Time to Revise State Top 10 Rankings

[toonman]

I think that many of the polls and rankings now need recalculating. My Top 10 are as follows :-

1). Euless Trinity
2). Longview
3). Southlake Carroll
4). Spring Westfield
5). Lufkin
6). Smithson Valley
7). Katy
8). Copperas Cove
9). North Shore
10). Dallas Carter

[Favpack]

I think that many of the polls and rankings now need recalculating. My Top 10 are as follows :-

1). Euless Trinity
2). Longview
3). Southlake Carroll
4). Spring Westfield
5). Lufkin
6). Smithson Valley
7). Katy
8). Copperas Cove
9). North Shore
10). Dallas Carter

Close - but here's my take:

1) Euless Trinity
2) Southlake Carroll
3) Spring Westfield
4) Longview
5) Lufkin
6) Katy (4, 5 and 6 are too close to call)
7) Smithson Valley
8) North Shore
9) Abilene High
10a) Copperas Cove
10b) Dallas Carter

I am right there with you on the the teams, just a bit different rankings.

[myround0]

So a win with your starters in the game in the fourth quarter over Tyler Lee makes you a number one ranked team...Keep Trinity on top for another three weeks remember Longview plays Lee soon and you can bet Longview will remove their starters against Lee...I just see what happen last night to Lee as Trinity running up the score on them...Nance was still in the game when that game was well past over...You can bet Mcgee could have played the entire game against ECA last night and had over 300 yards, I am not saying Trinity is not good, clearly they are, but I just question how good... The Lobos bring both Offense and Defense to the game...Tell you what, we will use Trinity and what they did last night not losing site of the fact they had a game on thier hands going into the 2nd half and also how they continued to play their starters to pound Lee, we will use that as a measuring stick and see what Longview does in their game with Tyler Lee...I truly think Longview might be the nation's best team when you look at how Springdale beat up on ECA and then you look at how Longview did it with their second and third teamers, while Springdale continued to play the entire game with their starters. ECA's Offense scored nothing on Longview's Defense, while they scored 7 on Springdale's D, ECA's defense gave up 35 to Springdale's starting unit, the entire game, while ECA's Defense gave up 31 (before the half) to Longview starters and 21 to the backup guys. Don't take this as a knock to Trinity again I say they have a very skilled program and they should be proud of their team, just like I am about the Longview Lobos.

[stinger]

MYROUND0...clearly you are not informed. Being at the game, I was able to get a first hand pictur. No, he did not play the entire game...he did not get every snap. Lineweaver started mixing players early in the 4th quarter. The second and third strings finished the games. If you knew better, you would know that Lineweaver tries to play EVERY player possible EVERY game The younger players are the future. This year is the result of that strategy. Do you match first string with first string? Even the younger players stoped REL...that is next year's team. It sounds like you are calling the game from Wichita Falls. Visit a TRINITY game and see what the REL coach...not us....is talking about. Again, he said TRINITY is the best team he has seen in twenty (that's 20) years. Oh yes, do you recall that when REL played TRINITY in the playoffs last year that REL kept their top players in the game when it was a done deal? Does the gate swing both ways? Be reasonable and give credit where it is due!

[myround0]

MYROUND0...clearly you are not informed. Being at the game, I was able to get a first hand pictur. No, he did not play the entire game...he did not get every snap. Lineweaver started mixing players early in the 4th quarter. The second and third strings finished the games. If you knew better, you would know that Lineweaver tries to play EVERY player possible EVERY game The younger players are the future. This year is the result of that strategy. Do you match first string with first string? Even the younger players stoped REL...that is next year's team. It sounds like you are calling the game from Wichita Falls. Visit a TRINITY game and see what the REL coach...not us....is talking about. Again, he said TRINITY is the best team he has seen in twenty (that's 20) years. Oh yes, do you recall that when REL played TRINITY in the playoffs last year that REL kept their top players in the game when it was a done deal? Does the gate swing both ways? Be reasonable and give credit where it is due!

Knew it was coming, because the truth hurts...Nance scored a touchdown in the fourth quarter and piled up over three hundred yards when the game was well past over. Say what you like, Nance was in the game in the fourth quarter, if you have something against Tyler Lee that is fine with me, but don't tell the world that you pounding a team you clearly had in a head lock from about midway through the third and say that makes you the state's best team...I defy you to say Nance was on the sidelines deep into the Fourth Quarter...Vondrell Mcgee was long sent to the showers when the fourth quarter rolled around for the Lobos, 154 yards on like 17 carries in just over two quarters of work...

[lonny23]

MYROUND0...clearly you are not informed. Being at the game, I was able to get a first hand pictur. No, he did not play the entire game...he did not get every snap. Lineweaver started mixing players early in the 4th quarter. The second and third strings finished the games. If you knew better, you would know that Lineweaver tries to play EVERY player possible EVERY game The younger players are the future. This year is the result of that strategy. Do you match first string with first string? Even the younger players stoped REL...that is next year's team. It sounds like you are calling the game from Wichita Falls. Visit a TRINITY game and see what the REL coach...not us....is talking about. Again, he said TRINITY is the best team he has seen in twenty (that's 20) years. Oh yes, do you recall that when REL played TRINITY in the playoffs last year that REL kept their top players in the game when it was a done deal? Does the gate swing both ways? Be reasonable and give credit where it is due!
You're wasting your time talking/reasoning with him. He doesn't let the truth or facts get in the way of his biases/angles. His posts have two purposes and they work hand in hand; Praise Longview and trash everybody else. Trinity very well might be the best team right now. That doesn't mean they win a title and part of the big win was Lee not being as good as advertised.

[Favpack]

Let's give Trinity props - they thrashed Lee at Rose - when's the last time that happened? Lee is no dog meat - they are defending D1 champs gang.

[myround0]

You're wasting your time talking/reasoning with him. He doesn't let the truth or facts get in the way of his biases/angles. His posts have two purposes and they work hand in hand; Praise Longview and trash everybody else. Trinity very well might be the best team right now. That doesn't mean they win a title and part of the big win was Lee not being as good as advertised.

Lonny with the Belly aching...The fact is Trinity is a good team I stated that...what is not a fact is Trinity being the best team in the state because they trashed Tyler Lee...Trinity played this game with their starters in the game well after this game was decided...That was what my post was stating...and who are you to critique me when all you post are about the Converse Judson Rockets, my bad you stayed in many east texas cities and you love them all, and you are a fair guy. Whatever, Judson lost a game an you don't claim them anymore...wow, a fair-weather fan.

[LUFPAN]

1). South Lake (till the lose they are still #1)
2). Longview (the most physically dominant team in the state)
3). Lufkin (its hard to beat a team you can't score on)
4). Euless (impressive win against Lee)
5). Spring Westfield
6). Smithson Valley
7). Katy
8). Copperas Cove
9). North Shore
10). Dallas Carter

[lonny23]

I'm going to do a top 10, but it's going to have a different twist than some of you guys.

1. Southlake Carroll until somebody shows they can beat them.
2. Lufkin because they play SLC real close.
3. Westfield because they played for the title and return talent.
4. Katy because they have the pedigree and started out hot.
5. Euless Trinity because they're good every year and better this year.
6. Copperas Cove because they beat Judson.
7. Judson because they have the pedigree and got to the semis last year.
8. Smithson Valley because they haven't beaten Judson.
9. Longview because they still haven't proven themselves in the playoffs.
10. North Shore because they only have the 1 great playoff run.

There are some other great teams out there, but this is the Top 10.

[lonny23]

Lonny with the Belly aching...The fact is Trinity is a good team I stated that...what is not a fact is Trinity being the best team in the state because they trashed Tyler Lee...Trinity played this game with their starters in the game well after this game was decided...That was what my post was stating...and who are you to critique me when all you post are about the Converse Judson Rockets, my bad you stayed in many east texas cities and you love them all, and you are a fair guy. Whatever, Judson lost a game an you don't claim them anymore...wow, a fair-weather fan.
Since when did I STOP claiming Judson? I haven't posted much in the last 3 weeks because I'm deployed and working a bunch of hours.

[myround0]

I'm going to do a top 10, but it's going to have a different twist than some of you guys.

1. Southlake Carroll until somebody shows they can beat them.
2. Lufkin because they play SLC real close.
3. Westfield because they played for the title and return talent.
4. Katy because they have the pedigree and started out hot.
5. Euless Trinity because they're good every year and better this year.
6. Copperas Cove because they beat Judson.
7. Judson because they have the pedigree and got to the semis last year.
8. Smithson Valley because they haven't beaten Judson.
9. Longview because they still haven't proven themselves in the playoffs.
10. North Shore because they only have the 1 great playoff run.

There are some other great teams out there, but this is the Top 10.

That right there stringer, tells you what kind of guy you have supporting your cause...no way would you post Judson over Longview...this is about this year and what teams have done to this point. Judson has a loss and he puts them over the Lobos who beat louisiana's number one team in West Monroe...I don't even know how to respond to the post other than the top five teams are clearly: SLC, Trinity, Westfield, Lufkin, Longview you can toss in Katy and then shake it all up and i would rather there be one state title run and one state champ but some of these teams will head to division 1, also add abilene and of those Seven could be the state champs, not Con-worse Judson Floppettes

[stinger]

Myrpund0...what was the score going into the fourth quarter...I know. When and how did Trinity score the "door slammin" touchdown. How many times did the Trinity defense stop REL dedep in the Trinity territory to keep dominance. I was sitting behind Nances parents..we talked about how Lineweaver was giving him a rest. Check the stats on some other running backs...when did they carry the ball. Inform me on how you can tell what was on the clock when they carried the ball by reading the paper. In the first two games, the second and third strings played half of each game. Witnessing the game does have some credibility. Try it sometime, you might be more plausible.

[FootballJunkie]

Close - but here's my take:

1) Euless Trinity
2) Southlake Carroll
3) Spring Westfield
4) Longview
5) Lufkin
6) Katy (4, 5 and 6 are too close to call)
7) Smithson Valley
8) North Shore
9) Abilene High
10a) Copperas Cove
10b) Dallas Carter

I am right there with you on the the teams, just a bit different rankings.

How did you come up with Abilene as #9 after struggling against a 4A team last week and barely holding on this week?? Other than that the rest look ok.

[STJL41]

My Picks: (I don't really feel the need to justify them, unless someone asks)

1. Southlake Carroll
2. Lufkin
3. Westfield
4. Euless Trinity
5. Katy
6. Longview
7. Copperas Cove
8. Converse Judson
9. Smithson Valley
10. North Shore

That right there stringer, tells you what kind of guy you have supporting your cause...no way would you post Judson over Longview...this is about this year and what teams have done to this point. Judson has a loss and he puts them over the Lobos who beat louisiana's number one team in West Monroe...I don't even know how to respond to the post other than the top five teams are clearly: SLC, Trinity, Westfield, Lufkin, Longview you can toss in Katy and then shake it all up and i would rather there be one state title run and one state champ but some of these teams will head to division 1, also add abilene and of those Seven could be the state champs, not Con-worse Judson Floppettes

I really do have to agree to a certain extent. Despite the fact that I have been less than impressed by Longview's playoff efforts, I can't, at this point, rank them behind a team who already has a loss to their name (Judson).

I was really liking the response until the "Con-worse Judson Floppettes" comment. Be an adult and leave the ad hom attacks at home.

[stinger]

Oh yes...is 22-14 going into the second half a game in your hands? Trinity stopped REL on the 1 yard line their first series of the second half. I am not a coach, but I do not think it is in the bag with an 8 point lead and REL scoring to end the first half. Again, being there is my proof. TRINITY is much better than #5 on this poll. They have soundly beaten quality teams. This pre-season was not a walk in the park. Trinity just has the guns to do the job. The proof will be in December.

[c-lisle]

I'm going to do a top 10, but it's going to have a different twist than some of you guys.

1. Southlake Carroll until somebody shows they can beat them.
2. Lufkin because they play SLC real close.
3. Westfield because they played for the title and return talent.
4. Katy because they have the pedigree and started out hot.
5. Euless Trinity because they're good every year and better this year.
6. Copperas Cove because they beat Judson.
7. Judson because they have the pedigree and got to the semis last year.
8. Smithson Valley because they haven't beaten Judson.
9. Longview because they still haven't proven themselves in the playoffs.
10. North Shore because they only have the 1 great playoff run.

There are some other great teams out there, but this is the Top 10.

It angers me to see that said about Longview....maybe its true though. Just b/c we don't 5 or 6 rings doesn't mean we don't have a great winning tradition and program. We play the best of the best every year in D2 and if you look at our history we have lose very close games that could've gone either way in the third round of the playoffs. maybe if we win state this year some of the naysayers will respect us. count on seeing the mean green late in the season.

[go_hawgs_04]

I highly agree, ET should be either #1 or #2, way underrated this year and has the most powerful offense ive seen in several years in texas football. like he said wait till december and suprise everyone just like we suprised all the players and fans at the rose stadium. yes ppl can say its too early in the season to say ET could win state but look at there last three games and who they played and what the score was...conversation over :D

[KT2000]

Rclisle, that's a tough deal you guys have. I believe Longview has an outstanding program, but as I'm sure you know, truly great programs are measured by championships and Longview needs to kick that door down similar to the way Tyler Lee did last year to finally get the recognition you are looking for. I'm watching the Lobos closely this year, and things look good so far.

[ktCarl]

Why are you guys thinkin' so well about Katy? I would put the 4 teams that played in Div 1 and Div 2 State Finals ahead of Katy especially if those teams are playing well so far.
But thanks anyway.

[lonny23]

It angers me to see that said about Longview....maybe its true though. Just b/c we don't 5 or 6 rings doesn't mean we don't have a great winning tradition and program. We play the best of the best every year in D2 and if you look at our history we have lose very close games that could've gone either way in the third round of the playoffs. maybe if we win state this year some of the naysayers will respect us. count on seeing the mean green late in the season.
I'd love to rank Longview higher, but I can't. Don't forget I used to live in Longview, my parents live there now, and I still root for them. Being ANYWHERE in my Top 10 means you can win state and I'll say there will be about 16-21 real strong teams this year who can make deep playoff runs.

It's very simple for me. If the team or teams that beat you in the past are still real good teams, I'm going to rank you below them. Lufkin just might beat Longview again this year. You don't ever know what a title team looks like until you see somebody play through the year to win a title. Even if you're better than previous title teams, that doesn't guarantee one.

This could be the best Longview team ever over the 1997 and 1975 (I think) teams and I can't comment on the 1937 title team. What has Longview done to make me rank them higher? If they could win 1 big game in the playoffs and get to the semis or title game, I would put them higher. West Monroe and Evangel are not what they were in the past and I could care less about those wins because they don't help beat Lufkin.

My other angle of thought is when you know that Longview can't beat Lufkin, you have to ask who else would beat Longview. It's foolish to think that Lufkin is the only team that might beat Longview.

[STJL41]

It angers me to see that said about Longview....maybe its true though. Just b/c we don't 5 or 6 rings doesn't mean we don't have a great winning tradition and program. We play the best of the best every year in D2 and if you look at our history we have lose very close games that could've gone either way in the third round of the playoffs. maybe if we win state this year some of the naysayers will respect us. count on seeing the mean green late in the season.

I would more than agree with you that Longview generally has a contending team, but the rings are really where it's at when you want to talk about powerhouses.

Phil Mickelson was continually listed as "The Best Player Never to Win a Major"...until he finally pulled off a win at the Masters last year (or that's what I think it was anyway). Longview isn't in quite as bad of shape, since they have one ring, in 1937, but that's a long time ago. They haven't been to the championship game since getting thrashed by Katy in 1997. And that was their only appearence in the 90's. Before you can really expect everyone to respect your program's ability to win consistently, they need a state title.


By the way, myround0, that is only ONE time between today and January 1, 1990. Compare that to your current sacrificial lamb (or so it would seem) Converse Judson, who has been 1 time since 2000 (which they won) and went 6 times during the 1990's (going 3-3, might I add). Sorry to let you down, but Judson gets it done in the playoffs, and Longview doesn't.

[lonny23]

I would more than agree with you that Longview generally has a contending team, but the rings are really where it's at when you want to talk about powerhouses.

Phil Mickelson was continually listed as "The Best Player Never to Win a Major"...until he finally pulled off a win at the Masters last year (or that's what I think it was anyway). Longview isn't in quite as bad of shape, since they have one ring, in 1937, but that's a long time ago. They haven't been to the championship game since getting thrashed by Katy in 1997. And that was their only appearence in the 90's. Before you can really expect everyone to respect your program's ability to win consistently, they need a state title.


By the way, myround0, that is only ONE time between today and January 1, 1990. Compare that to your current sacrificial lamb (or so it would seem) Converse Judson, who has been 1 time since 2000 (which they won) and went 6 times during the 1990's (going 3-3, might I add). Sorry to let you down, but Judson gets it done in the playoffs, and Longview doesn't.
You're thinking along the lines I'm thinking. My top 10 will never be the flavor of the moment or who has the most guys coming back. I look at titles, long runs, and a few wins over great teams.

As far as the Katy comments go, I see they're playing better this year than at this point in the past. I said the same thing about Judson all year last year. Trinity has looked real good and it's not crazy to think they might win the title since they routinely get to the semis.

My current Top 10 is not my final Top 10, but it's what I see now. If S Valley beats Judson, guess who drops down and who moves up. It really takes big game wins for me to move teams up very far in the rankings. Longview will not move up with wins until they play Lufkin in Round 3. They will move up if they keep winning and other teams lose, though.

[ktchamp97]

After this week, everyone (except Jay) will have played three games and we now have a much better idea of who is for real and who we overrated in the summer. The Top 10 will likely have the same cast of characters, but there will be some re-shufflling. Our Top 10 has held up really well, but beyond that, things will look very different next week. There's a point where we have to admit that we were off on a few teams coming into the season, and we have to give credit to the teams that are getting it done where it counts...we are at that point.

[lonny23]

After this week, everyone (except Jay) will have played three games and we now have a much better idea of who is for real and who we overrated in the summer. The Top 10 will likely have the same cast of characters, but there will be some re-shufflling. Our Top 10 has held up really well, but beyond that, things will look very different next week. There's a point where we have to admit that we were off on a few teams coming into the season, and we have to give credit to the teams that are getting it done where it counts...we are at that point.
That means we have in the Top 10:

SLC
Westfield
Judson
Cove
SV
Longview
Lufkin
Trinity
North Shore
Katy

and I'll predict you'll say in order:

SLC
Trinity
Westfield
Longview
Katy
Lufkin
S Valley
Cove
Judson
North Shore

[ktchamp97]

Lonny, you are close, but one team has earned their way in (I forgot to mention them) and we are with you on the Lufkin-Longview thing. Sorry Lobos, but you gotta get it done on the field.

[dragonfootballfan]

1. Carroll
2. Westfield
3. Katy
4. Longview
5. Trinity
6. North Shore
7. Lufkin
8. Smithson Valley
9. Copperas Cove
10. Judson

[rich_pack]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. Carroll- until beatin
2. Westfield- tough
3. Trinity- best team ever at the school I think
4. Lufkin- best D in state+Dez Bryant
5. Longview- best runningbacks
6. North Shore
7. Katy
8. Smithson Valley
9. Copperas Cove
10. Judson
some picked Carter, I am not impressed with them so far, they will win district and make playoffs and lose second round as usual. Probably the weakest district in football for them

[bleedgreen]

I would more than agree with you that Longview generally has a contending team, but the rings are really where it's at when you want to talk about powerhouses.

Phil Mickelson was continually listed as "The Best Player Never to Win a Major"...until he finally pulled off a win at the Masters last year (or that's what I think it was anyway). Longview isn't in quite as bad of shape, since they have one ring, in 1937, but that's a long time ago. They haven't been to the championship game since getting thrashed by Katy in 1997. And that was their only appearence in the 90's. Before you can really expect everyone to respect your program's ability to win consistently, they need a state title.


By the way, myround0, that is only ONE time between today and January 1, 1990. Compare that to your current sacrificial lamb (or so it would seem) Converse Judson, who has been 1 time since 2000 (which they won) and went 6 times during the 1990's (going 3-3, might I add). Sorry to let you down, but Judson gets it done in the playoffs, and Longview doesn't.
STJL----how did Judson do last season in the playoffs after being bragged on all season?? what is their record right now this season??? they are no better than us, nor are we better than they are.....sure, they have a rich past of state titles and championships......but, that's just it---the PAST!..stories for elderly people to sit around in barber shops and coffee houses to discuss on saturday mornings....let's just see what the season unfolds, then do a little talking......hey everybody.....our last title was in 1937!!!! since it's talked about so much!!! man, i get tired of that crap! come one, come all---we will play anybody, anytime, anywhere---doesn't make a damn to us...........

[lonny23]

STJL----how did Judson do last season in the playoffs after being bragged on all season?? what is their record right now this season??? they are no better than us, nor are we better than they are.....sure, they have a rich past of state titles and championships......but, that's just it---the PAST!..stories for elderly people to sit around in barber shops and coffee houses to discuss on saturday mornings....let's just see what the season unfolds, then do a little talking......hey everybody.....our last title was in 1937!!!! since it's talked about so much!!! man, i get tired of that crap! come one, come all---we will play anybody, anytime, anywhere---doesn't make a damn to us...........
The Old New York Rangers chant comes to mind. 1940! 1940! 1940! Then they went and won it all in 1994.

I'll give you a 1937! 1937! 1937! :p

Actually, I'm there with you and I don't like it being before my DAD was born.

[lonny23]

Lonny, you are close, but one team has earned their way in (I forgot to mention them) and we are with you on the Lufkin-Longview thing. Sorry Lobos, but you gotta get it done on the field.
I guess that means Abilene or Carter moves in and Judson or North Shore moves out.

[ktchamp97]

I guess that means Abilene or Carter moves in and Judson or North Shore moves out.

You are a smart man. I'll leave it to you to mull over who's in and who's out.

[STJL41]

STJL----how did Judson do last season in the playoffs after being bragged on all season?? what is their record right now this season??? they are no better than us, nor are we better than they are.....sure, they have a rich past of state titles and championships......but, that's just it---the PAST!..stories for elderly people to sit around in barber shops and coffee houses to discuss on saturday mornings....let's just see what the season unfolds, then do a little talking......hey everybody.....our last title was in 1937!!!! since it's talked about so much!!! man, i get tired of that crap! come one, come all---we will play anybody, anytime, anywhere---doesn't make a damn to us...........

You are confusing me presenting facts as me insulting the Longview football program. If you guys are due for another title this year, then I will sit back and watch as the Lobos get it done. And I will be happy for you when it is all over. I have my affilitations with certain high schools, but I am certainly not opposed to Longview doing well. However, you can't tell me that the past is worthless. I'm not dogging on your team because they haven't won a title in so long (Lord knows I held on to the Red Sox for a long time) but I don't think you can dismiss my argument as merely "stories for elderly people to sit around and barber shops and coffee houses to discuss on Saturday mornings." Respect is not handed out, it is earned. The best way to earn respect in Texas HS Football, though I'm sure you know this, is to win it all.

[Texas Bob]

I'm going to do a top 10, but it's going to have a different twist than some of you guys.

1. Southlake Carroll until somebody shows they can beat them.
2. Lufkin because they play SLC real close.
3. Westfield because they played for the title and return talent.
4. Katy because they have the pedigree and started out hot.
5. Euless Trinity because they're good every year and better this year.
6. Copperas Cove because they beat Judson.
7. Judson because they have the pedigree and got to the semis last year.
8. Smithson Valley because they haven't beaten Judson.
9. Longview because they still haven't proven themselves in the playoffs.
10. North Shore because they only have the 1 great playoff run.

There are some other great teams out there, but this is the Top 10.

I like your list and your reasoning. It will change, but this week with the information we have, it's right on.

[LPanther]

1) Euless Trinity
2) Longview
3) Katy
4) Westfield
5) SLC
6) Lufkin
7) Smithson Valley
8) Copperas Cove
9) GPNS
10)Abilene

Put it down in 3 INCH HEADLINES.....SLC will lose this year.

[RidgePride]

Put it down in 3 INCH HEADLINES.....SLC will lose this year.


Wow that is really going out on a limb considering the odds are heavily stacked against anyone to repeat.

I don't think southlake will win it all either

[drgnbkr]

Rclisle, that's a tough deal you guys have. I believe Longview has an outstanding program, but as I'm sure you know, truly great programs are measured by championships and Longview needs to kick that door down similar to the way Tyler Lee did last year to finally get the recognition you are looking for. I'm watching the Lobos closely this year, and things look good so far.

Same goes for Trinity...they need to win some hardware before they are #1.....

[DiamondJ2]

I don't believe there are many teams in 5A, with the exception of The Woodlands, that will play 3 of the 1st 5 games against teams ranked in the top 20 of the state as Judson is currently doing. Not many teams will play half of their 10 games against teams who will more than likely make the playoffs. This years 5A championship contenders are numerous throughout all regions of Texas football. It should make for some "spirited" observations and bantering for the next 3 months. So "let's get ready to rumble"!!!

[myround0]

I'd love to rank Longview higher, but I can't. Don't forget I used to live in Longview, my parents live there now, and I still root for them. Being ANYWHERE in my Top 10 means you can win state and I'll say there will be about 16-21 real strong teams this year who can make deep playoff runs.

It's very simple for me. If the team or teams that beat you in the past are still real good teams, I'm going to rank you below them. Lufkin just might beat Longview again this year. You don't ever know what a title team looks like until you see somebody play through the year to win a title. Even if you're better than previous title teams, that doesn't guarantee one.

This could be the best Longview team ever over the 1997 and 1975 (I think) teams and I can't comment on the 1937 title team. What has Longview done to make me rank them higher? If they could win 1 big game in the playoffs and get to the semis or title game, I would put them higher. West Monroe and Evangel are not what they were in the past and I could care less about those wins because they don't help beat Lufkin.

My other angle of thought is when you know that Longview can't beat Lufkin, you have to ask who else would beat Longview. It's foolish to think that Lufkin is the only team that might beat Longview.

It not Like Judson ever beat Lufkin yet you rank them over Longview...It is not like a lot of teams have beaten Lufkin, so your poitn is what...judson has wons some rings...Lufkin only has one just like Longview so why the bias....was life hard on you in Longview..did you wear the horn rimmed glasses...is this why you have a bone to pick with the city of Longview and ti's great football team...this season should be about this season and not about last year or the years before...get over it Lonny

[myround0]

You are confusing me presenting facts as me insulting the Longview football program. If you guys are due for another title this year, then I will sit back and watch as the Lobos get it done. And I will be happy for you when it is all over. I have my affilitations with certain high schools, but I am certainly not opposed to Longview doing well. However, you can't tell me that the past is worthless. I'm not dogging on your team because they haven't won a title in so long (Lord knows I held on to the Red Sox for a long time) but I don't think you can dismiss my argument as merely "stories for elderly people to sit around and barber shops and coffee houses to discuss on Saturday mornings." Respect is not handed out, it is earned. The best way to earn respect in Texas HS Football, though I'm sure you know this, is to win it all.

If the past is not worthless, then count our title in 1937 and stop ranting as if it doesn't exist...you talk out of both sides of your neck...you can't have it both ways, if the past is what you use to downplay Longview, then use the past to post our title...as for KT I am amazed that one who post rankings would say the actions of a team this season aren't the merits we use to rate a team...that is exactly what you stated when you said Longview Lufkin situation is one you are on board with and that the Lobos have to get it done this year to move past Lufkin when the Lobos beat a 4A state ranked Marshall team, and Lufkin struggled struggled mightly with Nac'doches last night...play your biases that is ok, but you can't hold back the accomplishemtns of this years team with that kind of rhetoric...you all amaze me when you splice sections of time to support your claims and then you cast aside those sames means you used as if they don't count when opthers use them..WOW, talk about, The Fox Guarding the Henhouse (KT)...That right there just told Lobo fans everything...there is no way Longview gets on top of his board until at least week 13

[lonny23]

If the past is not worthless, then count our title in 1937 and stop ranting as if it doesn't exist...you talk out of both sides of your neck...you can't have it both ways, if the past is what you use to downplay Longview, then use the past to post our title...as for KT I am amazed that one who post rankings would say the actions of a team this season aren't the merits we use to rate a team...that is exactly what you stated when you said Longview Lufkin situation is one you are on board with and that the Lobos have to get it done this year to move past Lufkin when the Lobos beat a 4A state ranked Marshall team, and Lufkin struggled struggled mightly with Nac'doches last night...play your biases that is ok, but you can't hold back the accomplishemtns of this years team with that kind of rhetoric...you all amaze me when you splice sections of time to support your claims and then you cast aside those sames means you used as if they don't count when opthers use them..WOW, talk about, The Fox Guarding the Henhouse (KT)...That right there just told Lobo fans everything...there is no way Longview gets on top of his board until at least week 13
I'll make this very easy for you. This thread started out as a hot team of the moment thread. You know the teams with the returning stars, hype, and early buzz. I came on here and said I'm making a top 10 based upon teams that have had good playoff runs recently and are still top teams. My rankings and obviously some other people's rankings are not based upon which team played better this week or last week, but who has more impressive wins against top teams. I think it's perfectly logical to rank Lufkin in front of Longview. It doesn't matter what Longview has coming back because Lufkin hasn't fallen off to the point where we can all agree that Longview is a clear favorite. I'd love to put the Lobos higher, but I'm going to keep saying what I've said all year and in the offseason: Longview has to beat Lufkin before I'll say they're better. That's assuming Lufkin doesn't go something like 7-3 and fall off a lot. At that point, I'll say the Lobos are better without having to beat Lufkin.

[ThEgReAtOnE]

1) Southlake Carroll
2) Spring Westfield
3) Euless Trinity
4) Katy
5) Longview
6) Lufkin
7) Northshore
8) Smithson Valley
9) Copperas Cove
10) Dallas Carter

cont'd...

11) Converse Judson
12) Leander
13) Garland
14) Round Rock McNeil
15) Abilene High
16) Irving MacArthur
17) Schertz Clemens
18) Plano
19) Pearland
20) Tyler John Tyler
21) South Grand Prarie
22) Irving Nimitz
23) Tyler Lee
24) Klein Forest
25) Beaumont West Brook
26) Pflugerville
27) Austin Westlake
28) A&M Consolidated
29) Mesquite
30) Galveston Ball

As in any other sport...Southlake Carroll is #1 until they're beaten!

[DragonFan]

Last year Trinity was seen as a clear cut lock to win the State Championship and did not. They have been impressive but beating a Midland Lee team that had to travel to Abilene and face SLC the first week then travel to the Metroplex the next week to face Trinity does not tell the true story of Trinity. Beating REL team that is not playing very well and had to travel to OHIO last week was expected. Trinity is good but to say they are the best in the state at this point of the season is a little premature.

SLC was off this week so how can they be downgraded when they still have not lost and have really not been tested.

Loses will make teams fall, not off weeks.

[lonny23]

Last year Trinity was seen as a clear cut lock to win the State Championship and did not. They have been impressive but beating a Midland Lee team that had to travel to Abilene and face SLC the first week then travel to the Metroplex the next week to face Trinity does not tell the true story of Trinity. Beating REL team that is not playing very well and had to travel to OHIO last week was expected. Trinity is good but to say they are the best in the state at this point of the season is a little premature.

SLC was off this week so how can they be downgraded when they still have not lost and have really not been tested.

Loses will make teams fall, not off weeks.
You know I got a good look at the teams when I was doing my thread about teams that won't win state and I found a few things:

Westfield has looked good, but was winning by the expected margin and playing chumps.

Katy has been good, but not as good as I expected.

SV and Judson have both won games by less than the expected margin.

Trinity is not as good as they seem.

Longview is probably winning by the right margin.

Lufkin has not been blowing guys away, but they're a great team.

SLC hasn't done anything special this year.

Abilene is doing what it takes to win games, but not dominate.

Cove seems to be getting better.

I'm not impressed with Carter yet.

[DragonFan]

In other words, Lonny has stated that it is too early to say who should fall out and who should be included. For most teams district play starts this coming weekend and there will be a lot of shuffling going on.

Carter beat a very down Lamar team and has not been all that impressive. The only thing I can say is that for the first time in a long time Arlington Lamar is 0-3 and has taken a free fall from being one of the states top programs...this year.

[myround0]

it amazes me how thin some people's skin can be yet they think it is ok to have and opinion and everyone think their way...don;t take it personal if someone doesn't share your viewpoint...I share the view point trinity is good maybe even great but I am consistent when I say beating Tyler Lee doesn't make you the number one team in the state...i am also consistent when I talk about Judson, Coppell and any other team, and I never stoop to personal attack...Lonny knows what I am talking about...it is this simiple do your home work and keep it to this season if you want to take it to the past then the past includes 1937, so infact, Lufkin has the same amount of state titles and Longview and Tyler Lee, infact Lobo fans can actually say what took you guys so long to get your first title...dang near 100 years...Look keep your post to the subject and not me , because my opinion is going to differ with most people as i would expect your opinion to be. Go you all and support your teams


Lobos '05...top five defense and top five offense playing back-up more than one full quarter of at least three of their first four games should payoff big time during the playoffs. No team ranked ahead of Longview can say that, neither can any team ahead of Longview can say they have beaten a number 1 ranked team like Longview did against West Monroe, Also state ranked Marshall, and Longview defense pitched a shutout against Evangel who scored 7 on Springdale...

[PackAttack2005]

Myround0, you and Rclisle need to get together and swap emails or something, are you sure you guys aren't twins? Talk about toot your own horn, (a train horn is more like it) you guys could not be more blinded by your obsession to elevate your Lobos and degregate all others. You sound so desperate, that's right, I remember now, it is all or nothing for you guys this year. Your always on the defensive about your Lobos. You have a great team this year and you and everyone else in Texas knows you are the odds on favorite to win it all. The trouble is you don't think you get the respect you want or think you deserve from the rest of us. You want to be considered on the same level as a Southlake, Katy, Spring Westfield, Smithson Valley or Lufkin ( you really don't like us very much), but the problem is that you have not achieved what these programs have done and you won't get that type of respect until you do.

The clock is ticking, what will you do if things don't work out this year? This is your best chance, you lose a ton of senior players this year , what about next year? Your Lobos are expected to take it all this year, if it doesn't happen would you consider that a failed season?

[CCBoy]

It angers me to see that said about Longview....maybe its true though. Just b/c we don't 5 or 6 rings doesn't mean we don't have a great winning tradition and program. We play the best of the best every year in D2 and if you look at our history we have lose very close games that could've gone either way in the third round of the playoffs. maybe if we win state this year some of the naysayers will respect us. count on seeing the mean green late in the season.
I agree with you, many great schools to many critics are not in contention if they don't win the big game in a reasonable amount of time or hadn't won it in a while, which is so crazy. Some programs are consistent in wins year in and year out, but no big game yet. Does that mean there is no tradition? They say, "They only get to a certain point in the playoffs and lose." In reality everybody only gets to a certain point and lose in the playoffs. Only one team wins it all every year. I bet if a team is always in contention every year that soon something will happen for them. I consider a program with tradition a team that is always there and is known throughout the state.

[ktchamp97]

If the past is not worthless, then count our title in 1937 and stop ranting as if it doesn't exist...you talk out of both sides of your neck...you can't have it both ways, if the past is what you use to downplay Longview, then use the past to post our title...as for KT I am amazed that one who post rankings would say the actions of a team this season aren't the merits we use to rate a team...that is exactly what you stated when you said Longview Lufkin situation is one you are on board with and that the Lobos have to get it done this year to move past Lufkin when the Lobos beat a 4A state ranked Marshall team, and Lufkin struggled struggled mightly with Nac'doches last night...play your biases that is ok, but you can't hold back the accomplishemtns of this years team with that kind of rhetoric...you all amaze me when you splice sections of time to support your claims and then you cast aside those sames means you used as if they don't count when opthers use them..WOW, talk about, The Fox Guarding the Henhouse (KT)...That right there just told Lobo fans everything...there is no way Longview gets on top of his board until at least week 13

myround0...

We really like both Lufkin and Longview and since the summer we have had them ranked right next to each other with Lufkin holding a slight advantage. At this point they are both undefeated, so we are waiting to see how the season plays out while sticking with our original rankings, because neither team has made a significant departure from how we thought they would play coming into the season. Is that really that much of an injustice? It's just one spot anyway, it's not like we're disrespecting Longview or anything like that. You guys have an awesome team and you've had a great start to the season.

[pack0808]

Here is my top 5

1. SLC sorry but nobody else is more deserving
2. Spring Westfield
3. Euless Trinity
4. Lufkin
5. Longview---- They could possibly be better then everybody ahead of them but i just cannot put them ahead of Lufkin yet because of some really really good reasons. I can think of 9 of them. LOL Seriously though, Longview is scary good this year and anybody that plays them is going to have absolute hell beating them.

[DragonFan]

The Longview faithfull are not unlike the Dragon Nation back in 2002 where we felt that we had a very good team that could be a State Champion. SLC was not very well known, (it was their first year in 5A), and everyone thought that they were just another wannabe. I remember the frustration of feeling that the others on this board were just too blinded by their own delusions of grander that they would not listen to what I condidered well thought out observations of a very special team. The trick is to be respectful of others and have the patients to let the season prove your points week by week. Back in 2002 it took many weeks of the Dragons blowing people out of games before the respect and, quite frankly, the interest in the Dragons outside of Southlake began to occur.

[PackAttack2005]

Southlake was a well respected program before they got to 5A, you may not have been respected by some in the 5A ranks, but you had respect as a very good football program Statewide. So is Longview, they were in the State championship game in 1997, they also have a long history of having a solid football program. They have all of my respect because we have played them for so long.

The older Lobo fans seem to understand because they have been there before and understand better. I think the younger Lobo fans are the one who are taking exception and don't think they are getting their just respect.

I honestly can say that the Lufkin program has gone through the same stuff and still does because we are in a small market for 5A teams in East Texas. I think Lufkin, Longview, Lee and JT will alway fight that battle as long as we reamain 5A and play the suburban schools from Houston and Dallas.

People just need to settle down and enjoy the season for what it is worth and not worry about what everyone else is doing.

[FbFan]

blah blah blah, heck everyone has an opinion and everyone is going to push their own team, lol. Bias is what we are and everyone knows it. Well here is my OPINION:

1. SLC(3-0)...Champs until the weekend before Xmas, thats how it is, face it
2. Euless Trinity(3-0)...Knocked off one Champ but not the best Champ
3. Westfield(x-0)...played in the Championship, could be 4
4. SV(x-0)...see #3, could be 3
5. Lufkin(3-0)...Dont get mad Lobo fans...WHO's Your Daddy
6. Longview(x-0)...Who hasnt beat up on Evangel...Beat Your Daddy
7. Katy(x-0)...Needs to be higher since they are the only team to beat SLC?
8. Cove(x-0)...So they beat Judson and they have talent, not bad
9. North Shore(x-0)...Why not
10. Carter(4-0)...My Darkhorse is looking like they have something going on

Well there it is, looks good to me especially since it looks like all 10 teams have a great chance of going undefeated in the regular season.

[pack0808]

Yeah i forgot to say Katy was a strong #6!! They have a great shot at the title this year also. Never count out Katy.

[toonman]

The Longview faithfull are not unlike the Dragon Nation back in 2002 where we felt that we had a very good team that could be a State Champion. SLC was not very well known, (it was their first year in 5A), and everyone thought that they were just another wannabe. I remember the frustration of feeling that the others on this board were just too blinded by their own delusions of grander that they would not listen to what I condidered well thought out observations of a very special team. The trick is to be respectful of others and have the patients to let the season prove your points week by week. Back in 2002 it took many weeks of the Dragons blowing people out of games before the respect and, quite frankly, the interest in the Dragons outside of Southlake began to occur.

Who are the patients - I hope they have recovered. I have the patience to wait until they have.

[jrp83]

My take is this, just about everybody has Cove in their top 10, and deservedly so, they are undefeated and look real good so far. Judson did lose to Cove and should at this point be ranked below them. But Judson lost to Cove by 1 pt, on Coves field, on a last second play, in a game that they missed two PAT's and had a FG blocked. That game could have gone either way. Judson and Cove are evenly matched teams in my opinion. I don't think an early loss to a top tier team should disqualify a team from the top ten. There are many undefeated teams at this point, but not all are top 10 worthy. Just the same, there are teams that have lost already that are capable of going deep in the playoffs. Judson may or may not lose again before the end of the season, but as of right now I agree with Lonny that they should be in the top 10 somewhere. One more thing before I step off my soapbox, SLC should remain #1 until they are beaten. Go Rockets!

[DragonNation]

ktCarl:

Why would you put teams ahead of Katy? How many of these so called great teams have you watched play?

The Dragons are an extremely sound team including the defense this season so your boys would have trouble winning against SLC but Katy seems very different this year to the last few years.

Maybe we will meet again to see who is the best of the early 2000's.

[FootballJunkie]

My take is this, just about everybody has Cove in their top 10, and deservedly so, they are undefeated and look real good so far. Judson did lose to Cove and should at this point be ranked below them. But Judson lost to Cove by 1 pt, on Coves field, on a last second play, in a game that they missed two PAT's and had a FG blocked. That game could have gone either way. Judson and Cove are evenly matched teams in my opinion. I don't think an early loss to a top tier team should disqualify a team from the top ten. There are many undefeated teams at this point, but not all are top 10 worthy. Just the same, there are teams that have lost already that are capable of going deep in the playoffs. Judson may or may not lose again before the end of the season, but as of right now I agree with Lonny that they should be in the top 10 somewhere. One more thing before I step off my soapbox, SLC should remain #1 until they are beaten. Go Rockets!
My opinion on why Judson is not in the top 10 is because they did lose to Cove and then although they beat Pville they were outplayed. If Judson beats SV on Sept 30th then it's academic. The Rockets will be on everyone's top 10. If they lose that game then I guess that means everyone or at least most people were right for leaving them off. In the end it will be the playoffs that will crown the champion and these polls won't really mean anything.

[myround0]

this conversation went South because I stated Longview was better than Trinity...Can I not have my opinion...I truly think Longview is better than Trinity, but I also didn't take any of the luster off of Trinity because I stated they are a great team, but not the best team in Texas...what is the problem...you people use titles and records and even history to down play Longview, although their ranking should be based on the merits of this season, but you prop up Trinity who has no state titles and Houston Westfield, and you still rank them high (hypocrites)...I am not mad at where you place those teams, but I am voicing my love for the Longview Lobos...don't get angry...You rank teams where you like, I am from longview born and raised, trust me, this would not be the first season I would tell whoever would listen that Longview is the state's best team...Although this may be the best team and coaching staff we have ever had, the talent has always been there, King may prove the be the missing ingredient.

[FootballJunkie]

this conversation went South because I stated Longview was better than Trinity...Can I not have my opinion...I truly think Longview is better than Trinity, but I also didn't take any of the luster off of Trinity because I stated they are a great team, but not the best team in Texas...what is the problem...you people use titles and records and even history to down play Longview, although their ranking should be based on the merits of this season, but you prop up Trinity who has no state titles and Houston Westfield, and you still rank them high (hypocrites)...I am not mad at where you place those teams, but I am voicing my love for the Longview Lobos...don't get angry...You rank teams where you like, I am from longview born and raised, trust me, this would not be the first season I would tell whoever would listen that Longview is the state's best team...Although this may be the best team and coaching staff we have ever had, the talent has always been there, King may prove the be the missing ingredient.
My question to you and anyone else who is upset about these rankings is what does it really matter. We have a playoff system and the champion will be crowned on the field and not the polls so why are you getting so worked up. If they are dead last in the polls but make the playoffs and win then all this will be for nothing. If they are the best team as you say then they will win in December!!!

[myround0]

My question to you and anyone else who is upset about these rankings is what does it really matter. We have a playoff system and the champion will be crowned on the field and not the polls so why are you getting so worked up. If they are dead last in the polls but make the playoffs and win then all this will be for nothing. If they are the best team as you say then they will win in December!!!


You are correct we do have a playoff system that will crown the champs...however we crown two champs and it is likely Longview and Trinity will never play each other...I see this as guys voicing their opinion and if Longview had three losses I would still find a way to post them inside the top ten...Some people have strong feeling about a victory over Tyler Lee as the end all to the top spot...others think the entire state of texas football is about Judson, in both cases that is incorrect. Some are also under the impression that to rank teams this year you have to use the entire history of a team to include what they have done last year, I think a teams merits of the current season is the way to go, either way you are correct. Rank Longview outside the top ten, who cares, we have a Playoff system that will decide the Champs and when the only team with a top five defense and a top five offense win the title, you have to ask yourself how do you have a job ranking state teams when you missed a team who has played two state runner-ups, one state champ and a texas playoff team and crushed them all 139-44, and 14 of those points came against the special teams (ECA Game) and 14 more came against the (Lobos defensive second team) second unit (Lake Highlands Game)...If the past is what you use then you have to ask yourself that question...I am not saying the Lobos are the State's best team, however, they are the state's best team right now...

[jrp83]

myround0, you could be right, or you could be wrong. Either way it's not for me to say. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. I do know that there are probably a few SLC fans that might question your opinion though.

[Trinityplayer]

myround0 you talk about Trinty beating it's chest and I agree some of our fans are. Then you go out and do the same thing. Bragging about how you guys beat Evangel. Who Hasn't. I remember last year when you guys bragged about "beating" Lufkin in a scrimmage. Only to lose to them in the playoffs again.

[nsmustang]

You guys make me feel good about Shore! If they get past the second round playoffs I would consider that successful this year but thanks for putting them in the top 10 any way. They're still my team, win or lose.....