Carroll new nation's number 1

[myround0]

Just read the thread play-by-play on the Mission Viejo (MV) vs. De LaSalle game...would be surprise if carroll is not the number one team come next week...MV had its hand full...I think Carroll will move up, I also think Longview, after it's national game will move to the number 2 team in the nation. I also think you will see Euless Trinity in the prep nation polls I think they will come in really high about 14 or better. I think MV will take a hit, yes they played well and DLS might have a really good team. From what I heard Longview has played against much better opponents that either MV and DLS, in the form of West Monroe, and Marshall, who both have went on to beat every team they have played since facing the Lobos. Those two team have to give strength to the Lobos, this is why I think the Lobos will make a huge rise in the polls, also, Evangel Christian Academy (ECA) crushed someone Friday night, I think Springdale will be lifted a spot or two for that, but Longview having played ECA and beat them more soundly than Springdale, coupled with Marshall and West Monroe continuing to win...I would not be surprise to see Texas in the TOP TWO SPOTS and it would be a huge treat if they both went division 2, I KNOW THAT GAME WOULD BE NATIONALLY TELEVISED IF THEY MADE IT FAR ENOUGH IN THE PLAYOFFS...

[rich_pack]

ECA, please, their are alot more teams better than ECA, that has been proven 3 or 4 times this year. I think Lufkin should move up as well, They had their 30 points in 8 minutes Friday and had their second string in the second quarter "if we are going by performance". Its not like Lufkin , SLC played good teams.

[dragonfootballfan]

ECA, please, their are alot more teams better than ECA, that has been proven 3 or 4 times this year. I think Lufkin should move up as well, They had their 30 points in 8 minutes Friday and had their second string in the second quarter "if we are going by performance". Its not like Lufkin , SLC played good teams.
the teams they have played are just as good as the teams that Longview has played. The "hard teams" Longview has played are two Louisiana teams after the hurricane, a 4A team and a team that was without 4 starters including their starting quarterback. I fail to see where the challenge that Longview has had that Carroll or Lufkin has not faced

[myround0]

ECA, please, their are alot more teams better than ECA, that has been proven 3 or 4 times this year. I think Lufkin should move up as well, They had their 30 points in 8 minutes Friday and had their second string in the second quarter "if we are going by performance". Its not like Lufkin , SLC played good teams.

SLC is currently ranked number two... I agree Carroll and lufkin each have played and beaten teams who aren't playing well...But carroll was ranked Number two in the nation and from what I read on the Mission Viejo De LaSalle thread, those two team are good but that is it...I would move Carroll up because they were number Two to one and Move Longview up because they Have beanten programs who continue to win...West Monroe and Marshall but have one loss and to further add strenght to the Lobos, Marshall be Kilgore, I would not be surprised to see Longview number two. I think trinity breaks into prep nations poll and it would be really nice if they brought lufkin in as well...but Carroll I think will be the new number one team. Springdale beat Evagel 35-7 and Longview beat them 52-14, in one hlaf of work from the Lobo offensive starters...forget about the Lobos, the real point i am trying to make from what I read is the subject line...I think Carroll will be the new nation's number one ranked team.

[dragonfootballfan]

SLC is currently ranked number two... I agree Carroll and lufkin each have played and beaten teams who aren't playing well...But carroll was ranked Number two in the nation and from what I read on the Mission Viejo De LaSalle thread, those two team are good but that is it...I would move Carroll up because they were number Two to one and Move Longview up because they Have beanten programs who continue to win...West Monroe and Marshall but have one loss and to further add strenght to the Lobos, Marshall be Kilgore, I would not be surprised to see Longview number two. I think trinity breaks into prep nations poll and it would be really nice if they brought lufkin in as well...but Carroll I think will be the new number one team. Springdale beat Evagel 35-7 and Longview beat them 52-14, in one hlaf of work from the Lobo offensive starters...forget about the Lobos, the real point i am trying to make from what I read is the subject line...I think Carroll will be the new nation's number one ranked team.
I am not so sure about Carroll being number 1. Last year Carroll did not drop from the numebr one spot after many close calls with Abilene, Lufkin, and Smithson Valley. I think that if Mission Viejo slips up some more then maybe they will move to the top spot. Carroll's performance against a then 4-1 Haltom team will definitely help in gettting the elusive number one spot. I think that Carroll has a better chance of jumping Mission Viejo into the number two spot in the USA Today poll. Jumping to number one is hard without the number one team losing. Longview should break into the USA today poll this week as well. Texas is loaded with talented teams this year and imo there should be 5 teams ranked in this order Carroll, Westfield, Euless Trinity, Longview, and Lufkin. This is ranked by how good the teams look to the pollsters not how good I think each team is.

[LoboFan07]

Evangel Christian Academy (ECA) crushed someone Friday night..

ECA only plays 1A schools..if they dont crush everyone then something REALLY bad happened.

[drgnbkr]

IMO..Carroll would trade a perpetual #1 National ranking for a 6th state title! The national polls are crap when so few of the teams actually play each other...

[dragonfootballfan]

IMO..Carroll would trade a perpetual #1 National ranking for a 6th state title! The national polls are crap when so few of the teams actually play each other...
I dissagree, but maybe that is because I look at national polls different than most. I look at the national champion as being the team that has accomplished the most or had the most impressive season. I do not look at it like this team should be ranked ahead of this team because they are better than them. I look at it like their run is something that has never been done before or when an exceptional achievement needs to be recognized.

[LoboFan07]

Wow...and you're going to say you're National Champs how?

Have you played every team below you?

I much rather have a State Championship than a Fake National Title.

[dragonfootballfan]

Wow...and you're going to say you're National Champs how?

Have you played every team below you?

I much rather have a State Championship than a Fake National Title.
I dissagreed with the point where he said that all national polls are crap. I would much rather have a state title than a national title. I am sorry that I did not make that clear

[RockinL]

the teams they have played are just as good as the teams that Longview has played. The "hard teams" Longview has played are two Louisiana teams after the hurricane, a 4A team and a team that was without 4 starters including their starting quarterback. I fail to see where the challenge that Longview has had that Carroll or Lufkin has not faced
Those 2 Louisiana teams are in north La. not affected by the hurricane and that 4A team hasnt lost another game.. Dang some people grasp at tooo many straws.

[VB Pack Fan]

I agree with Lobo, I would rather win a state champoinship than have a No. 1 ranking in the nation, because to me that means nothing but bragging rights.How do you know who has the best team in the nation.....just because of wins...........naw

[sltnusmc]

IMO..Carroll would trade a perpetual #1 National ranking for a 6th state title! The national polls are crap when so few of the teams actually play each other...
Did you see that ring that said SLC National Champions ???

[drgnbkr]

Did you see that ring that said SLC National Champions ???

Of course I've seen the rings..Carroll players have been wearing them for years...the State part means more..this is Texas my friend..home of the best high school football in the country...

[Redneckn]

ECA only plays 1A schools..if they dont crush everyone then something REALLY bad happened.

I couldnt agree more. They started running the clock in the 2nd at the ECA game friday nite. The freshman team was in before the half.. It was still 61-0.


As for the rest of it.. I thought the polls were crap? Why would anybody really care? I'm a bit surprised to see any Longview people worried about what a poll says. When pretty much nobody respects Longview anyway, why would anyone think a poll would be different?
Longview is like the Rodney Dangerfield of Tx HS football. :)

[dragonfootballfan]

Those 2 Louisiana teams are in north La. not affected by the hurricane and that 4A team hasnt lost another game.. Dang some people grasp at tooo many straws.
oh so the hurricane didn't affect north La. at all? That is hard to buy. The hurricane affected the entire state of La. It still was a 4A team. When Carroll was playing good 4A teams in their first years in 5A everyone was discounting those wins. How come that is not valid now?

[LoboFan07]

Longview vs Marshall has always been an intense game...The past few years the Mavericks been out of it but are finally beginning to pick up their end of it now. They're 5-1 only losing to Longview.

There is no question in my mind if they would make the playoffs in 12-5A. They beat Kilgore...who handed 12-5A John Tyler it's only loss. Marshall would make the playoffs in 5A this season.

[Redneckn]

It's different when it's Longview. :p

[dragonfootballfan]

Longview vs Marshall has always been an intense game...The past few years the Mavericks been out of it but are finally beginning to pick up their end of it now. They're 5-1 only losing to Longview.

There is no question in my mind if they would make the playoffs in 12-5A. They beat Kilgore...who handed 12-5A John Tyler it's only loss. Marshall would make the playoffs in 5A this season.
so you are giving more credit because it is a rivalry game? Carroll, in district, plays a rival every week except for Richland. They also played Coppell early in the season which is considered by some to be Carroll's biggest rival. Should more credit be given for every district win for Carroll? The Heritage team they played came in 4-0 with a quarterback headed to Florida State. Haltom was 4-1 and was smoked 69-7. Midland Lee is a product of their schedule and will probably be a playoff team in 3-5A. I still have not seen how Longview's schedule is that much harder than anyone elses.

[drgnbkr]

so you are giving more credit because it is a rivalry game? Carroll, in district, plays a rival every week except for Richland. They also played Coppell early in the season which is considered by some to be Carroll's biggest rival. Should more credit be given for every district win for Carroll? The Heritage team they played came in 4-0 with a quarterback headed to Florida State. Haltom was 4-1 and was smoked 69-7. Midland Lee is a product of their schedule and will probably be a playoff team in 3-5A. I still have not seen how Longview's schedule is that much harder than anyone elses.

It's not...they just have to beat Lufkin to get the respect they are looking for and they are frustrated

[LoboFan07]

Im not saying it should be given more credit for being a rivalry game at all.

They're 4A but could beat half of the 5A teams.

EVen you guys struggled in your first game of the season mostly due to heat. As did we. We had a few players get hurt during the 2nd quarter DUE to the heat.

But we still won 28-16 at Marshall so whatever I dont care how much we won by, we still won againist a 5-1 team. We still beat another 5-1 team, who will likely win State.

[myround0]

so you are giving more credit because it is a rivalry game? Carroll, in district, plays a rival every week except for Richland. They also played Coppell early in the season which is considered by some to be Carroll's biggest rival. Should more credit be given for every district win for Carroll? The Heritage team they played came in 4-0 with a quarterback headed to Florida State. Haltom was 4-1 and was smoked 69-7. Midland Lee is a product of their schedule and will probably be a playoff team in 3-5A. I still have not seen how Longview's schedule is that much harder than anyone elses.

have you looked at the strenght of the teams Carroll has played...i will get their strenghts and post them for you. every team Carroll has played...I will tell you their strenghts aren't good at all... although any given Friday...

[dragons08]

have you looked at the strenght of the teams Carroll has played...i will get their strenghts and post them for you. every team Carroll has played...I will tell you their strenghts aren't good at all... although any given Friday...
well, consdering all the games have been blowouts, were taking care of buisness

[LoboFan07]

well, consdering all the games have been blowouts, were taking care of buisness

Sounds familiar

[BAMF cowboy]

yeah. we've really had to pay the price in the playoffs for weak district games the past 4 years...

[dragonfootballfan]

yeah. we've really had to pay the price in the playoffs for weak district games the past 4 years...
I am so amazed also at the amount of success Longview has had with their "strong" schedule too. I mean look at all the championships they have won in the past 50 years

[dragons08]

yeah. we've really had to pay the price in the playoffs for weak district games the past 4 years...
ya think? man, you think people would run out of ways to crituque us...but theres something they'll find..

[BAMF cowboy]

i could see the problem if we were losing in early rounds of the playoffs to average teams. but then again, if that was the case, no one would really care and wouldn't waste their time discussing these things

[dragonfootballfan]

ya think? man, you think people would run out of ways to crituque us...but theres something they'll find..
The funny thing is that they get mad at Carroll for supposedly running up the score and then say the teams they play aren't any good. What is Carroll supposed to do?

[dragonfootballfan]

i could see the problem if we were losing in early rounds of the playoffs to average teams. but then again, if that was the case, no one would really care and wouldn't waste their time discussing these things
yet some people who have lost by the third round the last few years still try to put down a team that has played 16 games a year for 3 years. hmmm

[dragons08]

The funny thing is that they get mad at Carroll for supposedly running up the score and then say the teams they play aren't any good. What is Carroll supposed to do?
starters are out pretty early halftime-early 3rd, and if we still score on you with our backups vs your first string, whos problem is that? we cant tell riley not to score!

[dragonfootballfan]

starters are out pretty early halftime-early 3rd, and if we still score on you with our backups vs your first string, whos problem is that? we cant tell riley not to score!
actually Mcelroy was still in the fourth quarter of most of the games this year.

[dragons08]

actually Mcelroy was still in the fourth quarter of most of the games this year.
but the last couple games hes been comingo ut early, in the begining of the year, it was to "warm him up" imo, first year starter, just needed to get him some playing time, he came out in the 3rd agaisnt haltom i recall and late 3rd early 4th against CHHS right?

[spad1]

We watched McElroy play less than 3 qtrs in first 3 games; little more than 3 qtrs in 4th; 3 qtrs in 5th, and a half in 6th. Time played also includes the 3rd series bit granted the backup QB. Don't see how SLC can be faulted for running up scores. In all Mac has not played approximately a game and a half of the 6 games played. Last year QB played just about every minute of every game. Even during blowouts, except for Richland game. What was up with that? Saving Mac for the playoffs? Not a bad idea. SLC will be there....

[JoeC]

Ok, stop bashing Longview . . . especially if you've never played us. I dare say we've got a pretty good program here and we're not afraid to play anyone. Admittedly we've had a bit of bad luck in the name of Plano (several major playoff tilts), John Tyler (Earl Campbell), Odessa Permian (60 plus yard field goal), Katy (97 State Championship) and now Lukfin (Reggie McNeal and Javorsky Lane). But we're old school . . . we've been good for a long time. We were good back in the seventies, eighties, etc . . . we have a long history of goodness. It's greatness that eludes us. By the way, we're trying something different this year. In the past this tough schedule thing has really hurt us injury wise. This year we have elected to get our starters out as soon as possible or at least play some conservative ball in the second half; hopefully, this will minimize our injuries. Last year injuries took a major toll - losing our starting quarterback, tight end (torn ACLs) and a crushing blow to our starting full back (broken hand). This year, we've managed to stay relatively healthy although we lost two of our starting linebackers against West Monroe. Good news, our middle linebacker is expected back in two weeks and he's good. What am I saying? Simple, playing a tough schedule is a double-edged sword. It's great as long as you can stay healthy. Now regarding the other subject, there are some very good teams in Louisiana and there are some very good 4A teams in Texas too. SLC and Denton Ryan should be enough proof as to the latter. And for those that have chose to forget, Marshall was a 5A team just a few years back and have a 5A State title of their own. Just as Longview could do more to prove themselves, so could SLC by venturing into East Texas instead of West Texas. Truthfully, most Texas teams avoid scheduling East Texas teams. As a matter of fact, East Texas teams have a strong track record against the rest of the state. All I have to say is come on down and play us on a regular basis and see how it impacts the rest of your season. Beware, the Odessa Permian's, Midland Lee's and other so-called great teams have ventured into the piney woods of East Texas only to leave with their tails tucked between their legs, licking their wounds.

[dragonfootballfan]

Ok, stop bashing Longview . . . especially if you've never played us. I dare say we've got a pretty good program here and we're not afraid to play anyone. Admittedly we've had a bit of bad luck in the name of Plano (several major playoff tilts), John Tyler (Earl Campbell), Odessa Permian (60 plus yard field goal), Katy (97 State Championship) and now Lukfin (Reggie McNeal and Javorsky Lane). But we're old school . . . we've been good for a long time. We were good back in the seventies, eighties, etc . . . we have a long history of goodness. It's greatness that eludes us. By the way, we're trying something different this year. In the past this tough schedule thing has really hurt us injury wise. This year we have elected to get our starters out as soon as possible or at least play some conservative ball in the second half; hopefully, this will minimize our injuries. Last year injuries took a major toll - losing our starting quarterback, tight end (torn ACLs) and a crushing blow to our starting full back (broken hand). This year, we've managed to stay relatively healthy although we lost two of our starting linebackers against West Monroe. Good news, our middle linebacker is expected back in two weeks and he's good. What am I saying? Simple, playing a tough schedule is a double-edged sword. It's great as long as you can stay healthy. Now regarding the other subject, there are some very good teams in Louisiana and there are some very good 4A teams in Texas too. SLC and Denton Ryan should be enough proof as to the latter. And for those that have chose to forget, Marshall was a 5A team just a few years back and have a 5A State title of their own. Just as Longview could do more to prove themselves, so could SLC by venturing into East Texas instead of West Texas. Truthfully, most Texas teams avoid scheduling East Texas teams. As a matter of fact, East Texas teams have a strong track record against the rest of the state. All I have to say is come on down and play us on a regular basis and see how it impacts the rest of your season. Beware, the Odessa Permian's, Midland Lee's and other so-called great teams have ventured into the piney woods of East Texas only to leave with their tails tucked between their legs, licking their wounds.
win something then call someone out. Don't make an excuse filled post and then call out teams that have had more success than anything that you have put on the field in the last 68 years.

[JoeC]

You're absolutely right . . . when I go to bed tonight I'll add this to my prayer "Lord please let us play Southlake Carroll, pleeease!!!!!!!!!!!"

[green wave]

yes we have to beat lufkin to get the respect we deserve which i think will happen if we meet them in the playoffs this year.anything can happen in the playoffs we could lose or they could lose before we get to that point. slc is a very good football team but nobody is unbeatable and slc does belong at the top until someone beats them.so what happens if longview manges towin the div2 title and slc wins the div1 title then we sit here and argue over who's the best state champion. all this longview and slc stuff is getting old

[dragonsdaddy]

let's both hope for the reasons to have that arguement. i'm all for it.

[oldmanwoodlandsfan]

I hope Katy ad SLC meet again at State, with the way they both have been playing I think it would make for a heckuva game.

[BigArab]

win something then call someone out. Don't make an excuse filled post and then call out teams that have had more success than anything that you have put on the field in the last 68 years.

If you want to start some silly argument like that...have a former Dragon in the Pro Bowl and then come talk.

Wahh Wahh Wahh, is all I hear from both sides.

Guys...Week 9 right now...deal with it.

[dragonsdaddy]

If you want to start some silly argument like that...have a former Dragon in the Pro Bowl and then come talk.

Wahh Wahh Wahh, is all I hear from both sides.

Guys...Week 9 right now...deal with it.
now that's a great argument for the hs status. slc hasn't needed to prove anything since stepping onto the podium in 02. only kt has a great right to talk about their dominance over slc. i'm thinking a lview supporter is just flapping his gums to hear himself talk.

[BigArab]

now that's a great argument for the hs status. slc hasn't needed to prove anything since stepping onto the podium in 02. only kt has a great right to talk about their dominance over slc. i'm thinking a lview supporter is just flapping his gums to hear himself talk.

Call it what you will. I'm just sick of hearing silly arguments like "WELL! Until you win state, you don't get to join our members only club!"

Grow up.

People who haven't won state (or haven't won in a long time) win one every year it seems like. Get a new argument.

[myround0]

Has anyone Looked at the cal-prep and clicked on California and seen where Mission Viejo ranks in the state of california and look at the record of the teams the have beaten 9-17 versuses other teams...and this is the team ranked number one in the nation yet in their own state they are ranked 9 and the teams they have played. MV has played one team ranked inside the top 1000 and four teams inside the top 7000. what gets me the most is they are beating teams with a combined 9-17 record and they are ranked number 1 in the nation...wow, they are lucky to be ranked with opponents posting a win/lose record like that.

[dragonfootballfan]

If you want to start some silly argument like that...have a former Dragon in the Pro Bowl and then come talk.

Wahh Wahh Wahh, is all I hear from both sides.

Guys...Week 9 right now...deal with it.
the guy listed a bunch of excuses why longview has not won state over the past few years and then named a bunch a teams that did win state and said that Longview was better. I did not understand that logic at all. What does having a pro bowler have to do with winning state? All it shows me is that even though you had a pro bowler you couldn't win state.

[myround0]

I am so amazed also at the amount of success Longview has had with their "strong" schedule too. I mean look at all the championships they have won in the past 50 years

won a championship when Southlake was a dirt spot on the way to Wichita Falls...1937 and proud of it, some teams haven't won a single title...time to add to the hardware, my bad playoff 30 times, only five other 5A teams have been more...

[dragonfootballfan]

won a championship when Southlake was a dirt spot on the way to Wichita Falls...1937 and proud of it, some teams haven't won a single title...time to add to the hardware, my bad playoff 30 times, only five other 5A teams have been more...
good for Longview. Great success. I would rather be winning now, but that is only my preference. Playoff trips to me are not as good as winning championships. You can be proud of all that you have, but you don't need to post a bunch of excuses why you have not won a 5A title and then call out 5A teams that have won.

[JoeC]

Personally, I don't think it is a silly argument. I believe its a valid argument. Teams in East Texas hardly ever get any playoff games in the friendly confines of East Texas, especially at the 5A Level. Why? Some say that there aren't any stadiums in East Texas big enough . . . that's a bunch of crap!! At the State Championship level maybe, but why Houston or San Antonio? Truthfully, I don't believe anyone wants to schedule a game in East Texas. We always end up in either San Antonio, Houston, Waco or the Dallas area. How would the rest of the state feel about playoff games in East Texas? Again, I think that it's something that need to be addressed. It puts us at a great disadvantage. Let's not forget these are children and as we all know that a major factor in football [especially at the high school level] is psychological. Look at the extra travel forced on East Texas kids; and yet, we managed to have a state contender in every category but 1A in 2004.

Tyler Lee - 5A Div. 1 State Champs
Marshall -4A Div. 1 State Finalist
Kilgore -4A Div. 2 State Champ
Gilmer - 3A State Champs
Troup - 2A State Finalist

Obviously this speaks volumes for East Texas football. When you add the accomplishments of John Tyler, Longview, Lufkin, Texas High, Tatum and Daingerfield, it becomes crystal clear . . . . it's time for more playoff games in East Texas. I think we have proved ourselves worthy! I vote for Tyler's Rose Stadium and SFA University in Nacogdoches. By the way, were you alluding to Bobby Taylor former Philadelphia Eagle and Pro Bowler from Longview (Lobos)?

[myround0]

good for Longview. Great success. I would rather be winning now, but that is only my preference. Playoff trips to me are not as good as winning championships. You can be proud of all that you have, but you don't need to post a bunch of excuses why you have not won a 5A title and then call out 5A teams that have won.

every team would rather win now...however, everyone can't win NOW...only two state titles to hand out, not 200...those were not excuses, they were facts...you guys have been in the 5A ranks for three years and have enjoyed major success, but, like George Washington, there were many others before you, your title is not the only ones the state of texas has handed out...be proud of what you have but don't spit on the success others have enjoyed...long before Carroll, Longview had a title...

[dragonsdaddy]

i thought bobby taylor was from grand prairie. wasn't there a wr from gp who played for the redskins in the 60's? nacodoches would certainly be acceptible, but not as a neutral site like waco or college sta or houston. rose too would be ok and has been used on occasions. coaches select game sites for a variety of reasons. talk to yours and voice your concerns.

[dragonfootballfan]

Personally, I don't think it is a silly argument. I believe its a valid argument. Teams in East Texas hardly ever get any playoff games in the friendly confines of East Texas, especially at the 5A Level. Why? Some say that there aren't any stadiums in East Texas big enough . . . that's a bunch of crap!! At the State Championship level maybe, but why Houston or San Antonio? Truthfully, I don't believe anyone wants to schedule a game in East Texas. We always end up in either San Antonio, Houston, Waco or the Dallas area. How would the rest of the state feel about playoff games in East Texas? Again, I think that it's something that need to be addressed. It puts us at a great disadvantage. Let's not forget these are children and as we all know that a major factor in football [especially at the high school level] is psychological. Look at the extra travel forced on East Texas kids; and yet, we managed to have a state contender in every category but 1A in 2004.

Tyler Lee - 5A Div. 1 State Champs
Marshall -4A Div. 1 State Finalist
Kilgore -4A Div. 2 State Champ
Gilmer - 3A State Champs
Troup - 2A State Finalist

Obviously this speaks volumes for East Texas football. When you add the accomplishments of John Tyler, Longview, Lufkin, Texas High, Tatum and Daingerfield, it becomes crystal clear . . . . it's time for more playoff games in East Texas. I think we have proved ourselves worthy! I vote for Tyler's Rose Stadium and SFA University in Nacogdoches. By the way, were you alluding to Bobby Taylor former Philadelphia Eagle and Pro Bowler from Longview (Lobos)?
I have a feeling that not too many east texas coaches would put up their stadium against dragon stadium for a home and home flip. Plus in other threads I have heard Longview fans saying that the DMN should cover them because they are in DFW, but now they say they are in east texas. Which is it?

[dragonfootballfan]

every team would rather win now...however, everyone can't win NOW...only two state titles to hand out, not 200...those were not excuses, they were facts...you guys have been in the 5A ranks for three years and have enjoyed major success, but, like George Washington, there were many others before you, your title is not the only ones the state of texas has handed out...be proud of what you have but don't spit on the success others have enjoyed...long before Carroll, Longview had a title...
Look listing injuries and partying are excuses and some of them are facts, but none the less they were all excuses. I am not spitting on someone elses success. Longview has a pretty good football program, but it is not as good as some Longview supporters make it out to be

[dragonsdaddy]

i was thinking of charlie taylor. i met him when i worked at the plymouth park (irving) car wash in 1970. he was quite the big shot in those parts.

[JoeC]

I have a feeling that not too many east texas coaches would put up their stadium against dragon stadium for a home and home flip. Plus in other threads I have heard Longview fans saying that the DMN should cover them because they are in DFW, but now they say they are in east texas. Which is it?

Come on now . . . I know you know better. If we played SLC at Texas Stadium we'd have to travel approximately 132 miles . . . how far would SLC have to travel? Another example, we played Katy for the 1997 state title at the Astrodome. We had to travel some 219 miles while Katy traveled less than 30 miles. Didn't Tyler Lee travel to San Antonio last year (?); fortunately, they were much better than their opponent. Contrary to what you may be willing to acknowledge, it does make a difference. During Midland Lee's hey day they went to West Monroe and got blasted and when West Monroe went to Midland, well . . . vice versa.

[dragonsdaddy]

west monroe cancelled out of the trip to midland if i remember correctly, as i so infrequently do. again, talk to the ad's and coaches who make those decisions. everyone is looking for the best deal they can get, every week.

[nate]

Come on now . . . I know you know better...Another example, we played Katy for the 1997 state title at the Astrodome. We had to travel some 219 miles while Katy traveled less than 30 miles.

Please tell me that you blame the drive for losing the '97 title game. That's just hilarious. It must have had nothing to do with the fact that Katy was better at every element of the game.

[JoeC]

Please tell me that you blame the drive for losing the '97 title game. That's just hilarious. It must have had nothing to do with the fact that Katy was better at every element of the game.

You know what, I was going to make a comment . . . and then I realized that it didn't deserve one.

[JoeC]

west monroe cancelled out of the trip to midland if i remember correctly, as i so infrequently do. again, talk to the ad's and coaches who make those decisions. everyone is looking for the best deal they can get, every week.

You know you may be right. I do recall John Tyler going to West Monroe and getting blasted and when West Monroe came to JT, well . . . they got blasted.

[green wave]

i was at the state game in 97 and the drive had nothing to do with it we was stop katy shutdown or best weapon in fred talley. then they scored right before half on a big catch in the corner of the endzone where the receiver dove and caught the ball that score and the katy defense is what took us out of the game not the drive down there.that game hurt i remember watching the players walk over to there parents in the stands crying knowing that the perfect season was all for nothing.

[svrangerfan]

Big fat hairy deal. It means nothing nada zip. If SLC was the #1 team in the country last year then Smithson Valley would have to be number 2 after the game we gave them in the Texas Bowl. There is a team out there somewhere who could make SLC their beeatch the question is will they play that team?? Probably not.

[c-lisle]

Look listing injuries and partying are excuses and some of them are facts, but none the less they were all excuses. I am not spitting on someone elses success. Longview has a pretty good football program, but it is not as good as some Longview supporters make it out to be


Yea and SLC has only been 5a for 3 or 4 years. You have had ultimate success during that time but lets wait and see where SLC is in 5-10 years. You are disrespecting a very good program(not just pretty good). We have been playing 5a for over 100+ years and have been playing some of the best competition for many years from right here in east texas. We have one of the best programs in this state...and people form outside of Lview will tell you that. Maybe Lview can change your mind if we happen to cross paths this year.

[green wave]

we are a very good football team but so is slc and to come in and play at the level they have in such a short time says alot about their program.most teams move up to 5a and struggle the first few years and as for playing 5a ball for 100+ years 5a was only started back in the 70 or 80s until then 4a was the highest level

[drgnbkr]

Yea and SLC has only been 5a for 3 or 4 years. You have had ultimate success during that time but lets wait and see where SLC is in 5-10 years. You are disrespecting a very good program(not just pretty good). We have been playing 5a for over 100+ years and have been playing some of the best competition for many years from right here in east texas. We have one of the best programs in this state...and people form outside of Lview will tell you that. Maybe Lview can change your mind if we happen to cross paths this year.


I believe 5-A started in the 80's? Maybe the 70's...Anyway, when you beat Lufkin..get back to us....

[JoeC]

i was at the state game in 97 and the drive had nothing to do with it we was stop katy shutdown or best weapon in fred talley. then they scored right before half on a big catch in the corner of the endzone where the receiver dove and caught the ball that score and the katy defense is what took us out of the game not the drive down there.that game hurt i remember watching the players walk over to there parents in the stands crying knowing that the perfect season was all for nothing.

I was there also . . . and you can't tell me that Longview didn't look sluggish. I can't totally put my finger on the reason - it would be only speculation. But at the same time, you can't convince me that that was the same team that beat Lufkin, John Tyler, Plano East, Duncanville and Killeen Ellison. Although it will not change a thing, I can't help but wonder the outcome of the same game played at Texas Stadium. And by the way, are you kidding when you say that Fred Talley was our best weapon. Have you forgotten how loaded that team was? No, something was wrong, but you may be right . . . it may not have been the travel. Although I do believe it was a factor, maybe not the overriding factor, but a factor nonetheless. But one thing for sure . . . that day. . . the Lobos was not the same team. It may have been coaching, or it may have been mental preparation; but clearly, the team I watched was not the same team that I had watched dismantle teams all season long. And for all of those people out there who unrealistically think that these kids can continue to play their best under such pressing conditions - I have news for you. These are children. At some point of time they will play their best and win, there will also be times when they will play poorly and still manage to win, and there will also be a time when they just don't play well enough and lose . . . for what ever reason. Stick around long enough and you'll see it happen too and then, just maybe, it won't be so hilarious. Can you imagine the psychological pressure that SLC children are under? Nobody wins forever . . . I mean nobody!!

[drgnbkr]

Carroll lost 1 in 03 by a point to Katy...that will last them for a while.... ;)

[dragonfootballfan]

Come on now . . . I know you know better. If we played SLC at Texas Stadium we'd have to travel approximately 132 miles . . . how far would SLC have to travel? Another example, we played Katy for the 1997 state title at the Astrodome. We had to travel some 219 miles while Katy traveled less than 30 miles. Didn't Tyler Lee travel to San Antonio last year (?); fortunately, they were much better than their opponent. Contrary to what you may be willing to acknowledge, it does make a difference. During Midland Lee's hey day they went to West Monroe and got blasted and when West Monroe went to Midland, well . . . vice versa.
Either you flip for a home and home or the coaches agree on a neutral site. If the game were at Texas Stadium either SLC's coach won the flip and chose that, Longview chose Texas Stadium, or that was both agreed upon by the coaches.

[dragonfootballfan]

I was there also . . . and you can't tell me that Longview didn't look sluggish. I can't totally put my finger on the reason - it would be only speculation. But at the same time, you can't convince me that that was the same team that beat Lufkin, John Tyler, Plano East, Duncanville and Killeen Ellison. Although it will not change a thing, I can't help but wonder the outcome of the same game played at Texas Stadium. And by the way, are you kidding when you say that Fred Talley was our best weapon. Have you forgotten how loaded that team was? No, something was wrong, but you may be right . . . it may not have been the travel. Although I do believe it was a factor, maybe not the overriding factor, but a factor nonetheless. But one thing for sure . . . that day. . . the Lobos was not the same team. It may have been coaching, or it may have been mental preparation; but clearly, the team I watched was not the same team that I had watched dismantle teams all season long. And for all of those people out there who unrealistically think that these kids can continue to play their best under such pressing conditions - I have news for you. These are children. At some point of time they will play their best and win, there will also be times when they will play poorly and still manage to win, and there will also be a time when they just don't play well enough and lose . . . for what ever reason. Stick around long enough and you'll see it happen too and then, just maybe, it won't be so hilarious. Can you imagine the psychological pressure that SLC children are under? Nobody wins forever . . . I mean nobody!!
SLC will fall and spend the next 68 years trying to regain the "glory days". I don't think so. Nobody wins forever and Longview has not won for 68 years. Why do you act as if you have won it many times over the past few years? News flash in 1997 you lost the game against Katy. Stop bringing it up. You guys talk about that game as if you won it.

[drgnbkr]

SLC will fall and spend the next 68 years trying to regain the "glory days". I don't think so. Nobody wins forever and Longview has not won for 68 years. Why do you act as if you have won it many times over the past few years? News flash in 1997 you lost the game against Katy. Stop bringing it up. You guys talk about that game as if you won it.

They can't beat Lufkin & it drives them crazy..geve em a break... ;)

[myround0]

They can't beat Lufkin & it drives them crazy..geve em a break... ;)


Guess what...Katy couldn't beat Lufkin either...but they managed to beat you guys, so it is not the end of the world losing to a powerhouse like Lufkin...more food for thought...Tyler Lee Lost to Longview, Lufkin and Euless Trintiy, didn't stop them from grabbing some hardware...Losing to Lufkin isn't always a bad thing, they have a great pool of talent and a really good coach, sounds a lot like the recipe we have in Longview...

[drgnbkr]

Guess what...Katy couldn't beat Lufkin either...but they managed to beat you guys, so it is not the end of the world losing to a powerhouse like Lufkin...more food for thought...Tyler Lee Lost to Longview, Lufkin and Euless Trintiy, didn't stop them from grabbing some hardware...Losing to Lufkin isn't always a bad thing, they have a great pool of talent and a really good coach, sounds a lot like the recipe we have in Longview...

How can you be in Wichita Falls & Longview at the same time?

[dragonfootballfan]

Guess what...Katy couldn't beat Lufkin either...but they managed to beat you guys, so it is not the end of the world losing to a powerhouse like Lufkin...more food for thought...Tyler Lee Lost to Longview, Lufkin and Euless Trintiy, didn't stop them from grabbing some hardware...Losing to Lufkin isn't always a bad thing, they have a great pool of talent and a really good coach, sounds a lot like the recipe we have in Longview...
Katy beat Carroll once in 2003 in the championship game. Longview has lost nine straight times. It is not the same thing.

[BigArab]

I believe 5-A started in the 80's? Maybe the 70's...Anyway, when you beat Lufkin..get back to us....

Wow...STILL using that same old comeback. You know, Longview playing Lufkin dates back even further than these past 9 games. IMAGINE THAT!

Currently, Longview leads the series.

Make the playoffs 30 times in your schools history, and then come back and talk.... :rolleyes:

[dragonfootballfan]

Wow...STILL using that same old comeback. You know, Longview playing Lufkin dates back even further than these past 9 games. IMAGINE THAT!

Currently, Longview leads the series.

Make the playoffs 30 times in your schools history, and then come back and talk.... :rolleyes:
First when you win 5 state championships or even two in 5A come back and talk.

Second Longview has played football since 1909 and has played 94 seasons as one season was cancelled and made the playoffs 30 times giving you about a 32% playoff per year percentage.

Carroll on the other hand has only played football since 1963 and has had 22 Playoff appearances for a percentage of about 54%.

Actually Lufkin leads the series with Longview with by one game.

[BigArab]

First when you win 5 state championships or even two in 5A come back and talk.

Second Longview has played football since 1909 and has played 94 seasons as one season was cancelled and made the playoffs 30 times giving you about a 32% playoff per year percentage.

Carroll on the other hand has only played football since 1963 and has had 22 Playoff appearances for a percentage of about 71%.

Actually Lufkin leads the series with Longview with by one game.

First off...Where do I get the Members-only jacket? sheesh :rolleyes:

Secondly, you might want to include the fact that until 20's there was no playoffs. Until the 40's, only one team from the district when the playoffs, until the 60's only 2 went to playoffs. You managed to enter at the time of a 3 team playoff system.

Thirdly, it was determined that that stat was wrong. Longview leads the series.

[dragonfootballfan]

First off...Where do I get the Members-only jacket? sheesh :rolleyes:

Secondly, you might want to include the fact that until 20's there was no playoffs. Until the 40's, only one team from the district when the playoffs, until the 60's only 2 went to playoffs. You managed to enter at the time of a 3 team playoff system.

Thirdly, it was determined that that stat was wrong. Longview leads the series.
I used LongviewLoboFootball.com as my source It says Longview has 30 wins and Lufkin has 30. That is Longview's site. You would think they wouldn't sell themselves short.

Link to Lufkin vs. Longview series (http://longviewlobofootball.com/Lobos/gamelogs/nondistrict/lufkin.html)

Second of all about your jacket comment. You are the one who brought up the 30 playoff appearances club. I just brought up the 5 State Championship or 2 5A championship club. Tell me which one you would rather be apart of.

[BigArab]

I used LongviewLoboFootball.com as my source It says Longview has 30 wins and Lufkin has 30. That is Longview's site. You would think they wouldn't sell themselves short.

Link to Lufkin vs. Longview series (http://longviewlobofootball.com/Lobos/gamelogs/nondistrict/lufkin.html)

Second of all about your jacket comment. You are the one who brought up the 30 playoff appearances club. I just brought up the 5 State Championship or 2 5A championship club. Tell me which one you would rather be apart of.

The guy who maintains that site has been continuing to uncover new history all the time. Pretty much before the 1937 game, all the information is difficult to come by. All time records against teams is not really completely known.

And for the record, Longview his been playing since the 1880's...its only been half-way recorded since 1909.

Get over yourself SLC.

[dragonfootballfan]

The guy who maintains that site has been continuing to uncover new history all the time. Pretty much before the 1937 game, all the information is difficult to come by. All time records against teams is not really completely known.

And for the record, Longview his been playing since the 1880's...its only been half-way recorded since 1909.

Get over yourself SLC.
You are the one that posted the all time series comment and now you are saying that it is not accurate when I prove you wrong. I don't buy that. Since the outcome of the other teams is unknown the official record is Longview 30 Lufkin 31.

[JoeC]

Man If I didn't know better, I'd swear that Southlake Carroll has already played and beat us. Oh, I get it, since SLC beat Lufkin this also means that they've beaten Longview. What kind of logic is that? I'll admit to one thing, you guys have an excellent coaching staff, because talent wise you're no match for us. In fact, you've probably dodged some serious bullets by not playing us . . . in other words thank God for Lufkin!! There is not one team in the state of Texas that we've played on more than one occasion that we have not managed to beat. The truth, we have never played you guys, so please stop mentioning Lufkin as though that means that you could absolutely beat us. It means no such thing!! Let's see, using your logic. Since we beat Tyler Lee and they won the State Championship that means that we're State Champions also . . . right? Maybe somebody should tell Spring Westfield that Longview is one up on them . . . let's see, except for the fact that "We Have Never Played Them." Oh yeah, make sure we remind all the good football programs out there that has failed to win the elusive one that their program "sucks"; and why, because some arrogant Southlake Carroll fans said so. Winning the state championship is great, but come on get real, there are probably several good football teams in the state of Texas that if given the opportunity to play you guys would kick your royal narcissistic keysters!! Do you really believe that winning the state Championship makes you the best for all times. Spread your wings and schedule some high profile programs predistrict. To tell the truth, you've been more than prudent in selecting opponents. Fortunately for you, the west is down, except Abilene. What happens when they have a resurgence? I know, you find some other weaker than yourself opponents to play. Here's a challenge, play Katy, West Monroe, Lufkin, Tulsa Union and us (LOBOS) predistric. Until then, continue to sit on your high horse and gloat.

[dragonsdaddy]

big a get your facts straight before spouting. there were only city and country champs before the 40's, then b thru 4a with one entrant per district until the late 70's or early 80's. when it went to d-1 and d-2 in early 90's, there were 3 per district. btw, was lview big city or country champs in 37? i assume big city.

[BigArab]

big a get your facts straight before spouting. there were only city and country champs before the 40's, then b thru 4a with one entrant per district until the late 70's or early 80's. when it went to d-1 and d-2 in early 90's, there were 3 per district. btw, was lview big city or country champs in 37? i assume big city.

Since they beat Wichita Falls, I'd assume big city as well.

[dragonsdaddy]

i remember reading that the country schools only got to play 3 po games and thus were regional champs only, so state was reserved for city schools only.

[BigArab]

i remember reading that the country schools only got to play 3 po games and thus were regional champs only, so state was reserved for city schools only.

Yeah, and keep in mind that the oil boom had happened around 1931, so the city was from from being a country town.

[stevefoxsc]

we have alot of talented teams this year and seeing some and watching slc i think Euless can take Slc along with long view just my oppinion, i would love to see long view move up to the number 2 spot cause out of any team in the state of texas long view has played and beaten more out of state teams than any one in Tx to my knowledge

[dragonsdaddy]

what game(s) have you seen to base your stance on? i assume for slc it is the slc-mlee game. as you may or may not understand, the team that beat mlee in week 0 is quite a bit different/ better than they were then. not that it matters a hill of beans, but you might want to instead reevaluate slc after this weeks televised game. you probably have seen et not at all and lview vs tlee.

[SLCDad]

Here are the top high schools (all divisions) ranked by wins over the last 19 years. Other schools of note in this thread are Longview #77 (69%), Lufkin #83 (68%), Trinity #89 (68%), Smithson Valley #134 (61%), REL #167 (62%). I'd say that any team that wins 60% of the time (including playoff games) over a long period is very good. The 20th year would be this year so the %'s could be a bit better. For example, SLC is 84.6% if this year is included.

.................................................. .........................Ave Playoff
School........................................Game s....Win %...Gms Per Yr
1 Southlake Carroll (222-41-1).............264......84.3%........3.9
2 Corpus Christi Calallen (216-35-1)......252......85.9%........3.3
3 Converse Judson (216-37-4).............257......84.8%........3.5
4 La Marque (214-44-2)......................260......82.7%........3.7
5 Celina (208-36-2)............................246......85.0%...... ..2.9
6 Austin/Eanes Westlake (206-43-3)......252......82.3%.......3.3
7 Refugio (205-46-4)..........................255......81.2%.......3 .4
8 Katy (202-47-0)..............................249......81.1%.... ...3.1
9 Arlington Lamar (189-44-2)...............235.......80.9%......2.4
10 Stephenville (188-53-2)..................243......77.8%.......2.8
11 Italy (185-47-1)............................233......79.6%...... .2.3
12 Valera Panther Creek (185-48-0)......233......79.4%.......2.3
13 West Orange-Stark (182-42-1)........225.......81.1%......1.8
14 Pilot Point (181-49-3).....................233......78.3%.......2.3
15 Gordon (180-42-2).........................224......80.8%......1.8
16 Highland Park (179-50-2).................231......77.9%......2.2
17 Sealy (179-50-0)...........................229.......78.2%.....2 .1
18 Sweetwater (176-52-2)..................230.......77.0%.....2.1
19 Newton (176-53-2)........................231.......76.6%.....2.2
20 Alto (175-53-0).............................228.......76.8%.... .2.0
21 Commerce (175-58-4)....................237.......74.7%.....2.5
22 Cuero (175-61-2)..........................238.......73.9%.....2. 5
23 Houston Yates (173-52-3)..............228.......76.5%.....2.0
24 Bartlett (173-57-3).......................233........74.9%.....2.3
25 Midland Lee (172-52-5)..................229.......76.2%.....2.1

[BigArab]

Great chart. Where did you get that?

[stevefoxsc]

im going off 2 thing's and strength of schedule im looking foward to the DR game depening on how you play there will determine how well you do

[SLCDad]

Great chart. Where did you get that?I started with information from Jerry's site and then calculated the winning %'s and play-off games myself. I assumed that every team played a 10 game regular season to get the average number of playoff games played. (That's not a perfect assumption but it should be close).

http://www.texasfootballratings.com/LeadersOverall(1-300).html

[baylordad]

The funny thing is that they get mad at Carroll for supposedly running up the score and then say the teams they play aren't any good. What is Carroll supposed to do?
If they do not want the score run up on them, they need to get better! You do not tell your 2nd or 3rd squads to not try to score.

[SLCDad]

SLC's 98% winning percentage and 6 playoff games per year in 5A has helped their all-time numbers. Before SLC moved up to 5A they had won 81.3% of their games which would put them around #6 on the list. They had averaged 3.5 playoff games per year prior to moving up to 5A.

[bleedgreen]

I couldnt agree more. They started running the clock in the 2nd at the ECA game friday nite. The freshman team was in before the half.. It was still 61-0.


As for the rest of it.. I thought the polls were crap? Why would anybody really care? I'm a bit surprised to see any Longview people worried about what a poll says. When pretty much nobody respects Longview anyway, why would anyone think a poll would be different?
Longview is like the Rodney Dangerfield of Tx HS football. :)
again, consider the source that this crap about polls is coming from---not all Longview people are worried about some stupid polls........and as for respect for Longview, Redneck, you of all people should respect us after the MANY a$$ whoopings that you have had from us, brother...........i used to think that you were joking when you make snide, little remarks towards us....but, after so many, i really think that you have a hard-on for our team--is this true??? are the "shlackings" that ECA has taken by us started to eat into that brain of yours??? c'mon brother---ride somebody else's jock for a while...you're getting a little too heavy...........you don't see me taking shots at that so-called football team of yours---if i did, it would be soooooo easy.....................

[the_great_state_of_TExas]

[QUOTE=JoeC]I don't believe anyone wants to schedule a game in East Texas.[QUOTE=JoeC]



Joe C -

I have spent way too much time in East Texas and can I safely say I agree with you on this point. Beautiful scenery with some very intriguing people.

Big Arab -

If we are to measure the success of a High School Football program by eventual success of their graduates you would have to give the edge to SLC. Given 98% of their students attend a college or university their graduates are commonly referred to by the graduates of many others(not all) schools as "Boss".

[implacable44]

and the school with the most 5a wins and championships is....................

[green wave]

ok joe c you make a point on the team not being the same team that ran off all those big victories and as far as coaching goes that probably was a huge part of it i was never a bero fan anyway he only threw when he had to and usally it was that stupid wr screen no a whole lot down field. but what ever you want to say we lost plain and simple.i been trying to keep a open mind when it comes to slc fans but its getting harder to do last year was last year and 5 years ago was 5 years ago can anybody talk about what is going on this season with 5a football and quit living in the past what both longview and slc has done before is great but right now it doesn't mean nothing.let try to se how everything plays out during this season and see where each stands week by week