the point of my post. Stop chest thumping and talking and win a meaningful game (read: state championship game).

[LoboFan07]

I'm talking about now and this year and you throw up a reference about a game you won where you still didn't convert it into a championship.

Now you know how we feel when every single time a Longview game is being talked about we get the freakin "Haven't won a State Title since 1937" Saying...Do you not think we dont know that?!

You guys wont let us forget it.

You guys come on here and are always giving us crap. Why can't we give you some right back? Denton Ryan could've easily been right back in that had THEY! Not SLC..Had DENTON RYAN! not made the stupid mistakes they did...Penalties, Not catching the ball, running with it before they caught it, trying to arm tackle, just plain missing tackles.

You guys come on here and give us crap for our game vs Tyler Lee and when we try and defend ourselves...we are just in bad fans. Yet when we do it right back to you guys, we're the bad ones.

This is 2005. Obviously both teams are still undefeated. So neither team has any room to talk.

[Sakatha]

LoboFan07

Dude, are you for real? You run alot of smack considering you haven't made it past the quarter finals during these 'past years with all of these teams that haven't done so well against ya'll'.

You need to lay off the crack, worry about *getting* to the point where you can play SLC.

Until then, good lord.. Show some class and shut it. You are ridiculous.

~DnM

[LoboFan07]

Show some class

Only showing the same class that Longview fans are recieving from other teams.

[Sakatha]

So you have nothing to say for yourself in response to my post other than a 'But he did it to me first!!!!'

Simply put, you haven't beaten anybody. You haven't gone anywhere. Laying some smack out about how other teams haven't fared well against you in recent years??? OMG!

What the hell did SLC do to you to bring this blatent 'We're gonna kick your @ss' attitude.

Know what Carroll players do? They play. The win. The keep their mouths shut. Did you not see evidence of this tonight? How many cheap shots were thrown by DR tonight? I remember *5* late hits of cheap shot personal fouls just off the top of my head.

You should take notes.


~DnM

[LoboFan07]

Simply put, you haven't beaten anybody. You haven't gone anywhere. Laying some smack out about how other teams haven't fared well against you in recent years??? OMG!

...? Where on earth have I talked about anything in the "recent" years...

You guys are the ones talking about this just great 55-1 record.

You guys are the one that every time a Longview game comes up are saying "You've done nothing to earn our respect cause you haven't won a State Championship since 1937"

We're only giving some right back but yet when we do you guys go crazy...You guys did the EXACT same thing to us last week after we faced Lee...

"They weren't that impressive"
"We would kill them"
"They haven't earned my respect until they beat Lufkin"

I'll show some "class" as you say it after Longview gets some from SLC fans but obviously that isn't going to happen anytime soon.

I would love for you to show me where I've said "We're going to kick your @ss" type deal. Cause I haven't said it any time recently.

Now that I've said my share...I'm out of this stuff.

[RyanRaiderDad]

Know what Carroll players do? They play. The win. The keep their mouths shut. Did you not see evidence of this tonight? How many cheap shots were thrown by DR tonight? I remember *5* late hits of cheap shot personal fouls just off the top of my head.

You should take notes.


~DnM

Easy now... I saw three cheaps shots thrown on Carrolls side. I give you guys your just props for putting one on us... but it went both ways. I dont by any stretch of the imagination say cheap shots are okay or even make excuses for DR players... but those things happen in football from time to time. Frustration makes you do dumb things.

[Sakatha]

LoboFan07-

I believe it's Lufkin that's runnin' the most smack towards ya'll.

I honestly don't think SLC cares about Longview right now, and frankly why would we. And in turn *YOU* shouldn't care about us.

If we both go Div 1, you have a good 7 wins to go before we see you. 8 if it's Div 2. And oh, btw, we have to win those same 7 or 8.

You think even *1* SLC player is thinking past Keller(next Friday)?? And that's 2 months closer than the game you wanna see.

~DnM

[BigFanSLC]

we give Lobo's all the respect, but you make the whole program look bad when u run your mouth about something that prob. wont happen.

[GoOwls]

LoboFan07, you know me, you know I'm not talking about you. Read this thread from the first and you will see a few Lobo fans were talking junk to the SLC folks with, in my opinion, no provocation other than to push buttons. I'm no SLC fan, I respect them, but I'm not a fan, but I've just had enough from a few particular Lobo fans. The rest of you, I'm sorry that my post may have inflamed you, but the reminder of past failures was not for you guys, you behave yourselves like true fans and are realistic about things. The reminder was for the few posters who just flame folks just for flaming sake. I do apologize for inflaming you personally as I have tons of respect for you, but I also hope you understand that I react to blantant hypocracy in a negative way, and some of your fans bring out the worst/best in me.

[BigArab]

...? Where on earth have I talked about anything in the "recent" years...

You guys are the ones talking about this just great 55-1 record.

You guys are the one that every time a Longview game comes up are saying "You've done nothing to earn our respect cause you haven't won a State Championship since 1937"

We're only giving some right back but yet when we do you guys go crazy...You guys did the EXACT same thing to us last week after we faced Lee...

"They weren't that impressive"
"We would kill them"
"They haven't earned my respect until they beat Lufkin"

I'll show some "class" as you say it after Longview gets some from SLC fans but obviously that isn't going to happen anytime soon.

I would love for you to show me where I've said "We're going to kick your @ss" type deal. Cause I haven't said it any time recently.

Now that I've said my share...I'm out of this stuff.

Amen. I said it earlier. Just as you have the right to think we weren't very impressive, we have to right to think you guys were FLAT in the first half.
Call me crazy.

Lobofan07 continues to say this is 2005 and you guys are the first to beat yoru own chest about what you've done in the past.

Geez, this is a lose lose situation for us Lobo fans. Let's clear out and let them have their whole board back. Maybe get a new doamin called www.southlakecarrollisthebest.com

[Sakatha]

For the record.

That's the worst performance out of a team that just won by 40 points that you'll ever see.

SLC was flat, came out slow, and finished slow. In between they managed to put up 40 points.

Carroll had a *bad* game offensively. It isn't likely to happen again. Like I always say about losses, better that they happen in October than December.

~DnM

[Sakatha]

arab -

How can you not see that some of you have brought this on yourselves?!

~DnM

[BigArab]

For the record.

That's the worst performance out of a team that just won by 40 points that you'll ever see.

SLC was flat, came out slow, and finished slow. In between they managed to put up 40 points.

Carroll had a *bad* game offensively. It isn't likely to happen again. Like I always say about losses, better that they happen in October than December.

~DnM

Great, and that was one of the flattest performances by Longview. The shoe is on the other foot.

[Sakatha]

You didn't hear me saying Longview sucks.

~DnM

[BigArab]

Simply put, you haven't beaten anybody. You haven't gone anywhere

This is quoting you.

[Fleeman93]

After watching the game tonight I can say for sure that this team is nowhere near as good as last year's team. Defensively I would say they look pretty close. Offensively this SLC team isn't as good for one main reason, Luna. This SLC team has a great QB and receivers which gives them the deep threat and a solid passing game in general, which they had last year. This offense needs a RB like Luna and Newton just isn't it( is he ok by the way?). The only other drawback that I see compared to last year's offense is that McElroy is nowhere near as mobile as Daniel was.

[Sakatha]

Does that mean you suck?

No. SLC *THIS* year hasn't beaten anybody.

I'll ask you this. Who on this board fired off the first 'I think we will/can beat you'?? Was it a Dragon? I bet it wasn't.

~DnM

[LoboFan07]

BA, it's useless. Like you said we should just drop it.

We have our games to play. They have their's.

Let me think they can roll us. Im perfectly fine with that. We got Rockwall tomorrow. Lets just think about the Yellowjackets.

[LoboFan07]

Who on this board fired off the first 'I think we will/can beat you'?? Was it a Dragon? I bet it wasn't.

I betcha it was.

[BigArab]

Does that mean you suck?

No. SLC *THIS* year hasn't beaten anybody.

I'll ask you this. Who on this board fired off the first 'I think we will/can beat you'?? Was it a Dragon? I bet it wasn't.

~DnM

To quote the first person who fired a shot at Longview in the Longview v. Tyler Lee thread

"IMO...it's not so much that Longview is that good..it's that Lee is in a re-building year....I'm sticking to my opinion..Longview..beat Lufkin & you've got my respect...until then, it's the same old song...IMO..which is worth ?" this coming from a SLC fan. Everyone else was giving us props on the game.

After this was said, others, including Lufkin fans were still giving us props when another SLC fan stated:

"Tyler Lee looks horribe. No wonder they have lost SO many games. I heard Lee is playing without 4 starters....QB/OL/DL. Trinity could have scored triple digits against this team!!

SLC puts 8 in the box and stops Longview. Longview would have a very difficult time passing on SLC. I think SLC would give Longview a pretty good beating!! SLC defense matches-up very well against Longview!!"

[BigArab]

Do I need to find more?

Like I said...You didn't see all Longview could dish out. We were pretty flat too. Deal with it.

[BigArab]

How now brown cow?

[Kingwolf]

Yeah, right, I got over that one before I hit the parking lot that night. We got killed, literally, by you guys. No question. You jumped us and kept on kicking. It could have been a lot worse, but this has nothing to do with my post. I'm talking about now and this year and you throw up a reference about a game you won where you still didn't convert it into a championship. For all your wins you have grossly under-achieved and have no cause to throw rocks at SLC, or much of anybody else. That was the point of my post. Stop chest thumping and talking and win a meaningful game (read: state championship game).


joking man, lighten up

[Kingwolf]

the lufking vs lv, lv vs slc has become nauseating, next it will be lv vs trinity or katy....blah, blah, blah, blah, blah....

as much $#@* as our fans talk, i really hope we win it all, if not we will look pretty stupid (as far as fans go)...to much chest thumping as Goowls puts it....

i am starting to feel the monumental letdown may kill us if we keep this up....as for me i am done with this place until it slows down a little.......see you guys tonite

[Sportsfan24]

I watched the game on TV and while I have not seen LV or Katy play, I have seen Lufkin & Westfield. Depending on which division each team plays in, I would say that SLC will be pressed if they play Westfield or Lufkin. Both teams have great DB's and D lines that can get after the QB. What I saw last night was a SLC QB (McElroy) locked onto one receiver and was forcing the ball when he was covered while another receiver was running free. At other times the DR DB's were peaking at the QB and letting the receivers break deep allowing the QB's easy throws. Even then some of the balls were under thrown.

If SLC plays like that against Lufkin or Westfield they could be in trouble. It was hard to guage SLC's defense, where they that good or was DR's O that bad. Therefore I am not picking against SLC, only saying they will be tested in the playoffs making for a good game no matter how they play. As a side note, a Lufkin - Westfield game would also be great. Either way there are more than 3 or 4 teams this year with a shot at winning it all. The playoffs will be fun to watch.

[KT2000]

I believe Southlake easily has a better defense this year than they've had since 2002...and when all is said and done they might be better than the 2002 unit.

The offense isn't quite as seasoned at the QB-RB spots as it has been, but the Dragons still execute very precisely. They don't make the big mistakes and that's what makes them so hard to beat.

I thought Lufkin had the personnel to handle Southlake in each of the last three years, but the Panthers' match-up advantages never played out in the actual games.

In order to have a chance against Southlake, you have to play a near flawless football game (no turnovers, minimize penalties, etc.) and have the ability to control the clock. It's tough to see Carroll losing out to another spread team.

In 2003, Katy was able to control the clock and keep Carroll on the sideline but still nearly lost the game because they weren't finishing drives in the red zone.

Spring Westfield, Katy, Longview, Euless Trinity and North Shore have the proper build scheme/personnel wise to match-up better against Southlake Carroll than the rest of the state in my opinion. If Lufkin finds a consistent running game...I'd add them to the list. Westfield and Katy can both feature power running games, but have good enough QBs/WRs to grab chunks of yards in the air also. Both play outstanding defense. Longview can match-up favorably also if Carlin Freeman can pass efficiently enough to keep the Dragons from putting 9 in the box to stop McGee. Trinity is more than good enough on offense, but I still have questions about the defense as far as how they'd match up against some of the teams in the top 10.

It is going to take a special effort to beat Carroll because they are a program conditioned to play well into December. I think the thing that makes them as good as they are, above the creative scheme and talented skill players, is that they play efficiently and almost never make the big mistakes.

[bullrock]

This is getting old. LV has a good team as does SLC. I hope they meet on the field so this score can be settled. A lot of posters backing great teams the last 3 years have all had the same opinion and only one has backed it up. I thought both D-lines were good. As much as the Ryan D-ends were penetrating it almost looked like it was designed. Look where most of the passes were completed. On the short outs. I also thought McElroy and Renfro could have played catch all night if they chose to. What a reciever! He is like a vacuum cleaner. Get it close and it's a catch. If SLC gets beat this year, it's going to take a very good and patient team to do so. I think the SLC defense is always overlooked. There were not too many breakdowns. They all covered thier assignments well. When it appeared Ryan could get the corner the door was shut with the exception of a few plays. I only saw one breakdown on the deep route and Knight couldn't hit the reciever. I liked the play calling by Ryan HC. If the fourth downs would have been successful, who knows? I don't think Ryan would have won the game, but they could have kept the SLC offense off of the field a little longer. And field position with SLC is a joke. There is not a field long enough to keep them from scoring. Just another day at the office............ ;)

[Sakatha]

KT2000 nailed it.

James Aston single handedly won that title game. It was a tremendous performance by an extremely talented kid. Just like Luna, football was his 2nd sport. Wasn't James all-world wrestling?

:)

~DnM

[ALLIN]

You guys are hilarious. DR offense has been playing well all year, our defense shuts them down and their offense all the sudden sucks. The only part of the SLC O that was flat was the running game. DR chose to stop that part of it. Usually teams will come off the run to try to stop the pass after we hit them deep a couple times, but DR never did that. They stayed with the run and Mc had 5td passes. The passing game was great. I remember this same talk last year when we played on tv. "Man Lufkin will kill them, North shore this and Longview that" Keep thinking what you will. SLC has beaten all the fronts, blitzes, DB's, and anything else you think your team might throw at them (except one....there you go KATY). If you think that will change this year, I am sorry in advance. Sorry if this seems like trash talking, but I gotta defend the program. I am sure Longview supporters felt thte same after people were saying their team looked flat last week. See you in round 5 Longview.:)

[gritty52]

Longview has played mediocre teams and so has SLC. You Longview folks think you rule the state. I'm not a Southlake fan, but hey folks it's lonely at the top. My son plays at ET and I'm not taking sides, but geez!!! Personally I don't think any of yaw can beat them. The only way I see anyone so far beating them is you play them at your homefield. That probably won't happen. Like I say folks when your on top people find and say alot of harsh things about you. The HAKA will be at Pennington Field Tonight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

[drgnbkr]

Coach Dodge said on the radio after the game that Ryan had chosen to load up on the run, which left the passing game open...it's not going to be easy for anyone to take away both from the Dragons..great defensive game by Carroll

[Sakatha]

Gritty -

Much respect for ET. I can't wait to see them in person. I am considering taking my kiddo up to the BHS / Trinity game tonight.

It'd be an absolute Travisty if we have to face you guys in the first round of Div 1. A matchup like that deserves to be played much deeper in December than that.

GOOD LUCK TONIGHT!

~DnM

[KT2000]

Well, as good as Aston and the OL played Katy still needed a key special teams play, a big pass and incredible interception to wrap up the win.

You have to play an all-around game against Carroll because the Dragons are a program that will not beat themselves. They force you to try and outplay them in every phase of the game because they play extremely efficiently. Coach Dodge and his staff do a very good job of instilling that discipline.

It's amazing how even "average" teams talent-wise can elevate themselves by playing mistake free and efficient football.

[Favpack]

Congrats to SLC on yet another shut out.

Here's my 2 cents on the 2 TV game comparisons.....

This was easily SLC's biggest game of the year to date and they came out uninspired and flat. Conversely, Longview had Lee put away (in also their biggest game of the year to date) barely 3 minutes into it - the game was over. SLC was still deciding midway through the first qtr. if they really wanted to play. The D look painfully slow. McElroy was beyond slow - more like concrete-for-feet. IF that had been Longview - SLC would have been staring at a 14 or 21 point hole to dig out of.

To their credit, SLC came back and put together some nice drives - and certainly turned it on in the second half. But, DR is not very good, and their coach personally handed SLC 21 points last night - poor coaching decisions were in abundance.

Compared to last year - McElroy has a lonngggg way to go to lead SLC to a state title; SLC's wr's are better than last year; their O line is better; their D is a bit better but appeared slow last night; and, kicking game is better.

Again, based purely on my opinion from these two TV games - I give a very slight nod to Longview. They played with more intensity, speed and enthusiasm. SLC was very workmanlike - no emotion or intensity - they just got the job done. Neither opponent was impressive in the least. DR is more disciplined than Lee, but Lee at least has a few athletes left from the injury devastation to keep you honest.

SLC could clearly move the ball on Longview over the course of a game, but McElroy is slow-footed and once you get him moving he's in trouble. He looks down and looks scared - and believe me DR had very little speed on D. Daniel was actually more dangerous on the move - McElroy presents no danger at all on the move against a speedy D. But, SLC's O-line is great and McElroy with 5-8 seconds to scope the field and keep his shoulders square is pretty darn lethal.

Longview would definitely score on this D - they are just too good not to. And, I know Longview's front D 7 would give McElroy fits. So, my very slight nod again goes to Longview for their speed, intensity and aggressiveness.

[Sakatha]

Part of the 'great' coaching is never looking ahead.

Carroll does a tremendous job of taking EVERYONE seriously. I know it's extremely hard to believe that looking from the outside in for some people. I just cannot remember a time when Carroll wasn't mentally prepared for a game, big or small.

Last night, even though they were a little slow to start, they were far from unprepared.

~DnM

[Favpack]

Prepared -- yes; inspired - no. They looked either bored or scared - not sure which - but they definitely didn't look like they wanted to be playing football. But, to their credit - that changed pretty quickly thanks in part to some huge gifts from Coach Florence. He's ready to be back in 4A yesterday I think.

[gritty52]

Sakatha if you can come get there by 7. This is a good rivalry game and We (ET) don't take anyone for granted. Thers rumor there might be several SLC people there tonight. If you come the HAKA will be around 7:25. Enjoy!! :)

[Sakatha]

Scared seriously crossed your mind?

This team returned 55 SR's from a squad that faced 4 of the top 10 teams in the state last year during that playoff run, including your panthers.

I doubt being scared was a factor. Could it *also* possibly be that DR was simply up for the game? I mean, cmon. Home game, National T.V., SLC has beaten you twice, and now you get a shot in your crib.

I agree with one of the posters above, all of this talk is just a terrible shot at DR. Everyone is essentially saying DR just flat out sucks. That's terribly unfair.

DR has lost 4 games now in the past 2 years, after making *3* straight Class 4A title appearances. 3 to SLC(which puts them with everyone in the state except Katy), and once to the probable 4A champs this year.



~DnM

[BigArab]

Scared seriously crossed your mind?

This team returned 55 SR's from a squad that faced 4 of the top 10 teams in the state last year during that playoff run, including your panthers.

I doubt being scared was a factor. Could it *also* possibly be that DR was simply up for the game? I mean, cmon. Home game, National T.V., SLC has beaten you twice, and now you get a shot in your crib.

I agree with one of the posters above, all of this talk is just a terrible shot at DR. Everyone is essentially saying DR just flat out sucks. That's terribly unfair.

DR has lost 4 games now in the past 2 years, after making *3* straight Class 4A title appearances. 3 to SLC(which puts them with everyone in the state except Katy), and once to the probable 4A champs this year.



~DnM

Couldn't you also acknowledge that DR is having a down year. They did not look very impressive last night either. Taste your own medicine! All of you people were saying after the first half when Longview was thrashing Lee "Figures, they're not very good this year." Sakatha, your team is going to get picked apart since they were on National TV. We had to put up with that last week. Deal with it. I agree with Favpack. They looked VERY uninspired, and yes, I think McElroy got a little bit flustered and scared when there was any kind of pressure. What I refuse to do is start up all the Longview v. SLC comparisons. That's just flat out ridiculous.

[Favpack]

OK - I'll agree they likely weren't scared - so, let's go with bored. They looked flat and uninspired for some time into the game - no harm, that happens - and they eventually won and won big.

Sure, DR was fired up -- everyone's fired up playing a Top 5 team. But - getting back to my comparison -- SLC would have been grasping at wiffs of Vondrell McGee and staring at a 14 pt. hole if Longview were the opponent.

Not that big a deal really -- with one small exception. McElroy has still only started a handful of games - and he's been behind in a big game zero times. So, bottom line - I was impressed with SLC from the second qtr. on. These are kids - I"m always the first not to over-dramatize anything - including a slow start. But, against a fast start team like Longview - they would have been in a hole - I would almost guarantee that.

[doc skurlock]

I hate SLC with a white hot intensity of a thousand suns BUT they are better than last year.....Tre is the game breaker (better than Luna).....McElroy is not the speed threat Daniels was but he is just as strong and just as hard to bring down.....Plus he throws better......

Saw them on film and in person.....They'll win it all if Newton and McElroy stay healthy.....Take the video and break it down like a coach would, you'll see those guys are pretty dang good.....They also called off the dogs in the fourth quarter.....Could've been much worse than 41......

[Sakatha]

Amazing... BA even slams me when I try to credit another team.

I wasn't even talking to you at this point. I am finished with the whole Longview thing. We likely won't even play.

~DnM

[Fleeman93]

I hate SLC with a white hot intensity of a thousand suns BUT they are better than last year.....Tre is the game breaker (better than Luna).....McElroy is not the speed threat Daniels was but he is just as strong and just as hard to bring down.....Plus he throws better......

Saw them on film and in person.....They'll win it all if Newton and McElroy stay healthy.....Take the video and break it down like a coach would, you'll see those guys are pretty dang good.....They also called off the dogs in the fourth quarter.....Could've been much worse than 41......

You are completely out of your mind if you think Newton is half the player that Luna was. Although I didn't get to see it last night, I'm sure Newton is a good running back. In SLC's offense you don't need a good running back; you need a good spread back. Now I'm not saying that Newton can't or won't be a good spread back, but right now it isn't even a question. I will also respectively disagree about McElroy throwing better than Daniel.

[Sakatha]

You cannot compare Luna w/Newton.

Luna was a 3 yr starter at TB for SLC, Tre' has been starting for *3* games now and is a 16 yr old sophomore.

Talk about unfair comparisons.

~DnM

[dragonfly]

Prepared -- yes; inspired - no. They looked either bored or scared - not sure which - but they definitely didn't look like they wanted to be playing football. But, to their credit - that changed pretty quickly thanks in part to some huge gifts from Coach Florence. He's ready to be back in 4A yesterday I think.

When things don't go well for a team or they are not executing like they should, it certainly does not mean they are uninspired or scared. Lack of execution happens to everyone and the best teams. When it happens you get together on the sidelines, fix the missed assignments and correct it on the field. To say it is due to being uninspired or scared is just stupid. Especially to say it about a battle tested Dragon team that has so much success and experience.

[Favpack]

I'm certainly a bottom line guy - and SLC shut out Denton Ryan 41-zip - that's impressive. Re-read my overall comparison with SLC from a year ago - most of those arrows are up, with the exception of qb.

My comparison with Longview was purely to reflect the two back to back Thursday night TV games. Impossible to fully compare anything until a head to head competition occurs, and that a remains a big IF in my book right now from a variety of standpoints.

[Fleeman93]

You cannot compare Luna w/Newton.

Luna was a 3 yr starter at TB for SLC, Tre' has been starting for *3* games now and is a 16 yr old sophomore.

Talk about unfair comparisons.

~DnM

Are you kidding me? Unfair is SLC putting 70 on teams that are just plain bad. I don't think making a comparison between two football players is unfair. All I am doing is supporting my opinion that this SLC offense isn't as good as last year's SLC offense. Is it really unfair?

[dragonfootballfan]

Denton Ryan had not lost a home game since 2002 I think. That is worth something. They were ready to play and you could tell they had a few really good players. You guys are not only underrating SLC you are also underrating Denton Ryan. On choosing to go for it on fourth down. If they had punted and Carroll had to go 80 yards instead of 50 do you really think it would have mattered.

[Sakatha]

Yes. I don't see how you can compare a 16 yr old kid with 3 games starting experience to a 2 time Class 5A State Champion starting TB w/literally 15x the games under his belt.

As far as the 70 point games... You weren't there, so don't judge. When it's that out of hand, SLC has been running the ball on every down for a *long* period of time. Dodge is cut-throat, but he's not a *******.

Dodge has an outstanding rep in this state, and I haven't heard of a coach yet that didn't respect him.

~DnM

[ALLIN]

That is your opinion, you will hopefully be able to see for yourself soon. All I know is that Dr had 155 total yards last night. They shut down our run and we played catch all night. See ya soon.

[RidgePride]

It's amazing how even "average" teams talent-wise can elevate themselves by playing mistake free and efficient football.

Very True. Southlake Carroll regularly beats teams that have much more physical talent than them

[Fleeman93]

Yes. I don't see how you can compare a 16 yr old kid with 3 games starting experience to a 2 time Class 5A State Champion starting TB w/literally 15x the games under his belt.

As far as the 70 point games... You weren't there, so don't judge. When it's that out of hand, SLC has been running the ball on every down for a *long* period of time. Dodge is cut-throat, but he's not a *******.

Dodge has an outstanding rep in this state, and I haven't heard of a coach yet that didn't respect him.

~DnM

My friend you have made my point for me. There is no comparison between Newton and Luna, but it is still possible to compare them. I'm not saying that Newton isn't a good running back. I'm not saying that Newton will not be great someday. What I am saying is that the 2005 SLC offense is not near as good as the 2004 SLC offense due to the loss of Luna (among other things).

[Sakatha]

Apparently I misunderstood.

I *agree* with you 100%. At this exact point, Newton isn't a shadow of what Luna was. On that note, Rice is silly for not trying to get him to play both sports down there, but that's another thing.

This team isn't near the same offensive machine last year, and it's because they lost a top 10 QB in the country in Daniel, and simply a terrific football player in Luna.

Do they have the opportunity to be better than last year? Maybe... Time will tell.

Defensively, this Dragon crew doesn't get near the respect that it needs and deserves. Take away one awesome half of football by Emmanuel Moody, and literally nobody has done a thing against SLC.

As far as the 70 points... Seriously... I have yet to see a game where SLC just blatantly tried to rub someone's nose in it, and run it up.

The high scores are a combination of teams quitting, SLC being *that* good, and a few other intangibles such as coaches going for it on 4th down on their own 30 yard line in the first half.

~DnM

[Favpack]

Denton Ryan had not lost a home game since 2002 I think. That is worth something. They were ready to play and you could tell they had a few really good players. You guys are not only underrating SLC you are also underrating Denton Ryan. On choosing to go for it on fourth down. If they had punted and Carroll had to go 80 yards instead of 50 do you really think it would have mattered.

LOL - now that's a real vote of confidence for this Denton Ryan D that everyone else is dogging so ruthlessly ain't it? Opinion coming ----> Coach Florence does not coach well against SLC contrary to what others say/think. What are the cumulative scores from his 3 tries with SLC? Roughly 120 to 30. Compare those efforts with Katy, SV (ok, forget the '02 state game) and Lufkin - I think you might agree with me.

He made some bone-head calls last night - going for it on 4th not once, but twice were two of them.

But, your point is actually valid. No way DR had enough O to do anything at all, and they really only slightly slowed SLC last night on a few rare occassions - Once SLC decided to get down to business and play.

[BigFoot]

This is my first post but last night's game has brought me to a CASE CLOSED on SLC. On this site the SLC fans have stated over and over that the do not run up the score nor do they play the first team offense and defense when they have a big lead. Well, that is not a true statement, last night to kick a field goal with less than 5 minutes to play is simply not a class act.
I have seen many teams and know for sure that ET never leaves the starters in with a 30 point lead. I think rubbing a team when they are struggling is simply being too cocky and full of yourself. Last week the paper stated that when ET was up by 30 pts they played not only the second team but the rest of the bench. The paper said they ran up the middle and the other team couldn't stop them. The subs want to have a chance to show what they can do but ET's coach simply shuts down as much as he can. Against Coppell in the last quarter he punted inside Coppell's end so they would not score again. I wish SLC would show some compassion when they are in total control of a game. ALL the stars on the hats in the last 5 minutes of the game tells me they are the starters. In the last 2 minutes they substituted only a few. Ryan definitely made the score lopsided when they gave them great field position. I was not as impressed with SLC play as I thought I would be but Ryan gave up too many chances. Maybe SLC subs will get to play if they are winning by 100 pts. Too bad having a good team with no class.

[Fleeman93]

I understand the argument about getting Dodge playing time after they pull McElroy. I also understand the fact that SLC has 8 receivers that they rotate all game. My question is, did any 2nd or 3rd team linemen or any defensive players get playing time. I really couldn't tell if it was the the first team defense in at the end of the game, but it looked like it.

[DragonFan]

I have said this before and I will say it again. The only 5A team to beat Denton Ryan has been SLC. They beat 12 teams last year and 4 more this year.

I had made a prediction that there would be many people who would say after this game that SLC is not very good, but that Denton Ryan is down.

There have been many Longview/Lufkin/.... people who have had to defend their team after blowouts, because "the other team offense was bad".

How about this. When a high powered offense that has been scoring a lot of points and is winning a lot of games is suddenly shutdown, then the other teams defense must have something to say about it. I think there is a thread that talks about the LDI or MLDI (lonnie Defense Index, or the Modified Lonnie Defense Index) It talks about the difference in Points per Game for offenses and how to guage a defense by the difference a points per game offense has when playing another teams defense.

Look at the Stats and the 2005 Dragons are playing better than the 2004 Dragons. And that is a very scary thought!

[Sakatha]

2nd and 3rd teamers didn't play until really late.

I would imagine a part of the score last night was due in part to a 'bad' attitude on the field.

I don't know who started it, and I am not defending our kids, but there were at least 2 borderline fights that broke out. Numerous cheap shots, more on DR's side than SLC.

As far as the FG? I'd be kicking 40 yarders regardless of the time left. You want an example of why it's a good idea to get your kicker as many attempts as possible in a live game? Go watch the final 5 seconds of the Div 2 title game last year.

~DnM

[dragonsdaddy]

I in no way am proclaiming the Lobos the champions. Yeah, SLC had a bad half. They ran the score up in the second half. All they have are the deep bombs. They don't use a short passing game at all. And their run game was non-existent. McElroy looked good. I will give him credit. DR never could get a thing going for them. They killed themselves.

I am still saying that IF you get pressure on the QB, you WILL beat SLC. You make him eat the grass. That's my opinion. I guess we'll find out, won't we? Longview hasn't even won the District title yet, much less the state title. And all the fans that keep mentioning the past, the past is over and done with. The teams we had in the past were one-dimensional run-it-up-the-middle teams. They didn't have the weapons we have had this year. I guess we'll just see who is the best.

Congrats on the win SLC. If DR is #2 in the district, what does that say about the district????
you get my vote for the all-time stupidest post. you have shown the most absolute lack of understanding the spread offense in the state of texas. congrats.

[BigFoot]

I hardly think that the field goal with less than 3 minutes left would have lost the game for SLC. AND it was not a 40 yarder. Oh well, I am sure that the
SLC kicker needs practice but the info on the boards is that he is perfect and never misses.

[dragonfootballfan]

I hardly think that the field goal with less than 3 minutes left would have lost the game for SLC. AND it was not a 40 yarder. Oh well, I am sure that the
SLC kicker needs practice but the info on the boards is that he is perfect and never misses.
you think they ran up the score yet they ran the ball the way down the field there even though Ryan had 7 guys in the box. 5 blockers vs. 7 tacklers still running the ball. that is not running the score

[Favpack]

This is my first post but last night's game has brought me to a CASE CLOSED on SLC. On this site the SLC fans have stated over and over that the do not run up the score nor do they play the first team offense and defense when they have a big lead. Well, that is not a true statement, last night to kick a field goal with less than 5 minutes to play is simply not a class act.
I have seen many teams and know for sure that ET never leaves the starters in with a 30 point lead. I think rubbing a team when they are struggling is simply being too cocky and full of yourself. Last week the paper stated that when ET was up by 30 pts they played not only the second team but the rest of the bench. The paper said they ran up the middle and the other team couldn't stop them. The subs want to have a chance to show what they can do but ET's coach simply shuts down as much as he can. Against Coppell in the last quarter he punted inside Coppell's end so they would not score again. I wish SLC would show some compassion when they are in total control of a game. ALL the stars on the hats in the last 5 minutes of the game tells me they are the starters. In the last 2 minutes they substituted only a few. Ryan definitely made the score lopsided when they gave them great field position. I was not as impressed with SLC play as I thought I would be but Ryan gave up too many chances. Maybe SLC subs will get to play if they are winning by 100 pts. Too bad having a good team with no class.

Well thought out post. I don't know if SLC goes out their way to run up a score. I do know they keep their starters in longer than other coaches would - but that is a philosophy that is not mean-spirited -- they want the starters to work hard, long and leave tired.

Coach Outlaw will pull the starters after the first second half position if the game is a run-away regardless - period, end of story - that's just his way of doing it. He will leave a few key defenders in later into the third - but the second team will get the entire 4th quarter to themselves. He definitely believes in coaching karma -- and I tend to agree with him.

[Sakatha]

Touche'... 31 yarder.

Would you have rather SLC gone for it? What would you have said if they converted the 4th down even if it was a rush? What then if SLC had scored a TD because they went for it?

Do you kneel on the ball with 3 minutes left to just hand the ball over on downs? I've *NEVER* seen a team at any level kneel on the ball to hand it over on downs.

~DnM

[HeadMan]

He looks down and looks scared - and believe me DR had very little speed on D.

Too bad having a good team with no class.


Some of the stupid things said on this forum never cease to amaze me. DR not fast? Their DBs covered so well on most plays that McElroy had to sit in the pocket for much longer than normal and their defensive end also played wide reciever. To say that DR was a slow defense is absolute crap. Without a doubt they are one of the fastest defenses in the area. Carroll being classless? Trinity could afford to put the second and third team in early because they were playing Grand Prarie. The same Grand Prarie that hasn't won a game this year. Carroll was playing Denton Ryan for the district championship and it was critical they run the clock out, so it's logical they needed the first team in to keep moving the chains against a potentially dangerous team. DR had many personal fouls and played with zero class the entire game, two players were taken out, and yet someone just has to say Carroll was classless by playing the game. Seeing one game on TV does not make you a.) a football guru or b.)knowledgeable of anything whatsoever.

[pack0808]

I am just in shock at this whole thread. SlC wins 40 something to 0 and they have not lost but 1 game in 3 1/2 years and SOME not ALL Longview fans come in here trying to trash them even though Longview and SLC have never played each other ever!! They might not even meet this year!! What is the point of this?? I have seen great Lufkin teams play SLC and the dragons have my ultimate ultimate respect. I am not going to get a microscope out and look for their flaw's because every team in the state has a few of them no matter how great they are. Again, what was the point of this thread??

[Sakatha]

Two things seen at the last 2 games...

Haltom kids wearing 'Cuck Farroll' t-shirts... Solid... If my kid tried to walk out the door with that trash on his back, he'd be at home for a month.

Here was a sign at the DR game last night... 'Dragons R Flamers'... Uhhhhh.. Way to be PC there... National T.V. too... NICE job.

~DnM

[pack0808]

Two things seen at the last 2 games...

Haltom kids wearing 'Cuck Farroll' t-shirts... Solid... If my kid tried to walk out the door with that trash on his back, he'd be at home for a month.

Here was a sign at the DR game last night... 'Dragons R Flamers'... Uhhhhh.. Way to be PC there... National T.V. too... NICE job.

~DnM


Those shirt's are classless you are correct but in most cases i hate PC!! ;)

[Sakatha]

Pack0808 -

Bravo.. FYI - The majority of Southlake has the same respect for Lufkin. Tremendous team, good coach. I was a lil turned off at the players refusing to shake hands at the begining of the game last year, but hey.. Heat of the moment. I let it go.. ;)

~DnM

[SLCDad]

After watching the game tonight I can say for sure that this team is nowhere near as good as last year's team. Defensively I would say they look pretty close. Offensively this SLC team isn't as good for one main reason, Luna. This SLC team has a great QB and receivers which gives them the deep threat and a solid passing game in general, which they had last year. This offense needs a RB like Luna and Newton just isn't it( is he ok by the way?). The only other drawback that I see compared to last year's offense is that McElroy is nowhere near as mobile as Daniel was.It appears you have only seen one SLC game this year. Your analysis of the SLC team reflects that.

[pack0808]

Pack0808 -

Bravo.. FYI - The majority of Southlake has the same respect for Lufkin. Tremendous team, good coach. I was a lil turned off at the players refusing to shake hands at the begining of the game last year, but hey.. Heat of the moment. I let it go.. ;)

~DnM


Well if that was true that would have turned me off too. That is a surprise if that happened and i have never seen them refuse to shake hands before??

[BigArab]

I have said this before and I will say it again. The only 5A team to beat Denton Ryan has been SLC. They beat 12 teams last year and 4 more this year.

I had made a prediction that there would be many people who would say after this game that SLC is not very good, but that Denton Ryan is down.

There have been many Longview/Lufkin/.... people who have had to defend their team after blowouts, because "the other team offense was bad".

How about this. When a high powered offense that has been scoring a lot of points and is winning a lot of games is suddenly shutdown, then the other teams defense must have something to say about it. I think there is a thread that talks about the LDI or MLDI (lonnie Defense Index, or the Modified Lonnie Defense Index) It talks about the difference in Points per Game for offenses and how to guage a defense by the difference a points per game offense has when playing another teams defense.

Look at the Stats and the 2005 Dragons are playing better than the 2004 Dragons. And that is a very scary thought!

How about this: Longview and Lufkins high powered offenses have been blowing out every team, and because those teams A. didn't score on us or B. didn't run up too many yards, they're suddenly bad. Discredit Longview's schedule all you want, whether it be because they're from Louisiana or they're a 4A team...everyone one of those teams have gone on to be successful after taking a beating from Longview. Is it because they're bad teams that they gave up so many yards and scored so little on us? NO! Was SLC's score last night any indication that DR was bad? No, but the only reason I've been saying it is to expose the double-standard that you guys have been implementing. SLC is a great team, no doubt. They had a VERY flat first half, IMO. But, I don't think that was the SLC I've gotten used to seeing, nor do I think the second half you saw out of Longview was the Longview everyone is used to seeing. Take the second half of SLC's game and apply that to the whole game, and you have a typical SLC game. Take Longview's first half and apply it to the whole game, and you have a typical Longview game.

You SLC fans should've known this would happen.

[LPFAN]

Some of the stupid things said on this forum never cease to amaze me. DR not fast? Their DBs covered so well on most plays that McElroy had to sit in the pocket for much longer than normal and their defensive end also played wide reciever. To say that DR was a slow defense is absolute crap. Without a doubt they are one of the fastest defenses in the area. Carroll being classless? Trinity could afford to put the second and third team in early because they were playing Grand Prarie. The same Grand Prarie that hasn't won a game this year. Carroll was playing Denton Ryan for the district championship and it was critical they run the clock out, so it's logical they needed the first team in to keep moving the chains against a potentially dangerous team. DR had many personal fouls and played with zero class the entire game, two players were taken out, and yet someone just has to say Carroll was classless by playing the game. Seeing one game on TV does not make you a.) a football guru or b.)knowledgeable of anything whatsoever.
People see what they want to see. I hate losing to your team but those comments are pretty ridiculous and I agree with you on that. Heck until somebody other then Katy beats SLC then all the talk in this forum is just opinion. Aren't you glad that the State Title is not won in this forum? Heck we wouldn't have enough trophies for everyone would we because the way some talk they are already the State Champs.

[BigArab]

Two things seen at the last 2 games...

Haltom kids wearing 'Cuck Farroll' t-shirts... Solid... If my kid tried to walk out the door with that trash on his back, he'd be at home for a month.

Here was a sign at the DR game last night... 'Dragons R Flamers'... Uhhhhh.. Way to be PC there... National T.V. too... NICE job.

~DnM

That is trashy. I don't care how old my kid is, if he ever trys to wear something like that, he's getting bent over my knee and whipped.

[Sakatha]

Ya, it really was a small thing. After the coin toss, they usually get back together and shake hands.. Well, Daniel, Luna and the other SLC capts made a move towards Lane, and whoever else was out there to shake up... The Pack backed off and started jawin.. Daniel visibly shrugged and they turned around and walked away.

It was an odd situation.

I don't think any hard feelings were left over from it. It was obviously just Lufkin pumping themselves up. I wouldn't even start to call it classless. Maybe a little bit shallow at the time, but the game was played hard and very fair. Both teams competed very well, and there wasn't any jawing or cheap shotting.

That Lufkin team was the most talented team in the state last year. Hands down. The state game the next week was closer than it should've been, in part, because SLC was just totally gased from the previous 3 weekends.

~DnM

[Sakatha]

Holy HELL Big Arab and I agree on something!!! ;)

Every week it's something new. Two weeks ago Colleyville Heritage boo'd the SLC alma mater at the begining of the game. This was 10 minutes after a CHHS student walked past my 8 yr old son and I, and said 'You guys suck'.

LOL!

Last year, Keller chanted 'B***S**T' LOUDLY after a bad call. Cussing in unison at a high school football game? Booing is fine. Keep the filth at home pls.

Those are just 2 examples, but SLC gets an earful *every* week it seems. Winning makes people hate you. I remember how much everyone outside of Odessa hated Mojo in the 80's and 90's.

BTW! Who are you a fan of? I see the location, but haven't heard anything specific.

~DnM

[BigArab]

Holy HELL Big Arab and I agree on something!!! ;)

BTW! Who are you a fan of? I see the location, but haven't heard anything specific.

~DnM

I bleed green like you would not believe. Longview High School grad...San Antonio is where I live and work.

[bleedgreen]

Longview has played mediocre teams and so has SLC. You Longview folks think you rule the state. I'm not a Southlake fan, but hey folks it's lonely at the top. My son plays at ET and I'm not taking sides, but geez!!! Personally I don't think any of yaw can beat them. The only way I see anyone so far beating them is you play them at your homefield. That probably won't happen. Like I say folks when your on top people find and say alot of harsh things about you. The HAKA will be at Pennington Field Tonight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)sure, us and SLC have played "sub-par" teams so far....what about ET?? yall aren't exactly playing "top-notch" programs either....and who cares about the "haka"---i'm so sick of hearing about that crap i could puke!! you are the ones who act like you are the "kings" of Texas.....just put up and shut up--same goes for these so- called "true" SLC and Longview fans who are arguing like children..it's ridiculous!!.......as for the SLC/DR game, i was not impressed one bit.....wide open receivers the entire night, no type of pass rush by DR, and not much of an offense or defense for DR-----who couldn't win that game??? there are 1A and 2A teams here in East Texas who could have beaten DR just the same, and probably worse!....same goes for Longview----Tyler Lee is very weak this season, as well.......to sum it up, DR and Tyler Lee are not good indicators of how good SLC and Longview really are---they are BOTH terrible!! nevertheless, congrats to SLC on a good win...i guess????????PS-----how did all of this Longview/ SLC crap get started??? there are a number of other teams that could beat SLC or Longview......Katy, Abilene, and let's not forget the "nine-headed" purple monster Lufkin!! to even get to SLC, the road goes through Lufkin---and we know how far that has gotten us lately...not very far!! forget SLC, forget ET(who im not even thinking about anyway)---we have to worry about a Rockwall team who is coming in to Lobo Stadium tonight looking for the upset that they almost pulled off last season.................c'mon Lobo fans, let's lay off of SLC---they are the kings until someone knocks them off--and we don't have a leg to stand on, brothers...................................

[ALLIN]

The offense got the subs in pretty regular. The defense did get a few in at the end. I imagine they wanted the shutout pretty bad, given the lack of respect that the defense gets. To shut out DR at home on national tv is big, I dont care what you say. Running up the score would have been 60 -0, which it could have been. Kicking the field goal was better than going for it and making it and then scoring the touchdown. Man, if that would have happened we would never hear the end of it. It is a no win situation for SLC, except on the field. Either we barely win and everyone thinks we suck, or we win big and we run up the score. Why dont we just kneel it in the 3rd Q from now on. That will really keep the fire in the SLC players. When we trow th little out and stuff late, that is our sweep, or toss plays. It gets really hard to run the ball up the middle every time and have a blitzing LB right in your face beacuse they know it is coming, that is suicide. So we throw the short stuff, pick it up and move on.

[KRS32]

I have not had an opportunity to see any Texas football games for many years, but seeing Southlake play on Fox was a good temporary fix. Rather difficult to tell just how good the team is by watching one game on television, but they looked pretty good. Things sure have changed from my playing days at Southlake; ex NFL players, T.V, new stadium and an indoor field. Some things have not changed, like great coaching and winning games. Texas football and Southlake in particular has a community that is second to none. South Florida has some good highschool football programs, but have liitle to no support. Players have to pay fifty dollars to step on the field, thanks Jeb. I have been to many highschool football games in Florida, and the number of parents and spectators that attend is rather embarassing. Texas football is something that a Floridian misses very much, and hope every Texan understands just how good you have it.

[Sakatha]

bleedgreen -

Crack kills.

It's way to early in the day to be pickin' up that glass pipe.

~DnM

[LPFAN]

Two things seen at the last 2 games...

Haltom kids wearing 'Cuck Farroll' t-shirts... Solid... If my kid tried to walk out the door with that trash on his back, he'd be at home for a month.

Here was a sign at the DR game last night... 'Dragons R Flamers'... Uhhhhh.. Way to be PC there... National T.V. too... NICE job.

~DnM
Ok there was one kid from Southlake that had a shirt with some handwriting on it that said?

Denton
Ryan
l
l
\/
It was pointing down between his legs. I am sure his parents must be proud of him. :rolleyes: I know that is not a reflection of most of your fans but that was very classless. Actually it was very stupid. I guess he thought he was cool but in reality he looked like an immature idiot on live national tv. Other then that I enjoyed the game. I do not think your team or coach is classless. They are just champions and alot of people can't stand it. Good luck on the rest of the season.

[Sakatha]

I would say it was isolated, and yes that's a horrible thing for him to have shown.

As a parent, I don't support it.

Those Haltom t-shirts were worn by dozens of students, and were actually printed up somewhere. It was completely planned out.

~DnM

[DragonFan]

It is hard when you see your team playing so well and to think that you are not gettin the acclaims that you feel they should. I shows up every year on this site. Last year Arlington Lamar thought they had the team to win State! They did not. Lamar was going to kill the Dragons! They did not get a chance to play them.

Last year Trinity was a very hot topic and a very good team. They lost to Tyler Lee in the playoffs.

This year the most hyped team that has a chance is Longview. In every fans oppion, their team would kill the current #1. That is the way it should be. I was there in 2002 trying to "enlighten" the board with the qualities of SLC.

I will be the first to admit that SLC was not as sharp as I would have liked them to be last night. I was not very impressed with how flat SLC appeared to be. However, if you look at the stats and the final Score and then think of how overmatched Denton Ryan looked, then you have to be somewhat impressed. Then you look at the fact that Denton Ryan has beaten everyone they have played in 5A except SLC, then you reliaze that it was not so much Denton Ryan being down as it was the even being not as sharp as normal SLC still shutout DR and scored 41 points!

SLC appears to be better at this stage of the season than the 2004 team was and that is a very scary thought!

[bleedgreen]

bleedgreen -

Crack kills.

It's way to early in the day to be pickin' up that glass pipe.

~DnM
sakatha-----how would you like a foot in your crack??? obviously, you haven't been on this site very long?? i believe the moderators will tell you that drugs are not to be talked about on this site---dummy!!! talk like you have some sense, or don't open that big mouth of yours at all......i simply gave my opinion and analysis of what i saw...don't like it??? tough titty!!!

[dragonfly]

I hardly think that the field goal with less than 3 minutes left would have lost the game for SLC. AND it was not a 40 yarder. Oh well, I am sure that the
SLC kicker needs practice but the info on the boards is that he is perfect and never misses.

So I guess they should have taken a knee on 4th down or just handed the ball to them. Are you telling me that you would go for it on 4th down instead of kicking a field goal? I sure do get tired of hearing the "running up the score" crap. It's Denton Ryan's job to stop Carroll. It's not Carroll's job to do that. I've seen some 30 point combacks and crazy things can happen when you play a team with players like Fenty and Sawyer. There aren't a whole lot leads that are safe when you're playing a well coached and disciplined team at the 5A level. You teach kids to play for 4 quarters not play until you think the lead is safe. One day someone will be beating Carroll by quite a bit, and it will be Carroll's job to stop it. If they don't, then then I hope the coaches are good enought men to allow the kids to learn a lesson and how to deal with getting their tails whipped instead of crying and feeling sorry for themselves like children.

[Sakatha]

But name calling is allowed? I am betting not.

~DnM

[dragonfly]

I think one of the reason that Carroll beats more talented teams in the playoffs is that their starters have twice as much experince than others, since our's play most of the games and others play only a half when they think the game is out of hand.

[ALLIN]

Yep, next time I think we should just give em the ball back until they score a few times and then we can play again. I promise DR did not see it as running up the score, because they have a good coach that teaches them about losing and NEVER giving up, on offense or defense. That is what SLC does, we will not "lay down" when we have a big lead, we will tone it down, but still try and execute the plays called.

[dragonsdaddy]

has there ever been a team get so much grief after totally throttling an opponent who is relatively well thought of and will go at least 3 deep in the po's. the bar is set so high that a 41-0 victory is poo-pooed and denigrated and down-rated to the point that one might assume they were very lucky to win at all.

i see lots of wanna-bes trying to justify their confidence, or lack thereof, by being hyper-critical of others.

i've seen several quotes whereby the etexas powers would explode out and be 3 td's ahead if and when they get the chance. lp didn't explode on the hapless kleinsters wednesday, and i'm wondering if lview has played a game ever where they weren't resting after the first qtr. maybe not, and that is not a good thing. i expect there will always be ney-sayers. it probably stems from our first tv game where we lit the fires in the second and didn't land until we'd scored 45 unanswered points.

was that slc's best game-no
was that the best team we've played-probably
would we beat the rest of the best with that performance-probably not

[bleedgreen]

But name calling is allowed? I am betting not.

~DnM
no, it's really not....but, why even make a statement like that towards my last post??? is it because i said that i wasn't impressed with SLC last night??? well, i wasn't!! DR is flat out terrible!! just as Tyler Lee is--i wasn't impressed with us, either......just wondering where the "crack" and "glass pipe" remarks made by you fit in with my last post??? if you disagree, then state your opinion--it's that simple...don't bring up drugs, that's really immature and ignorant on your part............i am an ex-Lobo who still follows Longview everywhere, a father of a 3 year old girl, and finishing my bachelor's in nursing---don't do drugs, brother---i do have some class.................

[Sakatha]

It's called a figure of speech?

Insinuating that what you said was ridiculous? You're not familiar with that phrase? Really?!

~DnM

[Sakatha]

[QUOTE=bleedgreen]what about ET?? yall aren't exactly playing "top-notch" programs either....and who cares about the "haka"---i'm so sick of hearing about that crap i could puke!! you are the ones who act like you are the "kings" of Texas.....just put up and shut upiQUOTE]

I was refering to this, fyi.

What'd that person do to deserve that response from you?

~DnM

[dragonfly]

sure, us and SLC have played "sub-par" teams so far....what about ET?? yall aren't exactly playing "top-notch" programs either....and who cares about the "haka"---i'm so sick of hearing about that crap i could puke!! you are the ones who act like you are the "kings" of Texas.....just put up and shut up--same goes for these so- called "true" SLC and Longview fans who are arguing like children..it's ridiculous!!.......as for the SLC/DR game, i was not impressed one bit.....wide open receivers the entire night, no type of pass rush by DR, and not much of an offense or defense for DR-----who couldn't win that game??? there are 1A and 2A teams here in East Texas who could have beaten DR just the same, and probably worse!....same goes for Longview----Tyler Lee is very weak this season, as well.......to sum it up, DR and Tyler Lee are not good indicators of how good SLC and Longview really are---they are BOTH terrible!! nevertheless, congrats to SLC on a good win...i guess????????PS-----how did all of this Longview/ SLC crap get started??? there are a number of other teams that could beat SLC or Longview......Katy, Abilene, and let's not forget the "nine-headed" purple monster Lufkin!! to even get to SLC, the road goes through Lufkin---and we know how far that has gotten us lately...not very far!! forget SLC, forget ET(who im not even thinking about anyway)---we have to worry about a Rockwall team who is coming in to Lobo Stadium tonight looking for the upset that they almost pulled off last season.................c'mon Lobo fans, let's lay off of SLC---they are the kings until someone knocks them off--and we don't have a leg to stand on, brothers...................................

There isn't a 1A or 2A team in the state that could beat Denton Ryan.

[bleedgreen]

very aware of that phrase, sakatha---just wondering what part of my post that you disagreed with????

[Favpack]

bleedgreen -

Crack kills.

It's way to early in the day to be pickin' up that glass pipe.

~DnM

Yeah- what's up with this Sak? - these types of idiotic posts are not welcomed here - go find a druggie forum if that's what you want to discuss. Talk about classless - look in the mirror.

[Sakatha]

See above pls.

~DnM

[Sakatha]

Favpack - Like I said, figure of speech.. I don't think he's *really* on crack. Good lord, man.

~DnM

[DragonFan]

If you look at the Dragons and who all gets to play you will be very surprised. Presley got a TD and he is a 2nd teamer who got a chance to play a lot because of the score. The offense runs a lot a players in and out. Everyone contributes. There are some players that play because they have earned the right to get as many downs as possible. Boydston at Defense End plays because he plays every down as if it is the last down of his life. He anchors the defensive line and made quite a few great plays last night. He came out in the 4th and was nicely appluded when he left. The other defensive linemen were rotated rather rountinely. Same is true with the defensive backs. It is almost like SLC has 20 starters on Offense and close to the same number on Defense. It mirrors rather nicely the fourmula that many NFL teams use now. The starters start but do not always play every down in every quarter. That is how the Dragons can be fresh for 4 quaters and play brutal playoff games and still have just enough gas in the tank to finnish it all!

[Fleeman93]

It appears you have only seen one SLC game this year. Your analysis of the SLC team reflects that.

Dad if you would like to have a mature discussion about my opinions then lets do it. If you want to come on and say that I am wrong based on my analysis of one game then tell me why. I don't make posts about SLC sucking because they wear green or SLC are flamers. I give my opinion and back it up with my observations. If you want to provide proof why you think Newton is better than Luna then do so. If you want to provide proof that McElroy is a better runner than Daniel then do so. If you want to provide any proof at all why the 2005 SLC offense is better than the 2004 offense then do so.

[bleedgreen]

There isn't a 1A or 2A team in the state that could beat Denton Ryan.
dragonfly---are you serious??? you haven't been around Texas much, have you????

[Favpack]

has there ever been a team get so much grief after totally throttling an opponent who is relatively well thought of and will go at least 3 deep in the po's. the bar is set so high that a 41-0 victory is poo-pooed and denigrated and down-rated to the point that one might assume they were very lucky to win at all.

i see lots of wanna-bes trying to justify their confidence, or lack thereof, by being hyper-critical of others.

i've seen several quotes whereby the etexas powers would explode out and be 3 td's ahead if and when they get the chance. lp didn't explode on the hapless kleinsters wednesday, and i'm wondering if lview has played a game ever where they weren't resting after the first qtr. maybe not, and that is not a good thing. i expect there will always be ney-sayers. it probably stems from our first tv game where we lit the fires in the second and didn't land until we'd scored 45 unanswered points.

was that slc's best game-no
was that the best team we've played-probably
would we beat the rest of the best with that performance-probably not

DD - you've lost 1 game in 3 years. Lose every now and then -- and we'd be a lot kinder and gentler :) Lufkin played flat, very flat in the first half against a Klein team that would not match up with DR. Maybe someday Lufkin will play on Thursday night TV -- and we'll catch the heat for under-delivering.

[SLCDad]

I really have to laugh at some of you shallow thinking arm chair quarterbacks who have only seen one SLC game this year and yet jump to HUGE conclusions about the team. Some of you are, frankly, really full of yourselves.

(Now that I've made enemies of the entire board, I'll add my two cents worth)

A few points:
1. Don't sell Denton Ryan short. They are a very good football team. They are highly ranked and their record speaks for itself.

2. Denton Ryan played 7 in the box the entire night AND played their CBs about generally medium tight and their safeties not very far behind the LBs. They attempted to take away the rushing game and the short passing game. SLC had killed it's last two opponents by rushing for over 350 yards per game and by completing many short passes with long runs after the catch. I think Coach Florence did the right thing and the DR defense was successful in stopping what they intended to stop.

3. Based on their defensive allignment, DR challenged SLC to throw long. Long pass routes take a bit longer to develop which is one reason why DR got a few sacks. SLC is a master at taking what the defense gives them. Last night they were given the long pass and they took it. Both of the left and right farthest wide outs had huge games (Fentriss and Renfrow). We shouldn't be surprised.

4. The SLC defense was very good. DR has a potent offense averaging 32 points per game which ranks in the top 15% of Texas 5A schools. SLC pretty much stuffed DR the entire game with the exception a one drive and a few other plays. Holding that team to 0 points and 165 total offense is great.

5. The SLC running game was stopped. Hats of to DR. After gaining around 350 yards the last two games it's no wonder DR focused on stopping the run.

6. SLC may have been a little flat last night. Hard to say how much of that should be credited to DR. Even the Dragon Nation didn't show up in their usual numbers. Getting kids home after 11:00 p.m. on a school night is a bit tough. With a 54-1 record, it's not easy to keep motivated every game. Blowout after blowout after blowout makes it tough.

7. Don't criticize Joey Florence to much about the 4th down plays. He knows that SLC can score fast. He had to take chances. Even if he had punted, SLC would have probably scored 65% of the time anyway. Coach Florence knows that. He took a risk and lost last night. He had little choice.

8. The game was a 41-0 blowout. We'll take it. After SLC beat PESH 37-0 everyone was critical of SLC fans for expecting to much when we said SLC didn't play well. Yet, after a 41-0 victory over a better team many are criticizing SLC. Go figure.

[dragonfly]

no, it's really not....but, why even make a statement like that towards my last post??? is it because i said that i wasn't impressed with SLC last night??? well, i wasn't!! DR is flat out terrible!! just as Tyler Lee is--i wasn't impressed with us, either......just wondering where the "crack" and "glass pipe" remarks made by you fit in with my last post??? if you disagree, then state your opinion--it's that simple...don't bring up drugs, that's really immature and ignorant on your part............i am an ex-Lobo who still follows Longview everywhere, a father of a 3 year old girl, and finishing my bachelor's in nursing---don't do drugs, brother---i do have some class.................

Help me understand why you think Denton Ryan is flat out terrible. Sawyer and Fenty and the quarterback are talented players. They also have a very good linebacker core and a very good defensive end. I'm not saying they are great but they have beaten eveyone else but Longview. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'd just like to know why you think they are flat out terrible. Have you seen them play anyone besides Carroll?

[dragonsdaddy]

no one can provide "proof" of any of these things. statistically, the 05 version is slightly ahead of the 04 and even the 02 versions. individual stats don't show it because the 02 team had 6 skill players that played 99% of the time and thus put some sick numbers up. luna was better as a sr than tre, and probably as a soph too, though not so much more that one would have made much of it. daniel was a better athlete than mc, but not a better passer, esp in his first 7 games at qb. his running ability was undoubtedly above mc's, but it was above 90% of the rbs in the state too. winning is about even, so far.

[dragonfly]

dragonfly---are you serious??? you haven't been around Texas much, have you????

Name one. I've seen a lot of Texas football in my years.

[SLCDad]

has there ever been a team get so much grief after totally throttling an opponent who is relatively well thought of and will go at least 3 deep in the po's. the bar is set so high that a 41-0 victory is poo-pooed and denigrated and down-rated to the point that one might assume they were very lucky to win at all.

i see lots of wanna-bes trying to justify their confidence, or lack thereof, by being hyper-critical of others.

i've seen several quotes whereby the etexas powers would explode out and be 3 td's ahead if and when they get the chance. lp didn't explode on the hapless kleinsters wednesday, and i'm wondering if lview has played a game ever where they weren't resting after the first qtr. maybe not, and that is not a good thing. i expect there will always be ney-sayers. it probably stems from our first tv game where we lit the fires in the second and didn't land until we'd scored 45 unanswered points.

was that slc's best game-no
was that the best team we've played-probably
would we beat the rest of the best with that performance-probably notExactly right.

I love the "etexas powers" comment. Funny.

[DragonFan]

bleedgreen,

I usally do not post directly to one person, but if I understand your post correctly you think that a 1a or 2a team could beat Denton Ryan. I would simply ask you to reconcider that thought. Denton Ryan was the best 4A school in the state of Texas for 4 years before moving to 5A. They have beat every 5A school they have played with the exception of SLC. I doubt any 1a or 2a school has the predigree or the players to beat Denton Ryan. Most people have only seen Denton Ryan play against SLC. Last year on ESPN2 or this year on Fox Sports Net. Niether game is a good example of how good Denton Ryan is. Even the announcers of last night game had nothing but good things to say about Denton Ryan. Ryan is good but cannot compete with SLC. That is the only thing that can come out of the outcome of last nights game.

Respectfully yours,

DraronFan

[dragonbuck]

Dragonfly,
that is not true. Watch the next SLC game very closely and see how many subs Dodge puts in throughout the game. He doesn't do the wholesale substitution of an entire unit until late in the game, but he is playing 2nd teamers throught the game. He rotates them in on D line and the secondary regularly. To a somewhat lesser extent on the O-line, and little at linebacking. At receiver, 8-10 players are rotated in every game. This enables the subs to get playing time with the 1st unit and allows them to be ready when they are called on in a big game down the road.

I like this technique. It raises a lot of criticism, however, because outsiders to the SLC program think that Dodge is not giving others playing time or is trying to run up the score. They don't see an entirely new unit running on to the field in unison, so they assume that no subs are being played. Wrong!

[Sportsfan24]

No matter how you look at last nigths game SLC was just better across the board. I do not have a team in this discussion, all I was trying to say is there will be some good match ups this year. ET, LV, LP, Katy, Westfield, NS and SLC appear to be at the head of the 5A class. Depending on who goes Div I and Div II there should be some real good games played. I have seen Lufkin and Westfield in person and while they played teams of lesser talent, you could see their strenghts and the question to be answered on the field is how everyone will match up. SLC is the defending Champion until someone beats them. While I was impressed with their talent, I really like what the coaching staff has put together, it is a class program that I wish some of the Houston programs (our school) would try and copy.

[Fleeman93]

no one can provide "proof" of any of these things. statistically, the 05 version is slightly ahead of the 04 and even the 02 versions. individual stats don't show it because the 02 team had 6 skill players that played 99% of the time and thus put some sick numbers up. luna was better as a sr than tre, and probably as a soph too, though not so much more that one would have made much of it. daniel was a better athlete than mc, but not a better passer, esp in his first 7 games at qb. his running ability was undoubtedly above mc's, but it was above 90% of the rbs in the state too. winning is about even, so far.

I will assume that you were addressing some of my points from your context. So my statement that Luna was a better back than Newton is right now is factual? So my statement that Daniel was a better runner than McElroy is also true? So my statement that this year's SLC passing game is as good as last year's is true (I'll give you better but I don't see how you can be better than damn near perfect)? With all of that said, isn't it fair to say that if the 2005 passing game is as good as the 2004 passing game, Newton isn't as good as Luna was, and the McElroy can't run as well as Daniel, then the offense probably isn't as good?

[SLCDad]

Dad if you would like to have a mature discussion about my opinions then lets do it. If you want to come on and say that I am wrong based on my analysis of one game then tell me why. I don't make posts about SLC sucking because they wear green or SLC are flamers. I give my opinion and back it up with my observations. If you want to provide proof why you think Newton is better than Luna then do so. If you want to provide proof that McElroy is a better runner than Daniel then do so. If you want to provide any proof at all why the 2005 SLC offense is better than the 2004 offense then do so.I know your posts are your observations. I understand why you posted what you did. However, I pointed out that you had only seen one SLC game so your view is limited. No need to take offense. If I had only seen one game, I would probably agree with you.

Statistically the 2005 team is ahead of the past SLC teams. Their running game (with McElroy and Newton leading the way) has been terrific the last two games. The 2004 SLC team had several tough games during the season (FR, Keller and even Haltom was tough). This 41-0 blowout was probably SLC's toughest game this year. Advantage 2005.

You didn't see much of Newton last night. We haven't seen much of Renfrow all season. Can't judge either from only one game. (Both are great).

It's easy to look through rose colored glasses when remembering prior year's teams. The 2005 version of the Dragons may be the best yet, but of course, there is a lot of football to be played.

[Favpack]

I really have to laugh at some of you shallow thinking arm chair quarterbacks who have only seen one SLC game this year and yet jump to HUGE conclusions about the team. Some of you are, frankly, really full of yourselves.

(Now that I've made enemies of the entire board, I'll add my two cents worth)

A few points:
1. Don't sell Denton Ryan short. They are a very good football team. They are highly ranked and their record speaks for itself.

2. Denton Ryan played 7 in the box the entire night AND played their CBs about generally medium tight and their safeties not very far behind the LBs. They attempted to take away the rushing game and the short passing game. SLC had killed it's last two opponents by rushing for over 350 yards per game and by completing many short passes with long runs after the catch. I think Coach Florence did the right thing and the DR defense was successful in stopping what they intended to stop.

3. Based on their defensive allignment, DR challenged SLC to throw long. Long pass routes take a bit longer to develop which is one reason why DR got a few sacks. SLC is a master at taking what the defense gives them. Last night they were given the long pass and they took it. Both of the left and right farthest wide outs had huge games (Fentriss and Renfrow). We shouldn't be surprised.

4. The SLC defense was very good. DR has a potent offense averaging 32 points per game which ranks in the top 15% of Texas 5A schools. SLC pretty much stuffed DR the entire game with the exception a one drive and a few other plays. Holding that team to 0 points and 165 total offense is great.

5. The SLC running game was stopped. Hats of to DR. After gaining around 350 yards the last two games it's no wonder DR focused on stopping the run.

6. SLC may have been a little flat last night. Hard to say how much of that should be credited to DR. Even the Dragon Nation didn't show up in their usual numbers. Getting kids home after 11:00 p.m. on a school night is a bit tough. With a 54-1 record, it's not easy to keep motivated every game. Blowout after blowout after blowout makes it tough.

7. Don't criticize Joey Florence to much about the 4th down plays. He knows that SLC can score fast. He had to take chances. Even if he had punted, SLC would have probably scored 65% of the time anyway. Coach Florence knows that. He took a risk and lost last night. He had little choice.

8. The game was a 41-0 blowout. We'll take it. After SLC beat PESH 37-0 everyone was critical of SLC fans for expecting to much when we said SLC didn't play well. Yet, after a 41-0 victory over a better team many are criticizing SLC. Go figure.

Either you're contradicting yourself Dad - or your suggesting everyone else on an opinion forum needs to shut up and hand you the trophy as we humbly kiss your feet and slink away.

Here's the bottom line - DR has a good program, they've beaten all comers at the 5-A level except SLC, but, then again they really haven't played anyone else. Yes, they made the regional finals last year, but had a fairly smooth road there - certainly no Longview or Abilene High in the way. But, they have stunk it up by and large against SLC on three different occassions.

Coach Florence' boys have looked fairly bad in 3 tries with SLC - and anyone who thinks him going for it on 4th twice is simply underscoring the fact that DR is in desperation mode against a far superior team. Conversely, Lufkin has played SLC down to the final play twice, Katy solved SLC in '03, and AHS and SV also played SLC to the final play in '04. Either DR is way overmatched, Coach Florence is way overmatched, or Lufkin (twice), Katy, AHS and SV got lucky.

As I stated earlier - what is Coach Florence's score total against SLC - 30 to 120? Not really something to brag about.

[bleedgreen]

Help me understand why you think Denton Ryan is flat out terrible. Sawyer and Fenty and the quarterback are talented players. They also have a very good linebacker core and a very good defensive end. I'm not saying they are great but they have beaten eveyone else but Longview. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'd just like to know why you think they are flat out terrible. Have you seen them play anyone besides Carroll?they just look really flat.......i know their reputation and i expected a better game out of them...just wasn't too impressed......i said the same about Tyler Lee last week---just really didn't look good at all.........i've never seen DR play but twice---against you guys both times...but, i saw enough to back up my opinion......Tyler lee and DR would be one hell of a match-up..............

[bleedgreen]

bleedgreen,

I usally do not post directly to one person, but if I understand your post correctly you think that a 1a or 2a team could beat Denton Ryan. I would simply ask you to reconcider that thought. Denton Ryan was the best 4A school in the state of Texas for 4 years before moving to 5A. They have beat every 5A school they have played with the exception of SLC. I doubt any 1a or 2a school has the predigree or the players to beat Denton Ryan. Most people have only seen Denton Ryan play against SLC. Last year on ESPN2 or this year on Fox Sports Net. Niether game is a good example of how good Denton Ryan is. Even the announcers of last night game had nothing but good things to say about Denton Ryan. Ryan is good but cannot compete with SLC. That is the only thing that can come out of the outcome of last nights game.

Respectfully yours,

DraronFan
i respect your opinion, draronfan.....like i said, regardless of their reputation, i just didn't see anything special out of DR.......SLC looked good, don't get the wrong idea...have nothing but respect for someone who wins state titles, as well as, national titles...i just think by seeing DR last night, alot of teams could have beat them just as bad or worse as you guys did................

[pack0808]

has there ever been a team get so much grief after totally throttling an opponent who is relatively well thought of and will go at least 3 deep in the po's. the bar is set so high that a 41-0 victory is poo-pooed and denigrated and down-rated to the point that one might assume they were very lucky to win at all.

i see lots of wanna-bes trying to justify their confidence, or lack thereof, by being hyper-critical of others.

i've seen several quotes whereby the etexas powers would explode out and be 3 td's ahead if and when they get the chance. lp didn't explode on the hapless kleinsters wednesday, and i'm wondering if lview has played a game ever where they weren't resting after the first qtr. maybe not, and that is not a good thing. i expect there will always be ney-sayers. it probably stems from our first tv game where we lit the fires in the second and didn't land until we'd scored 45 unanswered points.

was that slc's best game-no
was that the best team we've played-probably
would we beat the rest of the best with that performance-probably not


Yeah it is hard to believe?? Now little bity 1a and 2a school's can beat DR even though the only 5a team they have lost to was SLC and DR went to 3 straight championship games in 4a and won 2 before coming to 5a!! :eek: DR has yet to play a great 5a team besides SLC but let's not get that crazy??

[SLCDad]

I will assume that you were addressing some of my points from your context. So my statement that Luna was a better back than Newton is right now is factual? So my statement that Daniel was a better runner than McElroy is also true? So my statement that this year's SLC passing game is as good as last year's is true (I'll give you better but I don't see how you can be better than damn near perfect)? With all of that said, isn't it fair to say that if the 2005 passing game is as good as the 2004 passing game, Newton isn't as good as Luna was, and the McElroy can't run as well as Daniel, then the offense probably isn't as good?Since your assumptions are based on one game, they are not exaclty correct. At times Newton has been better than Luna. Overall, SLC's running game is better than last year. The 2005 offense is better than 2004 and the defense is also. Those are facts.

[Fleeman93]

Since your assumptions are based on one game, they are not exaclty correct. At times Newton has been better than Luna. Overall, SLC's running game is better than last year. The 2005 offense is better than 2004 and the defense is also. Those are facts.

....and I quote - "The 2004 SLC team had several tough games during the season (FR, Keller and even Haltom was tough). This 41-0 blowout was probably SLC's toughest game this year. Advantage 2005."

Do you think by any chance that this could be the reason that the 2005 SLC offense has put up better numbers to this point? Katy's 2005 team has set some school scoring records to this point but it doesn't really mean all that much to me simply based on competition thus far.

ADDED - ADDTIONAL NOTE

I didn't have to see any SLC games to know that Newton as a sophomore was not going to be anywhere near as good as Luna as a spread running back. I have also read up on McElroy enough to know that he isn't the runner that Daniel was, but last night certainly reaffirmed that for me.

[dragonfly]

Help me understand why you think Denton Ryan is flat out terrible. Sawyer and Fenty and the quarterback are talented players. They also have a very good linebacker core and a very good defensive end. I'm not saying they are great but they have beaten eveyone else but Longview. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'd just like to know why you think they are flat out terrible. Have you seen them play anyone besides Carroll?

I meant to say Highland Park. Longview is just on the mind....ya'll understand.

[SLCDad]

Either you're contradicting yourself Dad - or your suggesting everyone else on an opinion forum needs to shut up and hand you the trophy as we humbly kiss your feet and slink away.No need to get sarcastic or post stupid stuff. I was just commenting on some posters who hold huge opinions about SLC and make outlandish statements yet they have only seen them play ONCE and even that was on TV. At least you admited that your view was limited and based on a couple of games. That's fine, unlike some others.

[SLCDad]

I meant to say Highland Park. Longview is just on the mind....ya'll understand.Did you know you can edit your original post by pressing the edit button. Then you won't need to correct it with another post. (Just in case you didn't know that.)

[Fleeman93]

No need to get sarcastic or post stupid stuff. I was just commenting on some posters who hold huge opinions about SLC and make outlandish statements yet they have only seen them play ONCE and even that was on TV. At least you admited that your view was limited and based on a couple of games. That's fine, unlike some others.

Are you referring to me again Dad? Are my comments outlandish? Anyone else think my comments about Newton not being as good of a spread back as Luna are outlandish? Anyone else think that my comments about McElroy not being the runner that Daniel was are outlandish? I would ask you to go back and read the additional edit I added to my previous post, but I will go ahead and post it again:

I didn't have to see any SLC games to know that Newton as a sophomore was not going to be anywhere near as good as Luna as a spread running back. I have also read up on McElroy enough to know that he isn't the runner that Daniel was, but last night certainly reaffirmed that for me.

[SLCDad]

[QUOTE=Fleeman93I didn't have to see any SLC games to know that Newton as a sophomore was not going to be anywhere near as good as Luna as a spread running back. I have also read up on McElroy enough to know that he isn't the runner that Daniel was, but last night certainly reaffirmed that for me.[/QUOTE]Then why is the 2005 SLC team a better running team than 2004 was?

[dragonfly]

Dragonfly,
that is not true. Watch the next SLC game very closely and see how many subs Dodge puts in throughout the game. He doesn't do the wholesale substitution of an entire unit until late in the game, but he is playing 2nd teamers throught the game. He rotates them in on D line and the secondary regularly. To a somewhat lesser extent on the O-line, and little at linebacking. At receiver, 8-10 players are rotated in every game. This enables the subs to get playing time with the 1st unit and allows them to be ready when they are called on in a big game down the road.

I like this technique. It raises a lot of criticism, however, because outsiders to the SLC program think that Dodge is not giving others playing time or is trying to run up the score. They don't see an entirely new unit running on to the field in unison, so they assume that no subs are being played. Wrong!

I agree with you Dragonbuck. It's nice to have so many fresh players. The last couple of years have been a little different. I still think that "most" of our starters will end up with more experince, though, as opposed to the coaches who pull their starters at half time.

[Fleeman93]

My guess would be the level of competition as you stated in an earlier post, but honestly I have no idea. I just think it is absurd to think that Newton is a better spread back than Luna. I also think that it is absurd to think that McElroy is better runner than Daniel. Do you not think the loss of Daniels’ legs is a blow to the 2005 SLC offense? I am just stating some obvious facts and drawing conclusions from them.

[dragonfly]

I will assume that you were addressing some of my points from your context. So my statement that Luna was a better back than Newton is right now is factual? So my statement that Daniel was a better runner than McElroy is also true? So my statement that this year's SLC passing game is as good as last year's is true (I'll give you better but I don't see how you can be better than damn near perfect)? With all of that said, isn't it fair to say that if the 2005 passing game is as good as the 2004 passing game, Newton isn't as good as Luna was, and the McElroy can't run as well as Daniel, then the offense probably isn't as good?

No, because Daniel and McElroy are different quarterbacks. The receiving corps is also all around better. Newton is a little different kind of runner and is not that much lesser of a runner than Luna. McElroy does not have to be the runner that Daniel was and Newton does not have to be as good a runner as Luna for this offense to be better.

[dragonfly]

they just look really flat.......i know their reputation and i expected a better game out of them...just wasn't too impressed......i said the same about Tyler Lee last week---just really didn't look good at all.........i've never seen DR play but twice---against you guys both times...but, i saw enough to back up my opinion......Tyler lee and DR would be one hell of a match-up..............

Carroll makes a lot of teams look terrible as do Lufkin and Longview, but does that mean the teams are really that bad or is Carroll, Lufkin, and Longview just so good that they can make teams look like that. I think that there are a handful of teams in Texas that will make any good team and some very good teams look pretty bad.

[Fleeman93]

No, because Daniel and McElroy are different quarterbacks. The receiving corps is also all around better. Newton is a little different kind of runner and is not that much lesser of a runner than Luna. McElroy does not have to be the runner that Daniel was and Newton does not have to be as good a runner as Luna for this offense to be better.

So your saying that the loss of Daniels' legs has helped SLC's passing game how? I find it hard to put much stock into McElroy being a better passer improving your already near perfect passing offense. I don't see how what Daniel did last year can be improved upon much. It is possible that McElroy is a better passing QB but how much better can he be than a top D1 recruit in Daniel? As far as the receivers go, I agree that this group is better than last years. Again, how much better can you get than damn near perfect? I won't be educating any knowledgeable fan by saying that a running back is different than a spread back. A spread back has to account for so much more in an offense. I will end my argument if you can tell me that a sophomore running back in Newton replacing a three year starting spread back in Luna makes this team better.

[RyanRaiderDad]

Here's the bottom line - DR has a good program, they've beaten all comers at the 5-A level except SLC, but, then again they really haven't played anyone else. Yes, they made the regional finals last year, but had a fairly smooth road there - certainly no Longview or Abilene High in the way. But, they have stunk it up by and large against SLC on three different occassions.
.

No question... We ARE outmatched by SLC. No arguments here, no "We should have won that game", no "It's the ref's fault", none of that senseless gab. But to say we havent really played anybody??? I recall an Irving MAC team that was 10-0 last year when we beat them... but they must have had an easy district (yes I'm laying on the sarcasm as thick as possible), and then we put down a highly ranked Plano team as well, another weak district? Is DFW comprised of nothing but weak districts? Really, I'm not here to blindly pound my chest to the beat of the DR drum, but come on. I apologize for us not hauling in a 5a title in our 1 1/2 years in 5a, but we're doing pretty well. Getting soundly beaten by SLC on national TV does hurt, and it does not gain us any respect from those who have never seen anything other than those two games, but you guys are out there with some of your statements. My hat goes off to the teams that do give SLC fits. It's something we have not been able to do...

I will say this, when DR's run is over, I will be at every SLC watching the fireworks! If there is crow on the menu, I will be serving it with my Dragon peers!

[SLCDad]

My guess would be the level of competition as you stated in an earlier post, but honestly I have no idea. I just think it is absurd to think that Newton is a better spread back than Luna. I also think that it is absurd to think that McElroy is better runner than Daniel. Do you not think the loss of Daniels’ legs is a blow to the 2005 SLC offense? I am just stating some obvious facts and drawing conclusions from them.I didn't say the level of competion was down. You assumed that yourself. I said "tough games" which reflects equally on SLC in 2004.

The facts are that the offense is better in 2005, especially the running game. Luna and Daniel were tremendous players and would leave huge holes in any team, BUT the running game is UP without them. How do you explain that?

Imagine a great running back with speed and moves. Add that to the spread offense with a great passing game. That is what we've seen in a couple of games this year with Newton. We never saw that in 2004.

Granted, at this point, Newton has some maturing to do. However, he adds an element to the SLC offense that Luna never could.

To bad we didn't see that last night.

[dragonfly]

So your saying that the loss of Daniels' legs has helped SLC's passing game how? I find it hard to put much stock into McElroy being a better passer improving your already near perfect passing offense. I don't see how what Daniel did last year can be improved upon much. It is possible that McElroy is a better passing QB but how much better can he be than a top D1 recruit in Daniel? As far as the receivers go, I agree that this group is better than last years. Again, how much better can you get than damn near perfect? I won't be educating any knowledgeable fan by saying that a running back is different than a spread back. A spread back has to account for so much more in an offense. I will end my argument if you can tell me that a sophomore running back in Newton replacing a three year starting spread back in Luna makes this team better.

I understand what you're saying. I just think that the talent and depth of the receiving corps and McElroy's accuracy has made up for the loss of Daniel's running ability. I also don't think their's that big a difference in Newton and Luna. You do, and that's part of the reason you believe last year's offense was better. I'll agree to disagree with you.

[Fleeman93]

So your competition this year is as good as last years to this point? If you say the competition is as good then I am going to check so make sure of your answer before you do so. Daniel was not just a tremendous player, he was the two time defending 5A player of the year. Do you think McElroy will win POY this year (I have no clue)? Luna was not just a tremendous player, he was arguably, as stated on this board by many SLC faithful and others, the perfect spread running back. As I said before, I am sure Newton is a nice running back. There is just no way at this point that Newton can contribute all the things that Luna did, and did so well, and that hurts the offense.

[SLCDad]

No question... We ARE outmatched by SLC. No arguments here, no "We should have won that game", no "It's the ref's fault", none of that senseless gab. But to say we havent really played anybody??? I recall an Irving MAC team that was 10-0 last year when we beat them... but they must have had an easy district (yes I'm laying on the sarcasm as thick as possible), and then we put down a highly ranked Plano team as well, another weak district? Is DFW comprised of nothing but weak districts? Really, I'm not here to blindly pound my chest to the beat of the DR drum, but come on. I apologize for us not hauling in a 5a title in our 1 1/2 years in 5a, but we're doing pretty well. Getting soundly beaten by SLC on national TV does hurt, and it does not gain us any respect from those who have never seen anything other than those two games, but you guys are out there with some of your statements. My hat goes off to the teams that do give SLC fits. It's something we have not been able to do...

I will say this, when DR's run is over, I will be at every SLC watching the fireworks! If there is crow on the menu, I will be serving it with my Dragon peers!You are absolutely right. Didn't Irving Mac beat the vaunted Euless Trinity team last year? Yep!! Irving Mac was an undefeated Top 10 and DR beat them.

I have a real problem with everyone saying DR is a poor team. DR lost twice to the #1 team in 2004 and lost to the #1 and #8 teams in 2005. Highland Park ranks #8 among all schools which is ABOVE Smithson Valley, Converse Judson, Abilene, and Plano.

[SLCDad]

So your competition this year is as good as last years to this point? If you say the competition is as good then I am going to check so make sure of your answer before you do so. Daniel was not just a tremendous player, he was the two time defending 5A player of the year. Do you think McElroy will win POY this year (I have no clue)? Luna was not just a tremendous player, he was arguably, as stated on this board by many SLC faithful and others, the perfect spread running back. As I said before, I am sure Newton is a nice running back. There is just no way at this point that Newton can contribute all the things that Luna did, and did so well, and that hurts the offense.You still haven't answered. Why is the offense better in 2005?

[Fleeman93]

I understand what you're saying. I just think that the talent and depth of the receiving corps and McElroy's accuracy has made up for the loss of Daniel's running ability. I also don't think their's that big a difference in Newton and Luna. You do, and that's part of the reason you believe last year's offense was better. I'll agree to disagree with you.

Was talent and depth ever an issue with last years SLC team? Did they ever have a problem with the 2004 WR unit dropping lots of balls or running bad routes? Did Daniel have a problem with accuracy? That doesn't say much for the state of TX if the two time offensive POY had problems with accuracy at the QB position. I'll tell you what, if any of you don't think their is a huge difference between Newton and Luna then go talk to Coach Dodge. I'm sure he could elaborate on it a little better.

[ktchamp97]

41-0, much like 54-1, speaks for itself...

41-0 is a thrashing no matter how you try to cut it up. Did they play perfect? No. However, I would argue that NO team has ever played a perfect game. Carroll, just like Lufkin, Longview, Katy, Trinity, etc., etc. are victims of their own succes at times because people see them once and expect perfection, which, in reality, is unrealistic. The fact that they beat a good team 41-0 while playing "sloppy", "not as good as SLC 200'X'", or whatever should tell you just how good this team is...they won 41-0!

The most impressive thing about last night's game was the fact that Carroll defense shutout a quality Ryan Raider offense. I was very impressed with Boydston and the Carroll secondary. With the exception of the grossly overthrown deep ball to Fenty, the Ryan receivers were blanketed all night. Sawyer was able to get the corner a couple times, but I thought Carroll adjusted well and took that away later in the game. The Dragon run D up the middle was also stout.

I don't see any spread team beating Carroll unless they complete a very high percentage, don't turn the ball over, and they keep the ball for 5 or 6 minutes every possession, while playing lights out defense. Ryan played pretty good defense and still gave up 41 points because their offense kept putting them back on the field. The only way to slow down Carroll's offense is to employ some sort of zone blitzing defense. I don't think anyone can cover them man-to-man and they will pick you apart if given enough time to throw.

I was more impressed with Carroll's win than I was with Longview's, for what it's worth (which, admittedly, ain't much).

[SLCDad]

So your competition this year is as good as last years to this point? If you say the competition is as good then I am going to check so make sure of your answer before you do so.LOL I never said anything about competition last year or this year. That is entirely YOUR assumption.

[Fleeman93]

You still haven't answered. Why is the offense better in 2005?

I don't think it is better, that is my point. Don't tell me the 2005 team offense is better than the 2004 team offense based simply on numbers, which is all you really have unless you can tell me why this years offensive players are that much better.

[SLCDad]

I don't think it is better, that is my point. Don't tell me the 2005 team offense is better than the 2004 team offense based simply on numbers, which is all you really have unless you can tell me why this years offensive players are that much better.Well . . . . if we can't use the numbers (which reflect performance on the field in real games) then we are left with . . . well . . . nothing. Only perceptions.

I get it now. The offense is worse in 2005 even though they are more balanced, gain more yards and score more points. Makes sense to me.

[Fleeman93]

I know your posts are your observations. I understand why you posted what you did. However, I pointed out that you had only seen one SLC game so your view is limited. No need to take offense. If I had only seen one game, I would probably agree with you.

Statistically the 2005 team is ahead of the past SLC teams. Their running game (with McElroy and Newton leading the way) has been terrific the last two games. The 2004 SLC team had several tough games during the season (FR, Keller and even Haltom was tough). This 41-0 blowout was probably SLC's toughest game this year. Advantage 2005.

You didn't see much of Newton last night. We haven't seen much of Renfrow all season. Can't judge either from only one game. (Both are great).

It's easy to look through rose colored glasses when remembering prior year's teams. The 2005 version of the Dragons may be the best yet, but of course, there is a lot of football to be played.

Does this not imply that in 2004 you had tough opponents? Does the following sentence not imply that Denton Ryan 2004 was SLC's toughest game to this point? Tell you what I will go ahead and pull the numbers for last years SLC opponents compared to this years. I'll be right back.

[Fleeman93]

Well . . . . if we can't use the numbers (which reflect performance on the field in real games) then we are left with . . . well . . . nothing. Only perceptions.

No, we are left with opinions as to why. You have given me none, but I am all ears.

[SLCDad]

Does this not imply that in 2004 you had tough opponents? Does the following sentence not imply that Denton Ryan 2004 was SLC's toughest game to this point? Tell you what I will go ahead and pull the numbers for last years SLC opponents compared to this years. I'll be right back.I know what I said. The problem is you refuse to understand what I meant when I said it.

[Fleeman93]

I know what I said. The problem is you refuse to understand what I meant when I said it.

I am a simple man. Could you please explain?

[DragonFan]

The difference between 2004 and 2005 Dragon offenses is the manner in which all weopons are utilized. Last year it was very much a Daniel show with a Luna being a very good suporting cast along with a bunch of great recievers. Daniel had a tendency to look at one reciever and lock on him for the game. Look at the games last year and you will see 1 reciever a game had a "break out" type of game. Daniel was a running back that could throw a ball to a bunch of great recieveres who ran great routs and had many, many reps on the patterns.

McElroy is a better passer who gets everyone in the game and gets the ball to a unbelievable number of players through the course of the game. McElroy only runs when necessary or when the Defense gives him the run.

Luna was an offensive guard who could run and catch. He was fast and took advantage of what the defense gave him. You will never find a tougher runner than Luna. He and Chase played great together because the have played a lot of games together.

Newton is a running back. He can break a play from anywhere on the field. Once is through the line or gets outside he can run away from people and make people miss. He has not shown the toughness of a Luna but he has improved his blocking skills tremendously. Newton has the protential to be an All State Running back while Luna would not get that notice.

Daniel and Luna was an great pair of players who clicked on the field like few before them. However, McElroy, Newton and the rest of the Dragon team are playing better as a team because nobody is a true "Superstar" or a POY canidate. That might change as the season progresses but if you look at the stats of the 2005 Dragons you will see a lot of players contributing with a lot of yards versis 2 or 3 players with all the yards.

The final reason that the 2005 team is better is because of the Defense! This year the Dragons have had 2 real shutouts and 1 virtual shutout (only score was on an intercepted pass that was run back for a TD). Not bad for any team. The offenses that Carroll has shut down have been good. Plano East was bad and was averaging only 20 points a game. Haltom was averaging 35 points a game and Denton Ryan averages over 38 points a game.

These are the observations of DraronFan and do not neccessaryly reflect the oponions of all the Dragon Nation! :D

[BigFoot]

Some of the stupid things said on this forum never cease to amaze me. DR not fast? Their DBs covered so well on most plays that McElroy had to sit in the pocket for much longer than normal and their defensive end also played wide reciever. To say that DR was a slow defense is absolute crap. Without a doubt they are one of the fastest defenses in the area. Carroll being classless? Trinity could afford to put the second and third team in early because they were playing Grand Prarie. The same Grand Prarie that hasn't won a game this year. Carroll was playing Denton Ryan for the district championship and it was critical they run the clock out, so it's logical they needed the first team in to keep moving the chains against a potentially dangerous team. DR had many personal fouls and played with zero class the entire game, two players were taken out, and yet someone just has to say Carroll was classless by playing the game. Seeing one game on TV does not make you a.) a football guru or b.)knowledgeable of anything whatsoever.

Trinity has played its second team in every game this year. In the GP game he cleared the bench. I don't think SLC had to leave so many starters in the game in the last quarter of the game. If DR had come storming back with 2 TD's SLC would still have won by 28 pts. And classless shirts were not in my comments, that is a parental problem not a football coach or team situation. All of these teams have young adults trying the very best they can and needless humiliation is just not necessary. The truth about the GP game is the fans quit cheering and they did everything not to score. Running up the middle is easy to stop when you do it everytime and yet the 3 and 4th teams scored. Last night SLC was not in danger of losing and yet many of the starters be they 1st or 2nd line starters they were starters. They had stars all over their helmets to prove it. Give some of your younger guys a chance to play. They practice everyday and support the team yet never step foot in the game even when it is a runaway. Just my thoughts on how it would make that young man feel to get to play a few downs on the way to glory. Not trying to cause a fight here, just an observation. SLC has proven they are a good team, may they could share the fun with those who don't get to play when they are dominating a game. GL to them.

[SLCDad]

I am a simple man. Could you please explain?OK. I'll explain again. I said they had tough games. That could mean that the opponent was good or that SLC played sub par. If you notice, I included Haltom as a tough game in 2004. Haltom was a poor team but scored 35 points on SLC.

[dragonfly]

Was talent and depth ever an issue with last years SLC team? Did they ever have a problem with the 2004 WR unit dropping lots of balls or running bad routes? Did Daniel have a problem with accuracy? That doesn't say much for the state of TX if the two time offensive POY had problems with accuracy at the QB position. I'll tell you what, if any of you don't think their is a huge difference between Newton and Luna then go talk to Coach Dodge. I'm sure he could elaborate on it a little better.

After reading most of your posts on this including this reply, you sure have a problem with drawing conclusions on things that were never said. I never said Daniel had a problem with accuracy. Hell, there weren't many issues at all with last year's offense. But can an offense improve from year to year? Sure they can. Can a quarterback who is not player of the year be better at something than the player of the year? Receiver depth was never an issue last year, but can having great receiver depth be an advantage? Sure. Remember that last year the "real" Jacobson (one who is confident, very fast, and never drops balls) didn't play most of the year including the playoffs. This year, the great McKay Jacobson is back, with Renfro (who has one more year of experience under his belt), Allen (with another year of experience), a very good physical possesion receiver in Smiter, and Fentress who is faster and I think better than Gedwed from last year. Position for position, each receiver is better than the player they replaced or just better from one more year of experience. By the end of the season you'll have a different opinion of Newton as compared to Luna.

[Fleeman93]

OK. I'll explain again. I said they had tough games. That could mean that the opponent was good or that SLC played sub par. If you notice, I included Haltom as a tough game in 2004. Haltom was a poor team but scored 35 points on SLC.

So I was supposed to interpet what your statement could have meant, and I did. I took it as last years scheduler being a little more difficult than this years.

[SLCDad]

The difference between 2004 and 2005 Dragon offenses is the manner in which all weopons are utilized. Last year it was very much a Daniel show with a Luna being a very good suporting cast along with a bunch of great recievers. Daniel had a tendency to look at one reciever and lock on him for the game. Look at the games last year and you will see 1 reciever a game had a "break out" type of game. Daniel was a running back that could throw a ball to a bunch of great recieveres who ran great routs and had many, many reps on the patterns.

McElroy is a better passer who gets everyone in the game and gets the ball to a unbelievable number of players through the course of the game. McElroy only runs when necessary or when the Defense gives him the run.

Luna was an offensive guard who could run and catch. He was fast and took advantage of what the defense gave him. You will never find a tougher runner than Luna. He and Chase played great together because the have played a lot of games together.

Newton is a running back. He can break a play from anywhere on the field. Once is through the line or gets outside he can run away from people and make people miss. He has not shown the toughness of a Luna but he has improved his blocking skills tremendously. Newton has the protential to be an All State Running back while Luna would not get that notice.

Daniel and Luna was an great pair of players who clicked on the field like few before them. However, McElroy, Newton and the rest of the Dragon team are playing better as a team because nobody is a true "Superstar" or a POY canidate. That might change as the season progresses but if you look at the stats of the 2005 Dragons you will see a lot of players contributing with a lot of yards versis 2 or 3 players with all the yards.

The final reason that the 2005 team is better is because of the Defense! This year the Dragons have had 2 real shutouts and 1 virtual shutout (only score was on an intercepted pass that was run back for a TD). Not bad for any team. The offenses that Carroll has shut down have been good. Plano East was bad and was averaging only 20 points a game. Haltom was averaging 35 points a game and Denton Ryan averages over 38 points a game.

These are the observations of DraronFan and do not neccessaryly reflect the oponions of all the Dragon Nation! :DI think you nailed it. People who only saw last night's game wouldn't know much about what you wrote.

I would add one comment. Tre Newton is the 3rd fastest player on the team behind Jacobson and Renfrow (both have been to state on the track).

[dragonfly]

The difference between 2004 and 2005 Dragon offenses is the manner in which all weopons are utilized. Last year it was very much a Daniel show with a Luna being a very good suporting cast along with a bunch of great recievers.:D



I couldn't agree more. Perfectly stated!

[SLCDad]

So I was supposed to interpet what your statement could have meant, and I did. I took it as last years scheduler being a little more difficult than this years.Nope. You weren't supposed to do anything. Like I said, the strength of schedule stuff was 100% your doing.

[dragonsdaddy]

Trinity has played its second team in every game this year. In the GP game he cleared the bench. I don't think SLC had to leave so many starters in the game in the last quarter of the game. If DR had come storming back with 2 TD's SLC would still have won by 28 pts. And classless shirts were not in my comments, that is a parental problem not a football coach or team situation. All of these teams have young adults trying the very best they can and needless humiliation is just not necessary. The truth about the GP game is the fans quit cheering and they did everything not to score. Running up the middle is easy to stop when you do it everytime and yet the 3 and 4th teams scored. Last night SLC was not in danger of losing and yet many of the starters be they 1st or 2nd line starters they were starters. They had stars all over their helmets to prove it. Give some of your younger guys a chance to play. They practice everyday and support the team yet never step foot in the game even when it is a runaway. Just my thoughts on how it would make that young man feel to get to play a few downs on the way to glory. Not trying to cause a fight here, just an observation. SLC has proven they are a good team, may they could share the fun with those who don't get to play when they are dominating a game. GL to them.
the stars are often received for team/defense or offense performance goals too. part of the reason you don't see lots of oline changes has to do with protecting your assets. we are very shallow though very talented at qb. no third team qb. we are also shallow at rb. with tre hurt late, matt is it. putting either of these positions unnecessarily in harms way isn't a great option. didn't really watch late, so i don't know who was in on defense, but i thought i heard some seconds being called by the announcers in the 4th.

[RyanRaiderDad]

...anyways... we did help beat ourselves...

[Fleeman93]

After reading most of your posts on this including this reply, you sure have a problem with drawing conclusions on things that were never said. I never said Daniel had a problem with accuracy. My point exactly. If Daniel had no problem with accuracy then how can McElroy be that much more accurate? Hell, there weren't many issues at all with last year's offense. But can an offense improve from year to year? Yes Sure they can. Can a quarterback who is not player of the year be better at something than the player of the year? Um ok, I guess Receiver depth was never an issue last year, but can having great receiver depth be an advantage? Yes, but if it wasn't a problem last year than how can it be better this year (see Daniel / McElroy accuracy point above)? Sure. Remember that last year the "real" Jacobson (one who is confident, very fast, and never drops balls) didn't play most of the year including the playoffs. This year, the great McKay Jacobson is back, with Renfro (who has one more year of experience under his belt), Allen (with another year of experience), a very good physical possesion receiver in Smiter, and Fentress who is faster and I think better than Gedwed from last year. Please don't make crazy statements like "one who is confident, very fast, and never drops balls" (he dropped one that hit him in the numbers last night). Position for position, each receiver is better than the player they replaced or just better from one more year of experience. I already gave my opinion that this year's receivers as a group are better than last. By the end of the season you'll have a different opinion of Newton as compared to Luna. So you are telling me that in one season your sophomore running back with one year of experience will be better than a three year starter in Luna at running the in the spread? Again, go talk to coach Dodge and let him explain to you which back is better and why.

I tried to answer in a way that would be less confusing.

[Fleeman93]

Nope. You weren't supposed to do anything. Like I said, the strength of schedule stuff was 100% your doing.

You said it could have meant one of two things without specifying which of the two actually meant. Without specifying which of the two you meant then that would leave it up to the reader, me in this case, to interpret what you meant. SLCDAD, which schedule is tougher between SLC 2004 through 7 games and SLC 2005 through 7 games?

[ALLIN]

We won state dude! Just because this and that was not a problem, does not mean that it cant be improved. It does not mean that it cant be better. I dont see a problem with winning a million dollars, but would I rather have 2 million, yes and is that an improvement, yes. You are really reaching right now to put the Dragons down, good luck with that.

[Favpack]

Dad - If you want to believe the level of teams that SLC has played to date this year equals last year - and that the difference is that McElroy is better than Daniel and Newton is better than Luna -- that's your perogative - I doubt many other Dragons hold that same sentiment.

[ALLIN]

No it is that our defense is better, we are scoring the same average just about, but holding them in check, so it looks much worse than last year.

[BigFoot]

SLCDad, yes he substituted part of the defense with 2 mins left. I understand protecting assets as keeping them out when they don't have to play. Getting hurt needlessly is not worth the sacrafice. Anyway, I said my piece. I wish your team all the best and all the other teams too. It is high school football and we all love our teams win or lose. I think HS football is way ahead of college and pro. It is a wonderful evening out for the family and I will continue to do it until I can't climb the stairs.

[dragonfly]

I tried to answer in a way that would be less confusing.

WOW! Let's try make this real simple. Daniel's accuracy was not a problem. Would TROY AIKMAN'S accuracy improve this offense? Is it possible that just becuase accuracy was not a "problem" and receiver depth was not a "problem" that those two areas of the game can be improved upon. If you don't think that McKay Jacobson is not a better receiver and has not contributed more in 6 games this year than he did in an entire season last year, I'm not going to waste my time with you. Your credibility on this issue will be completely gone with me. I take that back....it already is.

Fleeman's next response: "What! You think McElroy is as good as Troy Aikman!"

[ALLIN]

Amen Bigfoot!!!!!

[SLCDad]

Dad - If you want to believe the level of teams that SLC has played to date this year equals last year - and that the difference is that McElroy is better than Daniel and Newton is better than Luna -- that's your perogative - I doubt many other Dragons hold that same sentiment.Perhaps you should ask whats his name about the strength of schedule. He is the one making those comments.

I don't think a straight McElroy/Newton and Daniel/Luna comparison is correct or fair. They are different. They play differently. They are used differently. Each has strengths that the others don't have.

McElroy is more of a pro style QB. Newton is a better pure runner and has more speed than Luna. Daniel/Luna were a fabulous duo. They played together for years; they complemented each other.

The 2005 Dragon offense is statistically better than 2004 at this point of the season. More yards, more points and more balance. We'll see what happens the rest of the way.

If "SLC 2004 after 7 games" could play "SLC 2005 after 7 games" who do you think would win?

[SLCDad]

SLCDad, yes he substituted part of the defense with 2 mins left. I understand protecting assets as keeping them out when they don't have to play. Getting hurt needlessly is not worth the sacrafice. Anyway, I said my piece. I wish your team all the best and all the other teams too. It is high school football and we all love our teams win or lose. I think HS football is way ahead of college and pro. It is a wonderful evening out for the family and I will continue to do it until I can't climb the stairs.I think you have me confused with Dragonsdaddy. Thanks for the compliment.

[Fleeman93]

WOW! Let's try make this real simple. Daniel's accuracy was not a problem. Would TROY AIKMAN'S accuracy improve this offense? Is it possible that just becuase accuracy was not a "problem" and receiver depth was not a "problem" that those two areas of the game can be improved upon. If you don't think that McKay Jacobson is not a better receiver and has not contributed more in 6 games this year than he did in an entire season last year, I'm not going to waste my time with you. Your credibility on this issue will be completely gone with me. I take that back....it already is.

Fleeman's next response: "What! You think McElroy is as good as Troy Aikman!"

Typical, getting defensive about a mature adult conversation. I made an observation and gave reasons as to why I thought it were true. By the way, where did credibility come into this? My credibility has nothing to do with stating an opinion and supporting it with facts. If it will make you feel better then I will be more than happy to accept that you do not think I am a credible person.

[Fleeman93]

Perhaps you should ask whats his name about the strength of schedule. He is the one making those comments.

I don't think a straight McElroy/Newton and Daniel/Luna comparison is correct or fair. They are different. They play differently. They are used differently. Each has strengths that the others don't have.

McElroy is more of a pro style QB. Newton is a better pure runner and has more speed than Luna. Daniel/Luna were a fabulous duo. They played together for years; they complemented each other.

The 2005 Dragon offense is statistically better than 2004 at this point of the season. More yards, more points and more balance. We'll see what happens the rest of the way.

If "SLC 2004 after 7 games" could play "SLC 2005 after 7 games" who do you think would win?

I would say that it would be a pretty tight game but I would go with SLC 2004. I mean until someone beats them then they are #1. :)

[DragonFan]

Both offenses are simular but different with the deciding vote going on the Defense of 2005 being a lot better than 2004.

However, the untangible of playing for Charlie Stalculp would give the 2004 team an advantage to "get to Charlie Land". On paper I would say 2005 wins but on heart and motivation to achieve for the late defensive coordinator Charlie Stalculp then the 2004 team would find a way to win.

[dragonfly]

Typical, getting defensive about a mature adult conversation. I made an observation and gave reasons as to why I thought it were true. By the way, where did credibility come into this? My credibility has nothing to do with stating an opinion and supporting it with facts. If it will make you feel better then I will be more than happy to accept that you do not think I am a credible person.

I made a point. Is that all you have to say about it. "Typical, getting defensive"...blah blah blah. I'm questioning your ability to reason and your football credibility on this topic. Are you going to answer the point I made or is that it for you?

[Fleeman93]

I don't know what your question was but it must not have been worth answering. How do you know anything about my football credibility? If you want to ask your question again then I will make an effort to answer it for you since it is important to you.

[dragonfly]

I don't know what your question was but it must not have been worth answering. How do you know anything about my football credibility? If you want to ask your question again then I will make an effort to answer it for you since it is important to you.

Daniel's accuracy was not a problem. Would TROY AIKMAN'S accuracy improve this offense? Is it possible that just becuase accuracy was not a "problem" and receiver depth was not a "problem" that those two areas of the game can be improved upon. Don't you think that McKay Jacobson has contributed more in six games than he did all of last year combined?

[lonny23]

I didn't see the game, but I think DR got beat because SLC is better just like last year.

[rich_pack]

I can not believe these people say they are not impressed with SLC even with a shut-out game. Wake up people!!!! Who do they have to play to impress you, the freakin Indianapolis Colts?

[Red Raiders]

I am very impressed what Southlake Carroll has played last night when I watched some in 3rd Quarter and all in 4th Quarter. Denton Ryan actually really had a bad game and Southlake Carroll Defense was great last night but its not like what they normally do.

[Fleeman93]

Daniel's accuracy was not a problem. Would TROY AIKMAN'S accuracy improve this offense? Is it possible that just becuase accuracy was not a "problem" and receiver depth was not a "problem" that those two areas of the game can be improved upon. Don't you think that McKay Jacobson has contributed more in six games than he did all of last year combined?

I think the SLC QB's do a pretty damn good job hitting their targets. Don't know how much more accurate you can be. I would think that Aikman would be accurate more often than a HS QB, but I don't know how much more accurate you can get than hitting them in the hands. I would say that Jacobson has contributed a hell of a lot more this year than last year. Night and day! Hey, wasn't he injured most last year?

[Fleeman93]

I was also very impressed with SLC. They looked very sharp.

[southlake thug]

Yeah McKay had a broken leg and was out most of the year. Even when he was back it just didn't look like he was at full strength. He is deff. playing good this year though. I would rank him up there with some of the best in the state.

[dragons08]

i dont want to go and read this, but from what i read, (first couple pages), it seems that SLC is underrated, go ahead, think were nto as good, itd be awesome to "shock" some people and make another state championship run, heck lets have no more carroll threads, just let everyone "forget" us then bam when were doing great in the playoffs we'll start the threads back up and none of you that underrate us will say anything cause you'll hear the
"told you so" comments, so go ahead underrate us all you wnat, take that target off our back, heck you can have the giant target

[pack0808]

d08 i definitely was not saying that!!! I found this thread amusing!! :rolleyes:

[GoOwls]

In reference to this thread title, I've never seen a team beat themselves 41-0. However, I have seen teams almost lose a tight game to a lesser opponent and only win by 2 points late in the game and save face by avoiding a certainly disasterous loss. Of course, it wouldn't have made the players look bad, it however did save face for some overly zealous fans who count their chickens before they hatch. This post, of course, is not intended for any particular set of overly optimistic fans. I told you so. Listen to old men, we learned a few things by living so long. :D :D

[toonman]

In reference to this thread title, I've never seen a team beat themselves 41-0. However, I have seen teams almost lose a tight game to a lesser opponent and only win by 2 points late in the game and save face by avoiding a certainly disasterous loss. Of course, it wouldn't have made the players look bad, it however did save face for some overly zealous fans who count their chickens before they hatch. This post, of course, is not intended for any particular set of overly optimistic fans. I told you so. Listen to old men, we learned a few things by living so long. :D :D

A wise old Owl?

[RyanOline]

I'll give it to SLC. That was the first time I have ever been shutout. As far as the game goes, we did make stupid mistakes but thats no excuse. SLC is a machine. They have an excellent team. I hope they go D2 though. Call me stupid but I want another shot. It's my senior year and I want every chance I can get to play great teams. One thing did bother me though. 6 minutes left and up 41-0 and you still have 9 out of 11 defensive starters in. Also 8 of the 11 offensive starters in. Kind of loss my respect as far as having tons of class. I will say that SLC is a great team. Adam Powers is a great DT by the way. Good luck SLC.