My first look at the new Judson offense

[Biggems]

and I want to puke......

no pass protection. no run blocking. no cohesion. tons of confusion. sloppy penalties. no blitz pickups. ball carriers falling down at the slightest of contact. no explosiveness or sense of urgency by the players.

And that is just the offense.

Their Special teams is even worse. They cant kick, snap, or hold. Their kick coverage is a bit shaky, as is their kick return team.

I will say this.......that WR #1 is a stud. He is big and has some speed. He played one heck of a game tonight, until he was taken out by a cheap shot that the refs missed, cause they all were focused on the SV sack of the Judson QB.

The Judson D, except for a few lapses, was quite stout. They showed once again to be a solid group. Unfortunately they get little or no help from the offense and special teams.

That was without a doubt the worst exhibition of Judson football I have ever witnessed.

The kids look lost, they look confused, they look uninspired. No way should they look this way at home against their biggest District opponent, no way.........this loss was on the Rackley and the coaching staff......hell this season is on their heads....

The offense was a juggernaut for over 2 decades....it wasnt broke, but they fixed it anyway......and now the tire is flat.

ROCKET PRIDE

[Reaganrattler07]

Be thankful it's not as bad as Reagan's though......

[Mavs D End]

amen nvm












maverick pride

[Biggems]

I guess I was spoiled when I was in HS with Jerod and then more recently with Kyle Fox.....

I liked the run to the line, snap it fast and go, go, go.....

I am not about this patient, stand around, let the D get set crap....

[lonny23]

You can't blame us for being mad. We should be getting better performances.

[Biggems]

At least the frito pie was tasty......damn i miss HS game concession prices......i wish the pros would use concessions as cheap and tasty......instead you have to take out a loan to buy food at a pro game, and it tastes like something u leave in the toilet.

[implacable44]

it was that bad huh ? I wish I still lived closer to home so i could catch a game or two -- i just have to get updates from brent and my other buddies that still live back in san antone

[Mavs D End]

lol...wow some1 had a bad pro game experience
but so true. highschool food is like no other

[BandidoNB]

I usually follow New Braunfels High and since they had a bye week today, I decided to go watch the Judson Rockets play SV. I guess I cant seem to get away from watching a team lose as the Rockets went down on their home field. It was very uninspiring, but its not like my team would have done any better against the Smithson Valley Rangers. Good game anywayz Rockets! I know you guys will improve. Its the Rocket way of life.

[Mavs D End]

i love the new rocket sign tho
its pimp
its the roc sign with that J inside
its tite

[lonny23]

At least the frito pie was tasty......damn i miss HS game concession prices......i wish the pros would use concessions as cheap and tasty......instead you have to take out a loan to buy food at a pro game, and it tastes like something u leave in the toilet.
I don't know. I always TAKE a crap! :D

[Alamo_Mojo]

and I want to puke......

no pass protection. no run blocking. no cohesion. tons of confusion. sloppy penalties. no blitz pickups. ball carriers falling down at the slightest of contact. no explosiveness or sense of urgency by the players.

And that is just the offense.

Their Special teams is even worse. They cant kick, snap, or hold. Their kick coverage is a bit shaky, as is their kick return team.

I will say this.......that WR #1 is a stud. He is big and has some speed. He played one heck of a game tonight, until he was taken out by a cheap shot that the refs missed, cause they all were focused on the SV sack of the Judson QB.

The Judson D, except for a few lapses, was quite stout. They showed once again to be a solid group. Unfortunately they get little or no help from the offense and special teams.

That was without a doubt the worst exhibition of Judson football I have ever witnessed.

The kids look lost, they look confused, they look uninspired. No way should they look this way at home against their biggest District opponent, no way.........this loss was on the Rackley and the coaching staff......hell this season is on their heads....

The offense was a juggernaut for over 2 decades....it wasnt broke, but they fixed it anyway......and now the tire is flat.

ROCKET PRIDE


Sounds familiar......but with a different team :cool: Life after D.W will never be the same...I hear ya BRO!

[lonny23]

Sounds familiar......but with a different team :cool: Life after D.W will never be the same...I hear ya BRO!
Yeah, but they always could score after D.W. left. Rackley has a title and D.W. didn't always win titles early in his tenure.

They need to straighten this garbage out. I always liked the hollering and excitement from the players. It was great seeing a fast-break running offense. Go back to the old offense. PLEASE!!

[Reaganrattler07]

Yeah, but they always could score after D.W. left. Rackley has a title and D.W. didn't always win titles early in his tenure.

They need to straighten this garbage out. I always liked the hollering and excitement from the players. It was great seeing a fast-break running offense. Go back to the old offense. PLEASE!!

Heck, at least you all know what an offense looks like.....ours is just a pile of basic plays....

[rangerpride]

Everytime SV plays a Top opponent and either wins or plays them close (vs. Carroll in championship) fans say "We didn't play our best!' or "That was the worst I've seen our offense play" or "Our special temas played a horrible game."

The common thread is that SV's Defense has been "THAT GOOD" the past few years. The fumbles, blocked punts, blitzes, stuffing of the running game, etc. are not all the result of your teams "having on off night" but most of the time are caused by the SV defense.

SV coaches put their defensive players through a fumble recovery/strip drill circuit at least once a WEEK. This is not just another tackling circuit. It is working only on forcing and recovering fumbles. Special teams is worked on EVERY DAY at the beginning & middle of practices. SV has so much success in these area because of the importance the coaching staff places on these things through the amount of practice time devoted to them.

I could ALSO say "SV's offense had an off night" and played horrible (a lot of 3 & out drives, 2 INT's, line not picking up blitz, only one long clock contolling drive, etc.) but I respect the fact that Judson's stellar defense was a big CONTRIBUTOR to our offense's "off night." SV is usually capable of lighting it up on the scoreboard as well, but against a tough defense like Judson, the offense looks BAD!

I guess what I'm trying to say is the blame for losing to SV (or almost losing, like Southlake) should not always be placed on your team's poor offensive play, but instead on the disciplined and hard nosed defense and EFFORT on special teams that SV players show. Good offenses look ordinary against great defenses!!!

[Alamo_Mojo]

Yeah, but they always could score after D.W. left. Rackley has a title and D.W. didn't always win titles early in his tenure.

They need to straighten this garbage out. I always liked the hollering and excitement from the players. It was great seeing a fast-break running offense. Go back to the old offense. PLEASE!!

I have to agree Judson always seemed like sharks in a wild frenzy before, during, and after the game - jumping up and down, high fiving, kicking over the pylon before the game, and coaches whistling - A ROCKET TRADE-MARK! Pregame anticipation(at rocket stadium) was always good for 7 points for the Rockets before the ball was even kicked off.
Rackley won with "D.W.'s team"...

[LoneRocket]

I do not think so the senior group that won the title in 2002 were sophomores during DW's last year. The coaching staff was intact up until last year that was the major factor.

[jrp83]

SV's Defense had a stellar night. Not too many teams can shut down Judson the way they did tonight. Judson had been at least putting points on the board, even though it is apparent they have not grasped this new offense everyone is talking about. I'll give SV's D their props, but anyone who witnessed the game tonight will tell you that Judsons offensive line can't block very well. If they don't improve in that area, they could be in for some more rough games.

[Alamo_Mojo]

I do not think so the senior group that won the title in 2002 were sophomores during DW's last year. The coaching staff was intact up until last year that was the major factor.

Although they were sophomore's Jeter was still there.... the system was intact - D.W.'s system....

[nitro]

I dont really have a problem with the offense, it is the personell running the offense that is the problem. I am not saying they are bad players either. They have been running Jeters offense since they were in Pop Warner playing at Converse Park. They do not have the type of players you need to run this offense. I place the blame on the coaches. It almost looks like they are trying to force the kids to do things they just cant do. When Rackley first came to Judson he called the plays the first few games. They ran the shotgun and it didnt work. Next thing you know Jeter is calling the plays and things are back to normal. The poor kids look lost out there. Judson ran 61 plays tonight. A normal Judson team would run at least 80. This standing around and calling plays at the line of scrimmage sucks. Judson has beaten teams in the past that had far superior talent because of the tempo. Judson beat a much better Galena Park North Shore team years back because they got after them and ran plays so fast North Shore didnt know what hit them. I will admit, Jeters play calling was frustrating at times but he always knew what he wanted to do next. He always was thinking ahead. Coach Mangold needs to alter his offense to give the players he has a better chance to succeed. The offense he is running requires a very athletic quarterback with a good arm and a strong control of the offense. These QBs dont have that. Not taking anything away from them but they arent used to this offense and they arent built for this offense. The line isnt used to pass blocking. They are used to running to the line and smashing someone in the mouth play after play until they cant go anymore. Line up in the I formation and get after it Coach Rackley. Vince Young isnt your QB. If you can develop a QB in the future and get your players more familiar with this offense then that is great. But I dont think it is fair to these kids to see them looking so lost out there at times. Coach Rackley is a tremendous coach. Obviously winning isnt the most important and we all take this way to seriously at times. But if you are going to put forth the effort all week long at least give the kids a chance. Maybe bring the offense along slowly. Lastly, SV did a great job. They are a part of the reason Judson looked so bad. But honestly, Judson has only moved the ball consistenly against Nixon and Lee and that isnt saying much. I will be there again next week to cheer on my boys no matter what offense they run win or lose. Just my two cents.

[LoneRocket]

Although they were sophomore's Jeter was still there.... the system was intact - D.W.'s system....
The system which was developed by Coach Rutledge, Arnold, Parker, Rackley, Perez, Jeter, Gibbons and Dikes allowed position coaches to coach, where DW could focus on LB's and special teams and some defensive play calling, it was more of Judson’s system instead of Rutledge’s system. So as long as the nucleus remained in tack Judson has had success. This year that nucleus has been shaken and that why there are growing pains.

[nitro]

i must say the defense looks as good as ever. They are showing alot of emotion out there. Mark Soto is part of the reason for that along with Coach Belter. And Mark Soto is a DW student. It just seems like this offense is the "in thing" right now because Carroll is doing it. They have the personell and the experience to run that offense effectively. Judson has hard nosed football players that are used to running to the line and snapping the ball with no play changes and very little motion. Motion just slows down the play. Who knows, in 2 or 3 years Judson may have a stud QB and we may be saying how great it is to throw the ball around and have a D1 QB prospect. But until then give me to old Rockets.

[sendero]

Watching the game tonight I would say that the biggest difference was SV's defensive line got after it in the second half. Judson does have some athletes on the team though. #9 is a big man out there but they don't seem to even try to get the ball to him. Judson's passing game isn't nearly as bad as everyone has been talking about they made good passes in the first half and didn't make any mistakes. The QB's didn't have much time in the second half.

Maybe the prodigal qb is up and coming? I heard Quinney as one of the JV quarterbacks. A younger brother?

[Bucky]

Everytime SV plays a Top opponent and either wins or plays them close (vs. Carroll in championship) fans say "We didn't play our best!' or "That was the worst I've seen our offense play" or "Our special temas played a horrible game."

The common thread is that SV's Defense has been "THAT GOOD" the past few years. The fumbles, blocked punts, blitzes, stuffing of the running game, etc. are not all the result of your teams "having on off night" but most of the time are caused by the SV defense.

SV coaches put their defensive players through a fumble recovery/strip drill circuit at least once a WEEK. This is not just another tackling circuit. It is working only on forcing and recovering fumbles. Special teams is worked on EVERY DAY at the beginning & middle of practices. SV has so much success in these area because of the importance the coaching staff places on these things through the amount of practice time devoted to them.

I could ALSO say "SV's offense had an off night" and played horrible (a lot of 3 & out drives, 2 INT's, line not picking up blitz, only one long clock contolling drive, etc.) but I respect the fact that Judson's stellar defense was a big CONTRIBUTOR to our offense's "off night." SV is usually capable of lighting it up on the scoreboard as well, but against a tough defense like Judson, the offense looks BAD!

I guess what I'm trying to say is the blame for losing to SV (or almost losing, like Southlake) should not always be placed on your team's poor offensive play, but instead on the disciplined and hard nosed defense and EFFORT on special teams that SV players show. Good offenses look ordinary against great defenses!!!


Hey Ranger...i dont think anyone is trying to take anything away from SV in these posts. SV played a better game then Judson and deserved to win that game. I hate to admit that but its true. That is exactly what I was afriad would happen. I knew SV would be good enough to beat them. And with the "new and improved" offense I was affraid that SV would shut them down completely. The blocked punt was huge in that game. It seemed like the punter took forever to get it off... Its almost like Mangold is reading all these posts and trying to prove us wrong.. i would bet that Judson and SV could line up and play 10 more times and SV would win them all. I hate to say it boys..but Judson is no longer Judson!! When Jeter and Gibbens left so did their advantage. Wagner will be more like Judson then Judson here pretty quickly. There are more "old" Judson coaches at Wagner than at Judson. Judson should run the table but Im not counting on it. Too many possible distractions. The Judson coaches have their work cut out for them but Im sure they are up to the challange!!

[lonny23]

Everytime SV plays a Top opponent and either wins or plays them close (vs. Carroll in championship) fans say "We didn't play our best!' or "That was the worst I've seen our offense play" or "Our special temas played a horrible game."

The common thread is that SV's Defense has been "THAT GOOD" the past few years. The fumbles, blocked punts, blitzes, stuffing of the running game, etc. are not all the result of your teams "having on off night" but most of the time are caused by the SV defense.

SV coaches put their defensive players through a fumble recovery/strip drill circuit at least once a WEEK. This is not just another tackling circuit. It is working only on forcing and recovering fumbles. Special teams is worked on EVERY DAY at the beginning & middle of practices. SV has so much success in these area because of the importance the coaching staff places on these things through the amount of practice time devoted to them.

I could ALSO say "SV's offense had an off night" and played horrible (a lot of 3 & out drives, 2 INT's, line not picking up blitz, only one long clock contolling drive, etc.) but I respect the fact that Judson's stellar defense was a big CONTRIBUTOR to our offense's "off night." SV is usually capable of lighting it up on the scoreboard as well, but against a tough defense like Judson, the offense looks BAD!

I guess what I'm trying to say is the blame for losing to SV (or almost losing, like Southlake) should not always be placed on your team's poor offensive play, but instead on the disciplined and hard nosed defense and EFFORT on special teams that SV players show. Good offenses look ordinary against great defenses!!!
Come off the soapbox. None of us refused to give you guys credit. The way ya'll act, I'd like to see you lose.

You're a veteran and have been around a while. We've complained about the offense all year, but we're more apt to do it when they play a big game or lose. Sure, we all know you have a good defense and I said it would be low-scoring. In spite of Judson playing lesser defenses this year in some games, they still haven't done what they needed to do on offense.

[rangerpride]

Come off the soapbox. None of us refused to give you guys credit. The way ya'll act, I'd like to see you lose.

You're a veteran and have been around a while. We've complained about the offense all year, but we're more apt to do it when they play a big game or lose. Sure, we all know you have a good defense and I said it would be low-scoring. In spite of Judson playing lesser defenses this year in some games, they still haven't done what they needed to do on offense.

Lonny,

You guys witness it firsthand too. When teams get shut down & lose to Judson, many people are quick to use the "off night" excuse on the offense. Even after SV lost on a last second FG in the finals, many Carroll fans were saying, "Chase Daniel had a horrible game, the offensive line & special teams played poorly, I've never seen a worse game played by the Carroll offense, etc." While they didn't deny SV's defense was good, they still tried to place the brunt of the blame on their own offense.

I'm sure you know what I'm talking about cuz Judson's D has been on par (and many years BETTER than) with SV's defense for YEARS.

You guys gave us a good ole fashioned 1st half butt-whoopin last year (I can't remember the last time the Rangers were down 30 at halftime). You were right to think "low scoring game."

Still, Judson fans who seriously believed the Rockets should have score 30+ points AGAIN tonight were living in a fantasy world, and realizing these are 2 defensive juggernauts. Your team is where we were last year; adjusting to a new offense, which is difficult to do vs teams with tough defenses (see our losses to Judson and Pflugerville last year).

Offense sells tickets, but defense wins championships. Your team will work out the kinks in time for the playoffs, and with the way their defense plays, I expcet them to make the semis AT LEAST in D1.

[Biggems]

rangerpride last night was my first live game this year....however, i have listened to the other games on radio and my bro went to the Laredo Nixon and Lee games. He told me how ignorant and disorganized the offense looked.

I wouldnt mind the offense as much if they would just run it faster. dont sit there at the line and run the play clock. run the play, get the call, line up in the gun and as quick as possible run the next play. BTW, from what I was hearing in the stands, #9 is big and fast, but has horrible hands. #1 is an awesome WR. He made some great catches, including our TD inbetween 2 defenders.....Too bad SV cheap shotted him in the 3rd and had to guys take out his legs.

It isnt just the offense either, cause if it was just an inept offense that would be somewhat ok.......but a Judson standard, excellent special teams, has gone totally south. Their special teams stink. They cant block, kick, snap, or hold. In both of their losses this year, special teams mishaps have played a major factor in the outcome.

like i said in the game post, SV won the game and I gave them props.

[Biggems]

Rangerpride......this is the first year with a totally new offensive philosophy, that the team had run for over 2 decades.....there are gonna be growing pains....and these pains will most easily be exposed against the better teams on their schedule.

I strongly believe that if they were using the same JR offense that was their bread and butter, that they would have won the game and scored close to 30 points doing so.

[Biggems]

another thing.......too many stupid, senseless penalties.

Judson needs to get its act together as a unit and stop the dumb false starts, offsides, and personal fouls. Now some of these offsides last night were kinda bogus....the refs were totally calling a onesided game. But nonetheless, the players need to adjust to how the game is being called and dont line up near the ball and dont jump before the ball is snapped. I think the false starts have to do with the slow offense they are using. There were a lot fewer false starts when they ran that quick paced offense. I feel if they speed up the offensive tempo a little bit, the false starts will subside.

As for the personal fouls...that is just a lack of discipline. They need to use there heads more out there. Be cerebral as well as athletic.

[rangerpride]

Biggems,
You are correct about the growing pains while learning a new offense. SV experienced that last year, losing to 2 teams with outstanding defenses (Judson & Pflugerville). However, the loss to Judson made something click offensively last year and we killed people offensively all the way to the state finals. Judson will be alright once they work out the kinks.

Again, not sure about the so called cheap shot to #1, but there were bad calls for both teams. When SV was called for pass interference on a 3rd & long in the 2nd half, your tackle wrapped up our defensive end and tackled him, laid on top of him, and would not let him up. If that is not holding, I don't know what is. It should've been off setting penalties, but instead Judson got the first down.

Overall, everyone who went to the game that I've talked to has said it was a defensive battle for both teams, but both teams played with pride and class. (No trash talking, etc.) Just another reason for SV fans to respect Judson even more. Heck, SV's program was originally designed to mimic the Judson teams of the 1980's. So there's always a high level of respect toward Judson from SV fans, coaches, and players. We are still trying to get where you guys have been many times.

[JC73]

Biggems,
You are correct about the growing pains while learning a new offense. SV experienced that last year, losing to 2 teams with outstanding defenses (Judson & Pflugerville). However, the loss to Judson made something click offensively last year and we killed people offensively all the way to the state finals. Judson will be alright once they work out the kinks.

Again, not sure about the so called cheap shot to #1, but there were bad calls for both teams. When SV was called for pass interference on a 3rd & long in the 2nd half, your tackle wrapped up our defensive end and tackled him, laid on top of him, and would not let him up. If that is not holding, I don't know what is. It should've been off setting penalties, but instead Judson got the first down.

Overall, everyone who went to the game that I've talked to has said it was a defensive battle for both teams, but both teams played with pride and class. (No trash talking, etc.) Just another reason for SV fans to respect Judson even more. Heck, SV's program was originally designed to mimic the Judson teams of the 1980's. So there's always a high level of respect toward Judson from SV fans, coaches, and players. We are still trying to get where you guys have been many times.

Yeah Biggems,
The cheap shot thing is getting old. SV rarely takes cheap shots. Also, the Judson fans seem to me to be too quick to give up on their new offense. You have to remember that SV does have a great defense . It came alive last night. The Rocket's will be just fine. If any body needs to fix their offense, it's SV. I'm certainly glad that we don't have to play that awesome run defense of yours any time soon. The Judson fans, in my opinion, were some of the best I have seen in a long time. They were friendly and very classy. The same goes for the team. Personal foul penalties are going to happen, especially in a close game between two hardnose teams. Kudos to both programs.

[Bucky]

i must say the defense looks as good as ever. They are showing alot of emotion out there. Mark Soto is part of the reason for that along with Coach Belter. And Mark Soto is a DW student. It just seems like this offense is the "in thing" right now because Carroll is doing it. They have the personell and the experience to run that offense effectively. Judson has hard nosed football players that are used to running to the line and snapping the ball with no play changes and very little motion. Motion just slows down the play. Who knows, in 2 or 3 years Judson may have a stud QB and we may be saying how great it is to throw the ball around and have a D1 QB prospect. But until then give me to old Rockets.


Are you serious? I dont think you can compare Belter to Gibbons when it comes to dline coaching. Ill bet if you asked the players they would tell you the same thing. As for Soto..Im not that impressed with him..I think the LB's play was a lot better with Rackley coaching them. This years team has 2 very athletic/talented players..where as Rackley made players out of the likes of Carley, Gross, Vogelman, and Bell. ...Not impressed with Soto..not yet!! :rolleyes:

[TexasRed6x]

Judson's offense is just not getting it done and I do not see it happening this year. The o-line is in a word terrible and SV did not have anything to do with it because it has been happening all year. SV did show more nmajor weaknesses and thay got the kids on the o-line to just stop trying and that is another problem. It became very noticable that that "1 kid just might be thier total offense and if he is out mark my words they will not make the playoffs this year.




"CURSE OF THE SPURS"

[Bucky]

Just a thought..Even if Judsons Defense was the best in the state..no.. in the world..Eventually they are gonna give up a big play. There offense is that bad. 3 and out every series is gonna take a toll on a defense. I really wish they could change the name...I watched it on Friday and its not the same!! Maybe they can call themselves Converse High School..'cause they aint playing like Judson. I have read in one of these posts about the offensive line not being any good. I dont believe that for a second. Caudell and dimando are very good olinemen. Crockett is coming along well. There problem is the offense....you have a center and a few other linemen that bench close to 400 lbs each..run people over.

Im not gonna make any excuses..SV whipped Judsons tail..and made them like it. Judson offense stinks and if it doesnt get better they are gonna have a hard time making the playoffs.......and i thought they would make a run at the title this season.. :cool:

[lonny23]

Lonny,

You guys witness it firsthand too. When teams get shut down & lose to Judson, many people are quick to use the "off night" excuse on the offense. Even after SV lost on a last second FG in the finals, many Carroll fans were saying, "Chase Daniel had a horrible game, the offensive line & special teams played poorly, I've never seen a worse game played by the Carroll offense, etc." While they didn't deny SV's defense was good, they still tried to place the brunt of the blame on their own offense.

I'm sure you know what I'm talking about cuz Judson's D has been on par (and many years BETTER than) with SV's defense for YEARS.

You guys gave us a good ole fashioned 1st half butt-whoopin last year (I can't remember the last time the Rangers were down 30 at halftime). You were right to think "low scoring game."

Still, Judson fans who seriously believed the Rockets should have score 30+ points AGAIN tonight were living in a fantasy world, and realizing these are 2 defensive juggernauts. Your team is where we were last year; adjusting to a new offense, which is difficult to do vs teams with tough defenses (see our losses to Judson and Pflugerville last year).

Offense sells tickets, but defense wins championships. Your team will work out the kinks in time for the playoffs, and with the way their defense plays, I expcet them to make the semis AT LEAST in D1.
I have to agree with what you say and my hope is that we get the offense up and running. We have to have all the kinks out before the Clemens game, though.

[clemensbuff]

Hey Ranger...i dont think anyone is trying to take anything away from SV in these posts. SV played a better game then Judson and deserved to win that game. I hate to admit that but its true. That is exactly what I was afriad would happen. I knew SV would be good enough to beat them. And with the "new and improved" offense I was affraid that SV would shut them down completely. The blocked punt was huge in that game. It seemed like the punter took forever to get it off... Its almost like Mangold is reading all these posts and trying to prove us wrong.. i would bet that Judson and SV could line up and play 10 more times and SV would win them all. I hate to say it boys..but Judson is no longer Judson!! When Jeter and Gibbens left so did their advantage. Wagner will be more like Judson then Judson here pretty quickly. There are more "old" Judson coaches at Wagner than at Judson. Judson should run the table but Im not counting on it. Too many possible distractions. The Judson coaches have their work cut out for them but Im sure they are up to the challange!!

Bucky, if you new SV would be good enough to beat CJ than why did you pick Judson to win?

[Bucky]

Bucky, if you new SV would be good enough to beat CJ than why did you pick Judson to win?


Loyalty. I thought Midland was good enough to beat Judson also. Im a Judson fan..I knew last year that SV wasnt good enough to beat Judson but this year with all the new coaches and the new offense..I didnt have the confidence that Judson would beat them..i wanted them to win so I picked them. Just like I know Clemens wont be good enought to beat Judson this year..even with the new coaches and new offense..lol

[clemensbuff]

Loyalty. I thought Midland was good enough to beat Judson also. Im a Judson fan..I knew last year that SV wasnt good enough to beat Judson but this year with all the new coaches and the new offense..I didnt have the confidence that Judson would beat them..i wanted them to win so I picked them. Just like I know Clemens wont be good enought to beat Judson this year..even with the new coaches and new offense..lol

Bucky, you are so full of yourself! Clemens defense is every bit as good as Judson's defense this year. We have one of the best D-lines in the state and the secondary is very good! Our team is much better than last year at this point and we are improving every week even playing in 25-5a! Can you say the same for Judson?

[Bucky]

Bucky, you are so full of yourself! Clemens defense is every bit as good as Judson's defense this year. We have one of the best D-lines in the state and the secondary is very good! Our team is much better than last year at this point and we are improving every week even playing in 25-5a! Can you say the same for Judson?

Im not trying to offend you buff fan. Im just saying that Judson will beat Clemens in the playoffs if they get there! I dont think Clemens is that good! I dont think Judson is playing very good right now but with Rackley as their coach..they will continue to get better. I think SV would beat clemens by at least 2 TD's...just my 2 cents! and thats about all its worth!!

[bubbacoach]

Be careful Bucky. The Buffs did beat Jefferson this week. That just proves they are good.

[lonny23]

Be careful Bucky. The Buffs did beat Jefferson this week. That just proves they are good.
It just proves they have at least 5 guys who can walk without assistance! :p

[buffbacker]

It just proves they have at least 5 guys who can walk without assistance! :p
Don't know how trashing Clemens got into this topic. Buff's keep on winning. All the trash talk on this board makes me believe that some people are beginning to worry about how good you really might be. I have watched Clemens play since 1980. I believe this is your best defense ever. Offense has improved with each game. I think you are going to surprise a lot of people. Keep up the good work!!!

[mad_fan]

Don't know how trashing clemens got into this topic. Buff's keep on winning. All the trash talk on this board makes me believe that some people are beginning to worry about how good you really might be. I have watched Clemens play since 1980. I believe this is your best defence ever. Offence has improved with each game. I think you are going to surprise a lot of people. Keep up the good work!!!


Who Lonny, naw he aint that good. Dont flatter him. :p

[clemensbuff]

Im not trying to offend you buff fan. Im just saying that Judson will beat Clemens in the playoffs if they get there! I dont think Clemens is that good! I dont think Judson is playing very good right now but with Rackley as their coach..they will continue to get better. I think SV would beat clemens by at least 2 TD's...just my 2 cents! and thats about all its worth!!

So, if SV beats us by 2 TDs, doesn't that make Clemens even up with Judson???

If who gets to the playoffs, Clemens or Judson?

[clemensbuff]

Be careful Bucky. The Buffs did beat Jefferson this week. That just proves they are good.

Ya, and they only had 33 yards. That's only 2 more than Clemens had against Judson in the first round last year.

If I remember correctly, Nixon had way more than 33 yards on Judson this year! LOL And Lee had more than that too! Laugh even Louder

[clemensbuff]

It just proves they have at least 5 guys who can walk without assistance! :p

LOL Now that's funny!

Lonny, still keeping that 30 point margin over Roosevelt this week? If your Rockets are as good as you all seem to think, it shouldn't be that hard if those 7 or 8 starters are still out for them!

[bullrock]

No offense, but I haven't seen the new Judson offense yet. :confused:

[lonny23]

No offense, but I haven't seen the new Judson offense yet. :confused:
Yeah, you're going to have to get X-files on the case. It's somewhere between Big Foot and the Loch Ness Monster! :D

[lonny23]

Ya, and they only had 33 yards. That's only 2 more than Clemens had against Judson in the first round last year.

If I remember correctly, Nixon had way more than 33 yards on Judson this year! LOL And Lee had more than that too! Laugh even Louder
I'd put Nixon and Lee up against that Clemens schedule. Hey, Lee can beat Holmes and they beat East Central last year. Nixon won't beat the top SA teams, but they can play with Highlands and the other dredge in SA. Nixon got a lot of yards late after they fell way behind.

[lonny23]

Don't know how trashing Clemens got into this topic. Buff's keep on winning. All the trash talk on this board makes me believe that some people are beginning to worry about how good you really might be. I have watched Clemens play since 1980. I believe this is your best defense ever. Offense has improved with each game. I think you are going to surprise a lot of people. Keep up the good work!!!
It comes up when somebody justifies how good Clemens is based upon their schedule. I have no problems saying Clemens is real good, but I don't have any scheduling proof to back up my words.

If you look at power polls, you see many of them operate on the law of diminishing returns where blowouts start to lose their point value. That's true in football. Bad teams are bad and get blown out. You can feel certain that a 20 point win is a lot more impressive than a 10 point win, but a 50 point win isn't too much more impressive than a 30 point win. Clemens hasn't been tested enough to gauge where they're at. They might be world-beaters and I just don't know it right now. When they play San Marcos, we'll have a real good idea how good they can be this year. Clemens hasn't been tested and that can work in their favor or against them. It might mean they have a lot more to bring to the table, but it might mean they'll wilt in a fight.

[lonny23]

Here's the other thing I don't know about Clemens. Ferreira is a new coach. I knew Lehnhoff wouldn't win a title, but Ferreira might be a lot better big-game coach. We need to see how the Clemens defense does against a good team.

I don't just arbitrarily pick on Clemens, because what I say has been carried out each week in my "Thanks for Participating" thread. It might look crazy that I've left some teams in and eliminated others who have played good teams, but I have a method. When you play good teams, I know what you can do, but when you play chumps, I can't eliminate or promote you. That's why there are as many South Texas teams still in the final 91 as there are.

[clemensbuff]

I'd put Nixon and Lee up against that Clemens schedule. Hey, Lee can beat Holmes and they beat East Central last year. Nixon won't beat the top SA teams, but they can play with Highlands and the other dredge in SA. Nixon got a lot of yards late after they fell way behind.

Like I said I beleive that Nixon scored early on Judson's 1st team defense. I never said that Nixon couldn't play with a couple of the lower teams in SA. Beating EC last year would not be anything to brag about since Clemens stomped their guts out and like I've said here before we did not have a very good team last year! It was something like 35-0 at the half and EC didn't have a first down.

Just remember when Clemens scheduled Waco, Roosevelt, and Taylor they were all three good teams. We cannot do a thing about what district we are playing in other than go out and play! If you think that Clemens wouldn't like to still be in 26-5a then you are kidding yourself! Another district championship doesn't mean squat to any of the coaches or the players because we have had plenty of them the last 20+ years. Another way to put it is Clemens would rather play for the title than win either the Seguin or the SM game!!!

I have no doubt whatsoever that Judson's schedule has been tougher than ours and will continue to be. But facts are facts and they are only 1-2 against the three teams they played that are worth mentioning. And from what some of Judson's fans have posted here on this site it sounded like they got a little lucky to pull out the Pflugerville contest. That's not getting it done! Two of their three wins are at the hands of way lesser teams that are certainly no better than Taylor, Waco, or Roosevelt. I mention those three because they were the only three teams that we had a choice in playing....

[clemensbuff]

It comes up when somebody justifies how good Clemens is based upon their schedule. I have no problems saying Clemens is real good, but I don't have any scheduling proof to back up my words.

If you look at power polls, you see many of them operate on the law of diminishing returns where blowouts start to lose their point value. That's true in football. Bad teams are bad and get blown out. You can feel certain that a 20 point win is a lot more impressive than a 10 point win, but a 50 point win isn't too much more impressive than a 30 point win. Clemens hasn't been tested enough to gauge where they're at. They might be world-beaters and I just don't know it right now. When they play San Marcos, we'll have a real good idea how good they can be this year. Clemens hasn't been tested and that can work in their favor or against them. It might mean they have a lot more to bring to the table, but it might mean they'll wilt in a fight.


You make some really good, valid points on us not being tested yet. But I would think that the point spread that you are talking about would only be a valid argument when you take into consideration on who it came on. I would think a 50 point win over a good or even decent team is much more impressive than a 30 point win any day???

[bubbacoach]

Ya, and they only had 33 yards. That's only 2 more than Clemens had against Judson in the first round last year.

If I remember correctly, Nixon had way more than 33 yards on Judson this year! LOL And Lee had more than that too! Laugh even Louder

Nixon and Lee would both be in the top 4 teams in 25-5A. That is nothing against the top three in your district, but the fact still remains that you could put most good programs JV's against those guys at the bottom of your district.

[sendero]

If you think that Clemens wouldn't like to still be in 26-5a then you are kidding yourself! Another district championship doesn't mean squat to any of the coaches or the players because we have had plenty of them the last 20+ years. Another way to put it is Clemens would rather play for the title than win either the Seguin or the SM game!!!

I have no doubt whatsoever that Judson's schedule has been tougher than ours and will continue to be. But facts are facts and they are only 1-2 against the three teams they played that are worth mentioning. And from what some of Judson's fans have posted here on this site it sounded like they got a little lucky to pull out the Pflugerville contest. That's not getting it done! Two of their three wins are at the hands of way lesser teams that are certainly no better than Taylor, Waco, or Roosevelt. I mention those three because they were the only three teams that we had a choice in playing....

I think another area where the weak district hurts you is at the JV & Freshmen teams. Your lower classes are facing tougher competition by far from their own second teams than the opponents. Most of the schools in the 25-5 other than the big three can't field but one team for the JV & Freshmen.

Clemensbuff you make the comment that you wished you were back in the 26-5 which is probably true for the majority of the people that support Buff football but I remember Lehnoff was the one getting TV time about SV being placed in the 25-5. I think Buff football got better when he left coaching.

[rattlerbacker]

I think another area where the weak district hurts you is at the JV & Freshmen teams. Your lower classes are facing tougher competition by far from their own second teams than the opponents. Most of the schools in the 25-5 other than the big three can't field but one team for the JV & Freshmen.

Actually many of these teams provide better competition at the lower levels than at the varsity and suffer from kids not staying with the program up through varsity for whatever reason. For those schools that don't field as many teams, San Marcos hasn't really had a problem finding quality opponents such as Judson, Smithson Valley, Hays, etc.